[MOD] Realism:The Third Resurrection

[Nightravn]

I definitely like the nuclear changes but the question I have is do you require Uranium as a resource in order to produce the plutonium?

Also do you require sulfur and cotton in order to produce muskets?

 

[bcr1776]

I would like to know if it is possible to add collateral unit damage to bombarding part of the siege equipment attack. Siege equipment would hurt the units in the fortification when they were destroying city defenses. Siege equipment should also have the option to bombard units besides just defenses.

This highlights the difficulty of "Realism". If an army arrived outside your walls with enough siege artillery to do substantial damage to your walls the city fathers generally opened the gates and waited for you to move on so that they could revolt.

 

[bcr1776]

I wonder if the engine would support an offer of terms?

 

[bcr1776]

Also do you require sulfur and cotton in order to produce muskets?

No, you need wood and iron to produce muskets. You only need powder and wadding to fire them.

 

[bcr1776]

Speaking of wood.... that could be a tradable item to many parts of the planet, desert climes, Japan....Perhaps stands of tradeable timber could be on the map. You would not be so willing to chop those down!

 

[Nightravn]

No, you need wood and iron to produce muskets. You only need powder and wadding to fire them.

I understand that wood and iron are required to MAKE them in RL but I was asking in terms of the game. Are Sulfur and Cotton resources required in order to make the musket factory and is Uranium required for the Plutonium Refinery?

 

[bcr1776]

I understand that wood and iron are required to MAKE them in RL but I was asking in terms of the game. Are Sulfur and Cotton resources required in order to make the musket factory and is Uranium required for the Plutonium Refinery?

sorry, just a lame attempt at humor.
Cotton was so pervasive by the time muskets came on the scene it should not be a required resource. Gunpowder is a manufactured item, not a resource so perhaps we should require the components(?)

Charcoal, potassium nitrate and sulphur if my chemistry remains.

 

[bcr1776]

As charcoal and sulphur are common, perhaps a source of potassium nitrate (saltpeter) would be a resource choice.

 

[Nightravn]

no offense taken... and the reason I ask about those particular resoruces as they are already in the MOD through the "green MOD" which does require those resources to utilized gunpowder units. I am trying to figure out if they are also required in this MOD.

I hope they are as they would definitely add realism to the game.

 

[bcr1776]

easy enough to find out. Open world builder and see if they are available. No other reason for them to be there.

 

[Houman]

Interesting discussion.

As I told you I am not an expert in post-gunpowder era. I am aware that you would need several components in order to make gunpowder. However the production of a melee weapon such a sword or armor wasn't an easy task either.

You needed a blacksmith in order to melt down the iron or copper and work on a blade very hard. An armory for making leather, cloth and plates for a armor or helmet. You would need much more components than just a copper or iron in order to make Classical or medieval units.

So the thing is if we exaggerate the need for different types of components for a gunpowder unit, we should do the same for the pre-gunpowder units as well. However, sometimes the key lies in simplicity. Maybe we should stick to max 3 components for gunpowder. Musket and something else, whereby Musket is being produced from two different components (Which ones make suggestions please) but the components have to be common. AI is dumb enough.

Any suggestions?

thanks
Houman

 

[Nightravn]

Houman did you incorporate the GreenMOD in it's entirety? By which I mean in the green MOD in order to make any Gunpowder units you need Sulfur as a resource and I think cotton too but not sure on that. Are those requirements in this realism MOD also?

I take it by your comments that they are not so in that case if we were to include a requirement for Gunpowder units then I think ONE maybe TWO should be in order but no more. I like the Saltpeter suggestion as it is a key component for making it. I don't think we want to make it to difficult but it seems silly that the game requires iron or copper for some melee units but no resources for gunpowder.

I also think that having Uranium as a resource should be required in order to make plutonium. Another suggestion could be to make a steel factory, like the musket and plutonium, in oder to produce steel for higher tech units like infantry, tanks, and planes. As for requiring multiple resources for melee units I think that would be to restrictive but maybe requiring building a blacksmith could be a possibility though for these lower strength units I don't think we want to hamper them to much.

 

[Houman]

@Nightravn,

No, Kristin only incorporated the new ressources in there. But I had a look on the Greenmod 2.1 files.

You are right a lot of things do not make sense. First of all. Most Gunpowder Units do not require any resources. Neither in Realism 0.64 nor in GreenMod. This is very unrealistic and I will change it for the next version.

*Note to myself* It would be nice, if I had the time to play the game once through by myself and I would have noticed it...*sigh*

GreenMod only requires Sulphur for Gunpowder but no Musket. (Again it requires nothing for Rifleman, weird)

We have no Saltpeter resource at this point.

I think it would be nice to require less resources for lower units and later in game you would need more resources for high-end units.

What do you guys suggest?

Maybe only Musket for early Gunpowder Units:
Musketman, French_Musteer

Charcoal + Musket for middle Gun Units:
Rifleman, English_Redcoat

Charcoal + Musket + Sulphur for highend Gun Units:
Mobile, Bazooka and Spec

Tanks:
MarkV --> Iron
Tank, German_Panzer --> Oil + Iron
Modern Tank --> Oil + Iron + Sulphur

Grenadier:
Grenadier --> Sulphur + Copper

Gunship:
Helicoper --> Iron + Oil

etc etc

Please help me out. I have very busy with other stuff. Otherwise we can't keep the release date.

Thanks
Houman

 

[Houman]

@Blue Blue

I just compared Caravel to Galley, I don't find the limitation that makes Caravel not being a transporter. Dooes anyonw knows the bit of code?

Thanks
Houman

 

[Lachlan]

You can have 2 ressources max for an unit

 

[Superfly]

@Houmann

I've loooked into the CIV4Unitinfo file, it seems to be the line in the caravel descripsion, that say specialunit_people, that need to be modded the same way the galley is. I listed the 2 descriptions below:

Galley:
<SpecialCargo>NONE</SpecialCargo>

Caravel:
<SpecialCargo>SPECIALUNIT_PEOPLE</SpecialCargo>

I'm pretty sure that if you change the caravel specs, to match the galley specs, then it will be able to carry the same.

 

[Nightravn]

How bout something like this.......

Early Units- leave as is.

<Change Musket Resource to Gunpowder Resource. Requires Sulfur and/or Cotton (or make a new resource Saltpeter) to Build Gunpowder Refinery. >

Muskets Units- Gunpowder and Iron

<Need to Build Steel Factory which requires Iron>

Rifleman Units- Gunpowder and Steel.

Tanks- Gunpowder and Steel

<Armaments(or call it something else) Factory- Requires Gunpowder and Steel>

Modern Armor - Armaments and Oil
Mech Infantry - same
Fighter Planes- same

<Plutonium Refinery- Requires Uranium and Steel>

Nuclear Weapons- Plutonium

how are these suggestion?

Houman- BTW have you been able to look into to the artillery bombarding units or causing collateral damage to them when bombarding yet? If you can possibly point me in the right direction I can help with it. I know you are busy with the update so no worries if you haven't.

 

[Superfly]

@Houmann

I've loooked into the CIV4Unitinfo file, it seems to be the line in the caravel descripsion, that say specialunit_people, that need to be modded the same way the galley is. I listed the 2 descriptions below:

Galley:
<SpecialCargo>NONE</SpecialCargo>

Caravel:
<SpecialCargo>SPECIALUNIT_PEOPLE</SpecialCargo>

I'm pretty sure that if you change the caravel specs, to match the galley specs, then it will be able to carry the same.

I just tested it, and it works.

You should also change the amount of cargo, the caravel can carry. See line below

<iCargo>1</iCargo>

 

[Houman]

@SuperFly
Thanks I check it tomorrow.

@Nightravn
Your suggestions are nice, I will work on it then.

This is the siuation right now:

v0.70

Improvements:

- Update promotion&Traits v0.5 to 0.8 			(DONE)
- Implement Realism EarthMap 1.3.2 + 8 new Resources	(0 %) 
- Implement Realism Religious Mod			(DONE)
- Implement Nuclear Mod					(DONE)
- Unit Balancing					(50%) 
- Modified Map Generator				(DONE)	
		the desert % from 15 to 20
		the plains % from 15 to 35
		the jungle % from 80 to 60

Fixed Bugs:

- Caravel now transport units				(0 %) 
- Removing Musket Factory			       (0 %) 
- Adding Steel Factory (Needs Iron and Charcoal) (0 %)
- Adding Gunpowder factory (Needs Steel and Sulphur) (0 %)
- Adding Armaments factory ( Needs Gunpowder and  Aluminum) (0 %)
- Plutonium Refinery (Needs Uranium and Steel) (0 %)

ToDO List

- Improved City Razing 
- New Skins for some Units
- Replacing the Immortal by the Real Persian Immortal
- Improved City Bombardment (With Collateral Damage)
- Adding enhanced foreign advisor 
- Adding inquisitor unit
- Optional Regiments MOD
- Make Art/Interface/Buttons/TechTree/Zoroastrian dds
- Make Monastery dds for Zoroastrians

I need to have a closer look on Siege and bombardment. There is a bombardment thread somewhere though...

EDIT: Im afraid the Nuclear Mod has a bug. What can the screenshot mean?

Good night
Houman

 

[KGrevstad]

It's a lot of work, eh, Houman? I think you're doing a great job.

--Kristine