Monarch Training 2

[danz]

Eye, we need a worker factory + we can pop out a worker here and there when a city gets too big for its britches. Coventry will be good pump, but Nottingham really bugs me. There is so much tile overlap with York that we constantly have to swap tile ownership between the two cities, and that is taking too much time to do properly. I'd like to move Nottingham to the hilly island just to the East, and use Nottingham as a temporary worker/settler producer for the East while Coventry cranks out workers (and another settler or two) for our Western territories. As soon as the iron is connected, we need to upgrade our vet warrs to swords and head West. So it would help if our warrs started migrating toward Moscow ASAP, because the barracks is waiting for them there.

 

[Bede]

lurker's comment:

Planting the settler in the east where he stands will be a good first move. Nottingham can get along without York's second cow and mining the grass and one of the hills will give pretty good shield numbers, so build a barracks and train warriors there. It's a long way from the front line with Russia but makes good use of what you've got. Then when you get to Map Making build a harbor and make Nottingham a commerce center.

(IMNHO the build is way too loose for the landmass but you gotta play the hand as it's set up.)

 

[danz]

Bede, you're right, our spacing is too loose, the problem with Nottingham's competition for York's tiles is better resolved by improving more tiles than by moving Nottingham. The settler to the North can sit where he is, or go one more tile North. I guess we should be trying to create as many coastal towns as possible because of our seafaring bonuses (extra commerce + cheap harbors). What do you think about the following dotmap? All the new towns are coastal, but the inland tiles all get worked. Note that most of the cities sit on hills or tundra so tey don't waste good tiles, and the town closest to Nottingham to the SE will be able to work the hilly island. The southern-most town is on the barb camp because this will give it access to whales. I don't think we can grow any more than that, at least not in the East. We can follow a similar, coast-hungry pattern in the West as we advance on Russia. Thoughts?

 

[Bede]

I think it's a good plan.

What about the cattle herds and lake between Warwick, Canterbury and Coventry, anyway to make use of them?

 

[SesnOfWthr]

lurker's comment: I'm a bit confused,Bede. The only tiles that can't be worked are the lake and the mountain SW of it.

Why haven't you mad a priority of improving those cattle tiles? Very powerful squares that are being wasted.

Oh yeah, why oh why do you have a worker roading a mountain outside Cantebury? (unless there's iron there....)

 

[Bede]

lurker's comment: I'm a bit confused,Bede. The only tiles that can't be worked are the lake and the mountain SW of it.

Why haven't you mad a priority of improving those cattle tiles? Very powerful squares that are being wasted.

Oh yeah, why oh why do you have a worker roading a mountain outside Cantebury? (unless there's iron there....)

So am I. Didn't have the trifocals on when looking at the screenie. (Another hint to Sesn)

 

[danz]

So am I. Didn't have the trifocals on when looking at the screenie. (Another hint to Sesn)

All our workers are busy with unimproved tiles, but as soon as some manage to make it to the Center, they should start roading and mining all that grassland. I sent two in that direction from Nottingham and York... the first got sidetracked connecting horses (which appeared when we traded for the tech) and the third one started building a road on a tile that London and Warwich will be working instead of just walking to the cows directly. I simply can't walk workers across the map then they can spend their third movement point setting down on some nice grass. It's a tile that's going to be roaded soon, anyway, so might as well do it when it's "on the way"

And yes, the worker in the mountains started connecting iron as soon as he connected Canterbury to the road network. He's not building a datcha, I promise

 

[Keiji]

Looking good Danz, good call on moving Coventry to get it within range of the whales. I would have placed Warwick one tile W though. It doesn't make much difference though. Warwick can still use those two cows.

Boy oh boy, I can't wait to slaughter those Russians once we get the swordmen.

 

[Admiral Kutzov]

D. Richter (pikeman) -
danz - just played
Sir Clive - up
keiji - on deck
AK - confused
viper275

 

[danz]

Did Sir Clive check in? Maybe Keiji can jump in and Sir Clive can play when he comes back?

 

[Sir Clive]

Sorry I missed the call - for some reason I don't seem to be getting notification when the thread is updated - anyway I've got it and will try to play now.

Got it !!!!

 

[Sir Clive]

We have loads of money, all the tech we need to kill Russia, and good trade relations wit everyone else. Now we just need to settle the rest of this island, improve tiles, and build up military. I'm thinking we start a war in the next 10-20 turns. Thoughts?

Sounds good to me . I am going to try to settle expand and build and hopefully leave the keiji with sufficient resources to go to war.
Any new cities will be settled according to danz's last dot map whcih looks pretty good to me.

It's 23-45 here so not sure if I will finish all 10 turns tonight but it is a public holiday in the UK tomorrow and I don't have to get up for work so I will try my best !

 

[Sir Clive]

Hope these turns aren't too bad - had a few glasses of wine at luchtime and the
brain is a bit fuzzy

Pre turn check

Not quite sure why the dot map shows a settlement point only 2 tiles away from Nottingham
but you guys are generally playing at a higher level so I will settle there anyway .
General purpose this time round - build , expand, prepare for war !!

Hit Enter (gulp !!)

IT - York produces settler who will head south. Settler is due in 6 - we should be able to
pump out settlers quicker if we allow it to grow so set to a spearman due in 4.
Russians are building the Great Lighthouse.

750 BC (1) - York settler moves towards Danz's spot 2S 1W of York. Warrior to the north
climbs hill and spots 3 Hun galleys NE of the iron spot. Curragh in the NW spots yellow
border.

IT Nottingham worker-> worker,
Portugal are building Great Lighthouse

730 BC (2) - Workers road towards the north. Don't like roading hills this early by there
is no choice since there is otherwise noway through to the north of our island.
Found Newcastle. Set build to worker. Curragh in NW contacts Ottomans and gets Polytheism
for Iron Working + 460g.

IT - Apologise for being in Ottoman territory. Coventry worker->worker. Germany have Philosophy
and construction . We can get both of these for all our gold (less 30) and all out gpt (ie 560 + 17 gpt) .
I decide to do this since we have just given 460g to the ottomans so hopefully we can get some
of that back for one of the techs the need .
I've never played no research before so not sure if this was the right move but IMHO we do need
to keepup in tech. (hope this wasn't too ). Do the deal !!
Hell ! most I can get from Ottoman is 260 for Alphabet and the Wheel. Decide not .

710 BC (3) - Workers road to try to connect our cities.

IT 3 Barb horsies appear next to our settler in the south. We will be able to
settle next turn but we are going to get some gold stolen. Good job we haven't got any
anymore Wow the barbs are nasty in this game !!

690 BC (4) New settler heads towards Danz's red circle NE of Norwich. At least there aren't any barbs
near there ! Settle Suicide City next to the Barb horses on the coast SW of York

IT Alemmani horseman (2) and warrior (1) ransack Suicide city we lose 11 gold.
We still have very little military and no barracks. I start a barracks in Nottingham
but it won't be due for another 14 turns. Everyone has alphabet except the Ottomans so I
decide to sell it to them before someone else does . I get 120g

670 BC (5) MOve troops towards Suicide city. Workers road. Settler heads towards north .

IT More Alemmani ransack Suicide city . We lose about 50g in total . Need to get more military
ASAP !!

650 BC (6) Start irrigating from lake towards Coventry . I know it doesn't help in despotism
but I believe we will get the food bonus if we irrigate the cows. Excploring curragh discovers
uninhabited island due north of Newcastle.

IT No one we know has any techs we don't have. Germany and Ottoman have cash , no-one else
has much . We have nothing to sell to Germany. Sell The wheel , writing and mathematics to
Ottomans for all their gold (441) . If we didn't sell them , somebody else would have done.
Portuguese start on the Oracle

630 BC (7) Warrior destroys barb encampment east of Suicide City and gets 25g.

IT Nothing -

610 BC (8) Workers irrigate towards cows near coventry. Worker gets to Danz's dotmap spot
1 tile NE of the gold NE of warwick. Again only trades we can do would be for peanuts.
Dutch are building Great Lighthouse.

IT - Nothing

590 BC (9) Settle Liverpool. Set build to galley

IT - London Settler->swordsman (I think if we let it grow for a few turns we can pump out
settlers more quickly) . Get Forbidden Palace message - will let next player decide where that
should go York Settler->settler. Germans are building Statue of Zeus.

570 BC (10) Road completed to Newcastle.

Summary - Priority was to settle our lands , explore and build up military. First and second
went OK, third was not so good.

We have 2 settlers out in the field who should be able to settle in the next couple of turns,
we are also no longer under immediate threat from barbs (as far as I can see ) and we
are level on tech with Germany and ahead of all the others (as far as I can work out)

We have also discovered some uninhabited islands which we may be able to get to before
the AI.

Military is still very very weak - we need to get some troops built soon if we are going to
go for the Russians.

Screenshot and save to follow ..........

 

[Sir Clive]

AK1 Saved game 570 BC

 

[SesnOfWthr]

lurker's comment: In a no research variant, you'll find it very expensive to try to keep up with the tech leaders. You generally want to buy techs at third and fourth prices, if not even lower. The exception would be if you really need a particular tech, like IW or something. Also, you want to avoid giving gpt whenever possible, since all that does is fuel the ai's research rate. If you are going to give gpt, don't give it to the leaders, give it to the civs that are already behind. You don't want there to be a gap you can't close. Ideally, you'll remain 2-3 techs behind the leaders the entire game, but that won't really happen. 1 or 2 of the civs will shoot out ahead, more than likely. At that point, you will have to make a decision. Do you keep buying techs at exorbitant prices to avoid falling too far behind, or do you find a way to slow the civ down.... Another good tactic is to trade luxes/resources for the leaders' gpt, thus sapping their research budget.

$0.02

EDIT: If it matters to anyone, you guys seem to be one turn off somewhere. Clive should have started at 750bc on the inherited turn, and ended on 550bc.

 

[Sir Clive]

Makes a good deal of sense Sesn - I'm still learning I'm afraid

I would have loved to go out and the AI but we don't really
have any military. I therefore figured that I should make sure we didn't get too far behind in tech via trading (provided we could afford it) . Didn't think
about the more subtle way of slowing down the AI research (as I said , I
had a few glasses of wine at lunchtime and it is now 02-00

My bad

Revised Roster (hope this is OK AK - please correct if not since
you are the thread starter)

D. Richter (pikeman) -
danz -
Sir Clive - just played
keiji - up
AK - on deck
viper275

 

[Admiral Kutzov]

No problem, Sir Clive. My only thought is to gather the SoD at the chokepoint and go atfer Cathy after she's built the GL for us.

BTW, my trifocals haven't arrived yet, do we have iron in the homeland? Doh - just noticed London is building a sword. Never mind. What say we try to hook up the silks?

@sesn - thanks for the delurk. Anything else you want credit for...

 

[Keiji]

Got it!

Just wondering, do we really want to build three! more towns on the northern tip of our island. It seems a bit much to me. I would probably settle no more than just one more town there.

Edit: I see we're still way behind in infrastructure, so I'd say we really need a worker farm. Right now, Warwick seems like the best spot for that. I think I should be able to turn it into a 2 turn worker pump in my 10 turns, how does that sound?

 

[Bede]

lurker's comment:
Planning comment:

GOMOTG commentary in dark red

Not quite sure why the dot map shows a settlement point only 2 tiles away from Nottingham but you guys are generally playing at a higher level so I will settle there anyway .

This is an island, space is at a premium, the English get a commerce bonus on the sea coast. You don't need more than 3-9 irrigatable tiles to support maximum populations.

IT - York produces settler who will head south. Settler is due in 6 - we should be able to pump out settlers quicker if we allow it to grow so set to a spearman due in 4.

With the two irrigated cows, the mined grasslands and the forests York should be a 4 turn factory between pop 4-6. I need to check the save to confirm. Pop 5-7 is much harder to manage.



Curragh in NW contacts Ottomans and gets Polytheism
for Iron Working + 460g.

We can get both of these for all our gold (less 30) and all out gpt (ie 560 + 17 gpt) I decide to do this since we have just given 460g to the ottomans so hopefully we can get some of that back for one of the techs the need .
Hell ! most I can get from Ottoman is 260 for Alphabet and the Wheel. Decide not .

Everyone has alphabet except the Ottomans so I
decide to sell it to them before someone else does . I get 120g
Sell The wheel , writing and mathematics to
Ottomans for all their gold (441) . If we didn't sell them , somebody else would have done

I generally concur with Sesn's comments on tech trading strategy but will add my own:

1) Right now and until the discovery of Printing Press and Navigation the English know more people than anybody else. Use that to your advantage. Open embassies with everybody so you can see whom they do and don't know. Then broker between the unacquainted.
2) Payment terms depend on your objective for the relationship with the trading party. In general you want to take gpt from the leaders and pay it to the laggards.
3) Don't buy anything unless you have another party to the deal. That means at least one other nation with money or knowledge you want.
4) With adroit trading you will not fall behind
5) Trading luxes to the tech leaders to slow them down is a double-edged sword. It can increase the discovery rate even if you do it for gpt. I occasionally find it more effective to trade resources for gpt as then the AI will use whatever cash they have on hand to upgrade units.

Here endeth the lesson.

Overall a good job on the trading. I will counsel patience, though.

 

[Sir Clive]

Yet more good looking advice Bede.

I had completely forgotten about irrigation being effective through towns when they are on a hill.

There is currently a settler on Bede's southernmost yellow spot 2 tiles SE of
Warwick . Guess it might be sensible to settle there then.