Multiculturalism

If things are going so well in Canada, why does Quebec keep trying to seperate from the rest of the country? French + British hardly counts as multi-culturalism, anyway.

Quebec doesn't exactly care that much about seperation any more.It still does, but, currently, the PQ, the seperatist party, currently only has 30-something seats in the national assembly (Quebec Parliament)-its worst since 1970. Currently, no one is talking about seperation-the PQ has made it clear it has no plans for a referendum any time soon.

And Quebec isn't just french+british. Okay, maybe Herouxville, but Montreal, with half of Quebec's population, is pretty multicutural. At home, 72% speak french, 19% speak english and 13% another language (some people speak more than one language). About 50% percent have a canadian ethnic origin, including french canadian.

Where I live, everyone speaks english or french fluently, many as their only language. But next to no one's family has bee here for ever, and they all have another country.
 
And others say the same thing I do.

You simply ignore the obvious truth:

when you want to have a society which is cohesive, you need to have some sort of a bond that holds it together. The strongest of bonds is culture: values, traditions, way of life etc.

Multiculturalism removes this bond, because it's proponents don't think it is necessary. They believe people will stick together because of some vague sense of multicultural solidarity.

This is what is totally wrong, it is not based on anything, just on an irrational belief it will work.

And before you come up with Canada again, read this all over again and explain to me what is going to hold the society together if not the same culture. History shows, that states build on political ideas (like communism) tend to end in turmoil, which is caused by friction between the cultural groups.

I'm simply ignoring your entire post until you read up on the academic terms being used in this thread and their meanings. You grossly misunderstand them, and I am sick and tired of explaining them over and over but to no avail.

But I will say this. Canada is one of the most stable and prosperous democracies on this planet. Multiculturalism does not stop this country from having unifying beliefs and values. If you did any research before opening moving your fingers across your keyboard, you would realise this. Multiculturalism does not divorce citizens from common ideals, values, beliefs, and goals.
 
You are also ignoring a very large difference between Soviet Union and Canada:

Soviet Union oppressed all of its citizens. Why wouldn't a Latvian want independance so they could rule themselves, instead of being oppressed by a Georgian/Ukranian/Russian? In orthodox Russia, why wouldn't a muslim Chechnyan want independance?

Canada DOESNT oppress. It is free, and democratic (not that the two are 100% related). It also has seperation of Church and State. So in this circumstance, cultures can get along, and in fact DO. The most recent cultural conflicts in Canada is the Sri Lankans, where the newcomer Sri Lankans are being harrassed and called FOBs by the 2nd Generation Sri Lankans, and so the new generation ones just firebombed a 2nd generation one's house. But that stems not from multiculturalism, but in fact is is the same culture, and not even against culture but against recent immigrants.
 
Of all the people who are against multiculturalism, I have a few questions:

1. What is your culture?
2. Do you live in a city, or in a rural area?
3. Do all the people in your area have the same culture as you?
4. Is your culture the same as your country's?
5. Do you believe in any racist (Doesn't have to be negative) stereotypes?
1.white/Eruopean/Central European/Czech?
2.City
3.Enormous majority have same one
4.Yes
5.No, but I believe in different archeotypes

I am againist multiculturalism. I think it should work only in countries which have developing culture, which was made from more immigrants which are implenting their culture values to state. I should like Japanese, Indian, Syrian or Ukrainian people and their culture but its paintful for me see China towns and african ghettos in Europe and I realy dont want have it in my country. On university we have Syrian, Ukrainian and American teacher, on middle school we had Australian one and I like them, but I dont want have them in my country in numbers.
 
I am not going to get into a squabble over variants of liberalism.

That is not what is being discussed. If you do not like the idea of certain variants of liberalism, argue against multiculturalism from that vantage point; do not argue it's effectiveness.
If you had read carefully enough however you would have noticed an important distinction that Taylor makes when characterizing group rights which in fact makes them fairly compatible with your vision of ideal liberalism.


The fundamental principle of liberalism is the directive of individual freedom and rights, this is not my vision of ideal liberalism, it is ideal liberalism. Any argument that challenges this most basic principle of liberalism is not one I will entertain, so you have carelessly misconstrued my position if you thought I intended to squabble over "varients" of liberalism. This is not to say that liberalism is trivial to the argument of multiculturalism, on the contrary it is the fulcrum on which multiculturalism is debated. The concept of multiculturalism is the construct of liberal philosophy and is not at all recognized in illiberal societies.
I have read Taylor's theory carfully and encourage you to do the same. He makes it clear that the concept of multiculturalism is not compatable with the ideals of liberalism, he thus proposes the idea of "group rights" so that the aims or goals of ethnoculture minority groups can be recognized without restricting individual rights. The idea of group rights functions on the fixed belief that ethnoculture minority groups can claim rights against the larger establishment in order to reduce its vulnerability. However Taylor admits that some ethnoculture groups may claim rights against its own members, particularly the right to restrict individual choice in the name of cultural tradition or cultural "integrity" which violates individual rights. Futhurmore Taylor fails to consider that the larger liberal establishment is itself vulnerable to the rights and claims of the ethnoculture minority groups. A liberal theory of cultural minority groups can not accept such internal and external individual rights restrictions.

Goonie said:
One example: FIFA ruled that women playing soccer can be allowed to wear headscarves for religious reasons. The no head wear during game rule was designed to protect individual players from the dangers of headwear that could cause serious injury (i.e. strangulation) during games. Since headscarves did not pose this threat, and allowed a group to observe their religion, headscarves were deemed legal. Soccer bodies in Canada have followed suit. This is a reasonable accomodation of a culture that allows it's continued existence and prosperity while allowing that culture to integrate into society.

Yes, this a classic example of the failed concept of multiculturalism. There are many women in that religiousculture group who do not desire to wear the hijab, yet they are forced to do so. The religious claimants are exercising their cultural "group rights" to restrict individual choice which again, violates the liberal principle of individual rights. This is also an example of how vulnerable the liberal establishment is to the claims of illiberal "group rights." The only quality that can be seen as a positive process of integration in your example above is the fact that these Muslim women are playing in front of an audience that are both male and female which is inconceivable in countries that are predominantly Islamic. That my friend is an example of assimilation, not multiculturalism.

I asked you to elaborate on the guidelines or limits to cultural prosperity, and instead of answering the question you present an example which exposes the falliblity of multiculuralism.

Multiculturalism is a process of intergration. Integration does not equal assimilation or cultural homogeny.

Assimilaltion in liberal societies equates to the process of integration which (unlike multiculturalism) does not emphasize race or ethnic differences, but rather on equality.
 
Back
Top Bottom