My First Online Game
- Thread starter Copterman
- Start date
shpeka
Warlord
- Joined
- Oct 9, 2009
- Messages
- 184
I guess hooking up the marble would be the most sensible move at the moment. You haven't met anyone up north so you have room to expand there, just block Saladin as good as you can and adopt his religion. You are set for long years of peaceful expansion (that is - before you meet the rest of the world, who will hate your heathen beliefs).
I would not recommend rushing - chariots are not that great against protective archers. And with copper in the capital Saladin is sure to get a couple of spearmen as well.
Scout the area N of the marble - hopefully there will be seafood there.
Good luck with the game.
I would not recommend rushing - chariots are not that great against protective archers. And with copper in the capital Saladin is sure to get a couple of spearmen as well.
Scout the area N of the marble - hopefully there will be seafood there.
Good luck with the game.
learner gamer
King
- Joined
- Sep 4, 2009
- Messages
- 657
IMHO, Silu’s covered the main points very well as usual. My $0.02 is as follows:
Re: settling. I’d agree on getting at least one of the sites to the east first – after all, not only could it block Saladin but it would also mean that any subsequent attack could then strike what looks like Saladin’s capital first (i) giving him less time to whip defenders (ii) enabling faster pillaging of the copper, reducing his chances of producing spears and (iii) lessening the chances of you losing troops by having to take another city first. Perhaps it’s therefore worthwhile moving the warrior on the eastern hill towards the south to see if there are other food resources in the area besides pigs (which I agree with Silu, will likely get taken by Saladin's culture). That said, the more northern pig / marble will help block Saladin northwards – so, as has been noted by shpeka, scouting for seafood would therefore help there. Whether you settle both eastern sites before 1S of the fish (for the horses) depends on how much food lies in the fog IMHO.
As far as other city sites are concerned, I agree with Silu on 1S of the fish and NE of the clams. Although there’s an argument for settling on the grassland N, NE of the horses to grab the FP and the horses, this creates 6 tiles of overlap in the capital. By contrast, settling 1S of the fish loses only 4 tiles to the desert and gives you enough food to work the plains tiles. Admittedly, its production poor as has been noted by Leventis but, with the fish, pigs and horses, early production can be met by whipping IMHO.
By way of contrast, the two main benefits of settling on the grassland to grab the horses IMHO are (i) that you’d have some forests for immediate chopping (1S of the fish gives you just one forest in the 2nd ring of the BFC on the other hand) and (ii) you’d be able to place another city SE of the northernmost pigs, avoid overlap and block Saladin northwards (after one boder pop in each city) if you also settle pigs / marble. Now whilst an early forest as per (i) may sound appealing, I think its really only worthwhile if it will help speed up a rush - which I think settling like this argues against. Point (ii) meanwhile has much greater merit but, IMHO, you’re paying too high a price to settle inland amongst the spices. After all, even with the pigs and spices from a city SE of the pigs, I estimate you’ll need to farm 3 grassland tiles to work all the plains tiles (pre biology) – and although you can readily farm 1 of the spices pre civil service, they need calendar to maximise their benefit. By contrast, settling 1S of the fish means you can instead claim the FP by settling NE of the clams. To me, that city, with pigs, clams, spices, farmed FP (although you may want to cottage it early to generate commerce) and a lighthouse is a decent early GP farm (with enough food for 2 science specialists to leverage philosophical anyway). This has the advantage of giving you a city type (GP farm) that neither the capital nor 1S of the fish have enough food to give you IMHO.
Perhaps more controversially, the other city site that is worth settling IMHO is the tile SE of where the furs are highlighted...I note from the pic where you popped mining from a hut that there are fish 2S of that tile. After all, the extra happy after teching hunting will enable you to work more squares and / or deal with whip weariness a little better in your empire.
Now, onto the question of whether to rush or not. Normally, I’d suggest going for the chariot rush –they’re one of my fave units. However, on this occasion Saladin is protective as has been noted. IMHO, that makes a chariot rush less worthwhile. However, I’d still submit that the horses can be valuable after you settle the land by using horse archers...I’ve used them many times on monarch with great success. Yes, I know Saladin has copper and can produce spears but, if you grab one of the eastern sites Silu mentioned, that copper can be pillaged very rapidly. You could even use a spy post alphabet to destroy the mine.
Re: the settler. IMHO whipping the settler is the right thing to do, especially if you intend to grab some land to your east before Saladin gets there. If my maths is right, imperialistic means you’ll have about 16 or 17 overflow which means you can then either (i) invest the overflow into a settler (and further leverage imperialistic), switch back to a warrior next turn while you grow, and then finish the settler or (ii) simply use it to produce a warrior in one turn, saving you from having to switch production to a warrior in the capital. Meanwhile, any chopping presumably gets invested in settlers.
Re: research. Obviously it depends on what’s discovered in the fog to some degree but monuments will pop borders (which you need for the horses) and, if you settle the coastal sites, workboats will be needed to harvest the seafood. Perhaps mysticism > fishing or masonry, then on to pottery, writing or hunting (if you grab the furs) is the way to go?
Hope this helps. Look forward to seeing how it all goes.
Re: settling. I’d agree on getting at least one of the sites to the east first – after all, not only could it block Saladin but it would also mean that any subsequent attack could then strike what looks like Saladin’s capital first (i) giving him less time to whip defenders (ii) enabling faster pillaging of the copper, reducing his chances of producing spears and (iii) lessening the chances of you losing troops by having to take another city first. Perhaps it’s therefore worthwhile moving the warrior on the eastern hill towards the south to see if there are other food resources in the area besides pigs (which I agree with Silu, will likely get taken by Saladin's culture). That said, the more northern pig / marble will help block Saladin northwards – so, as has been noted by shpeka, scouting for seafood would therefore help there. Whether you settle both eastern sites before 1S of the fish (for the horses) depends on how much food lies in the fog IMHO.
As far as other city sites are concerned, I agree with Silu on 1S of the fish and NE of the clams. Although there’s an argument for settling on the grassland N, NE of the horses to grab the FP and the horses, this creates 6 tiles of overlap in the capital. By contrast, settling 1S of the fish loses only 4 tiles to the desert and gives you enough food to work the plains tiles. Admittedly, its production poor as has been noted by Leventis but, with the fish, pigs and horses, early production can be met by whipping IMHO.
By way of contrast, the two main benefits of settling on the grassland to grab the horses IMHO are (i) that you’d have some forests for immediate chopping (1S of the fish gives you just one forest in the 2nd ring of the BFC on the other hand) and (ii) you’d be able to place another city SE of the northernmost pigs, avoid overlap and block Saladin northwards (after one boder pop in each city) if you also settle pigs / marble. Now whilst an early forest as per (i) may sound appealing, I think its really only worthwhile if it will help speed up a rush - which I think settling like this argues against. Point (ii) meanwhile has much greater merit but, IMHO, you’re paying too high a price to settle inland amongst the spices. After all, even with the pigs and spices from a city SE of the pigs, I estimate you’ll need to farm 3 grassland tiles to work all the plains tiles (pre biology) – and although you can readily farm 1 of the spices pre civil service, they need calendar to maximise their benefit. By contrast, settling 1S of the fish means you can instead claim the FP by settling NE of the clams. To me, that city, with pigs, clams, spices, farmed FP (although you may want to cottage it early to generate commerce) and a lighthouse is a decent early GP farm (with enough food for 2 science specialists to leverage philosophical anyway). This has the advantage of giving you a city type (GP farm) that neither the capital nor 1S of the fish have enough food to give you IMHO.
Perhaps more controversially, the other city site that is worth settling IMHO is the tile SE of where the furs are highlighted...I note from the pic where you popped mining from a hut that there are fish 2S of that tile. After all, the extra happy after teching hunting will enable you to work more squares and / or deal with whip weariness a little better in your empire.
Now, onto the question of whether to rush or not. Normally, I’d suggest going for the chariot rush –they’re one of my fave units. However, on this occasion Saladin is protective as has been noted. IMHO, that makes a chariot rush less worthwhile. However, I’d still submit that the horses can be valuable after you settle the land by using horse archers...I’ve used them many times on monarch with great success. Yes, I know Saladin has copper and can produce spears but, if you grab one of the eastern sites Silu mentioned, that copper can be pillaged very rapidly. You could even use a spy post alphabet to destroy the mine.
Re: the settler. IMHO whipping the settler is the right thing to do, especially if you intend to grab some land to your east before Saladin gets there. If my maths is right, imperialistic means you’ll have about 16 or 17 overflow which means you can then either (i) invest the overflow into a settler (and further leverage imperialistic), switch back to a warrior next turn while you grow, and then finish the settler or (ii) simply use it to produce a warrior in one turn, saving you from having to switch production to a warrior in the capital. Meanwhile, any chopping presumably gets invested in settlers.
Re: research. Obviously it depends on what’s discovered in the fog to some degree but monuments will pop borders (which you need for the horses) and, if you settle the coastal sites, workboats will be needed to harvest the seafood. Perhaps mysticism > fishing or masonry, then on to pottery, writing or hunting (if you grab the furs) is the way to go?
Hope this helps. Look forward to seeing how it all goes.
Round 2 - 2840-1880 BC (25 turns)
I have a feeling you guys are gonna slam me for my next round. Here we go.
First, I decided to switch to slavery so I could WHIP my settler. I put the 17 overflow hammers into a settler before switching to a warrior to allow my city to grow.
I founded my second city near the southern pig. The pig is in my second ring but I thought it important to set this city up for future success rather than try and claim the pig right away. Besides, there's plenty of ham nearby.
My first time to play imperialistic. I must say it's a very nice trait. Chopping is stout.
Now that I have mysticism, I can build the monuments I will need to pin in Saladin.
Founded my third city and got a little lucky with the lion. Do you like my spot?
I was a turn or two away from chopping a forest in my capital when I had this happen. That really stinks. The very tile I was chopping.
Imperialism at its finest. I wonder if Saladin is totally pinned in or if he has land to his east.
This archer made it impossible to explore this area forcing me to found my fourth city on the hill NE of the clam.
There's a lot of land to my north. I hope Saladin isn't taking a settler up there.
And as planned, I found my 4th city NE of the clam.
And here's the map so far. Pumped about the gems. The land to the north is prime for cottaging.
Forgot to mention that I researched masonry and fishing after mysticism. I'm working on pottery and then writing.
Should I quit expanding for a little while? My science slider is getting low. Once I can build a few cottages, I hope that changes.
Thanks for your input.
I have a feeling you guys are gonna slam me for my next round. Here we go.
First, I decided to switch to slavery so I could WHIP my settler. I put the 17 overflow hammers into a settler before switching to a warrior to allow my city to grow.
I founded my second city near the southern pig. The pig is in my second ring but I thought it important to set this city up for future success rather than try and claim the pig right away. Besides, there's plenty of ham nearby.
My first time to play imperialistic. I must say it's a very nice trait. Chopping is stout.
Now that I have mysticism, I can build the monuments I will need to pin in Saladin.
Founded my third city and got a little lucky with the lion. Do you like my spot?
I was a turn or two away from chopping a forest in my capital when I had this happen. That really stinks. The very tile I was chopping.
Imperialism at its finest. I wonder if Saladin is totally pinned in or if he has land to his east.
This archer made it impossible to explore this area forcing me to found my fourth city on the hill NE of the clam.
There's a lot of land to my north. I hope Saladin isn't taking a settler up there.
And as planned, I found my 4th city NE of the clam.
And here's the map so far. Pumped about the gems. The land to the north is prime for cottaging.
Forgot to mention that I researched masonry and fishing after mysticism. I'm working on pottery and then writing.
Should I quit expanding for a little while? My science slider is getting low. Once I can build a few cottages, I hope that changes.
Thanks for your input.
Leventis
Warlord
- Joined
- Nov 5, 2006
- Messages
- 262
Things you need:
Barbs mighn't be a huge problem here if you spawnbust ok, but you really don't need to mess around with barbs when you have horses just sitting there. Libraries will allow you to run some scientists before/while you cottage.
As far as you cities go, Edirne is fine, but I don't really like the placement of the other two. Horses should definitely have been settled before Bursa at any rate. Keep settling the north (some nice land up there), and don't worry too much if economy tanks for a while. Just be sure to run some scientists and cottage in the next few rounds. Looking good
.
- Workers (I see you have some queued)
- Border Pops
- Writing & Libraries
- Horses!!!
Barbs mighn't be a huge problem here if you spawnbust ok, but you really don't need to mess around with barbs when you have horses just sitting there. Libraries will allow you to run some scientists before/while you cottage.
As far as you cities go, Edirne is fine, but I don't really like the placement of the other two. Horses should definitely have been settled before Bursa at any rate. Keep settling the north (some nice land up there), and don't worry too much if economy tanks for a while. Just be sure to run some scientists and cottage in the next few rounds. Looking good
.
Good start, but a few comments on your city placement.
Ankara should have been on the hill 1NE of the current position on the coast. Building a lighthouse would really help this city surrounded by mostly plains to tiles grow. It would also allow your borders to expand out into the sea allowing you to close borders with Saladin and prevent his galleys (with settlers) from passing and claiming the land up north.
Bursa should have been 1N1NW of the Horses to claim them.
At this point, getting those horses and popping borders is important. Also try to adopt Sal's religion when time comes or build an army because he can attack you especially if he's boxed in!!
Ankara should have been on the hill 1NE of the current position on the coast. Building a lighthouse would really help this city surrounded by mostly plains to tiles grow. It would also allow your borders to expand out into the sea allowing you to close borders with Saladin and prevent his galleys (with settlers) from passing and claiming the land up north.
Bursa should have been 1N1NW of the Horses to claim them.
At this point, getting those horses and popping borders is important. Also try to adopt Sal's religion when time comes or build an army because he can attack you especially if he's boxed in!!
learner gamer
King
- Joined
- Sep 4, 2009
- Messages
- 657
Firstly, well done on getting out three cities – (including two to the east 
) – especially given how the forest burned down.
Re: city placement. I agree with dankok8 about Ankara, although not because the city can grow working coastal tiles (since I don’t see any seafood there). IMHO, the ability to stop galleys (which dankok8 mentions), having the pig in the first ring of the BFC and coastal trade routes all add to the case for 1NE. That said, I guess you were aiming for a more complete block on land and wanted to avoid including the desert tiles in the city’s BFC.
Perhaps more controversially, I’d also have been inclined to place Erdine 1E, not only to reduce overlap with future fur city but also to get the pigs in the 1st ring of the BFC – as I understand it, the opening post in this thread http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=8582475
(NB: make sure you see the BFC pics in the spoiler too) suggests that it would’ve made keeping the pigs a little easier since Sal would need to expend loads of culture to keep them from you. However, once Erdine’s borders popped, you’d have been adding 20 culture per turn to the pig tile, more than offsetting the 7 culture per turn Sal gets from the Holy City and Palace. (NB however, I could well be wrong on this, so I’d appreciate a little feedback from the more experienced players on this point.)Admittedly, this strategy creates close border tension with Sal, but that brings us nicely onto the founding of city #3.
As has been noted, city #3 should really have been set up to claim the fish, pigs and horses, both for barb defence and as a deterrent to Sal. Out of curio therefore, what was the thought process behind settling Bursa to claim the clams as the 3rd (rather than 4th) city? If it was the archer seen in one of the screenies, was it worthwhile building / whipping a second warrior before sending the settler to nab that spot? (As before, you could’ve then invested the overflow into another settler to leverage imperialistic, and then switched to a warrior while regrowing...that was good micro you employed there BTW, well done!) OTOH, was it because you are also looking to get a library and scientists up ASAP in Bursa?
That in turn brings us nicely onto tech. It’s difficult to tell (since there is no savegame) but I might have been inclined to delay masonry (researched after fishing) and gone straight for writing at that point. The reasons I mention this are (i) masonry’s actually only needed when a worker is ready to quarry the marble – and with Ankara needing a border pop to get it, this will be a little while; and (ii) early writing (whether to leverage the commerce benefits of the palace, or for the scientists in Bursa - especially given that you’re also philosophical) or even pottery as second prize (for the cottages, although they'll provide less early research than scientists) will help boost research as you note.
Going forward, I think Leventis and dankok8 have it spot on: keep expanding, next to claim the horses and then up north. Get those scientists up in Bursa ASAP to help fund the expansion – philosophical will give you a great scientist in no time, further boosting research. I'd also ask if its worthwhile either whipping the warrior in Ankara and building a monument or investing one turn into a monument and then whipping it and recommencing the warrior build...either way, popping borders will help access the pigs which are needed to help the city grow. In all, I agree with Leventis and dankok8, its been a good start, well played. Look forward to the next instalment.
PS: If you've never played imperialistic before, you owe it to yourself to play as one of the Caesars!
) – especially given how the forest burned down.Re: city placement. I agree with dankok8 about Ankara, although not because the city can grow working coastal tiles (since I don’t see any seafood there). IMHO, the ability to stop galleys (which dankok8 mentions), having the pig in the first ring of the BFC and coastal trade routes all add to the case for 1NE. That said, I guess you were aiming for a more complete block on land and wanted to avoid including the desert tiles in the city’s BFC.
Perhaps more controversially, I’d also have been inclined to place Erdine 1E, not only to reduce overlap with future fur city but also to get the pigs in the 1st ring of the BFC – as I understand it, the opening post in this thread http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=8582475
(NB: make sure you see the BFC pics in the spoiler too) suggests that it would’ve made keeping the pigs a little easier since Sal would need to expend loads of culture to keep them from you. However, once Erdine’s borders popped, you’d have been adding 20 culture per turn to the pig tile, more than offsetting the 7 culture per turn Sal gets from the Holy City and Palace. (NB however, I could well be wrong on this, so I’d appreciate a little feedback from the more experienced players on this point.)Admittedly, this strategy creates close border tension with Sal, but that brings us nicely onto the founding of city #3.
As has been noted, city #3 should really have been set up to claim the fish, pigs and horses, both for barb defence and as a deterrent to Sal. Out of curio therefore, what was the thought process behind settling Bursa to claim the clams as the 3rd (rather than 4th) city? If it was the archer seen in one of the screenies, was it worthwhile building / whipping a second warrior before sending the settler to nab that spot? (As before, you could’ve then invested the overflow into another settler to leverage imperialistic, and then switched to a warrior while regrowing...that was good micro you employed there BTW, well done!
) OTOH, was it because you are also looking to get a library and scientists up ASAP in Bursa?That in turn brings us nicely onto tech. It’s difficult to tell (since there is no savegame) but I might have been inclined to delay masonry (researched after fishing) and gone straight for writing at that point. The reasons I mention this are (i) masonry’s actually only needed when a worker is ready to quarry the marble – and with Ankara needing a border pop to get it, this will be a little while; and (ii) early writing (whether to leverage the commerce benefits of the palace, or for the scientists in Bursa - especially given that you’re also philosophical) or even pottery as second prize (for the cottages, although they'll provide less early research than scientists) will help boost research as you note.
Going forward, I think Leventis and dankok8 have it spot on: keep expanding, next to claim the horses and then up north. Get those scientists up in Bursa ASAP to help fund the expansion – philosophical will give you a great scientist in no time, further boosting research. I'd also ask if its worthwhile either whipping the warrior in Ankara and building a monument or investing one turn into a monument and then whipping it and recommencing the warrior build...either way, popping borders will help access the pigs which are needed to help the city grow. In all, I agree with Leventis and dankok8, its been a good start, well played. Look forward to the next instalment.
PS: If you've never played imperialistic before, you owe it to yourself to play as one of the Caesars!
learner gamer
King
- Joined
- Sep 4, 2009
- Messages
- 657
Whoa there Copterman, why so glum? After all, the one point we’ve all mentioned is that you’ve got off to a good start. Admittedly, there are perhaps a couple of things that could’ve been done slightly differently to make the start great, (though note: there are also risks with the alternatives that've been suggested), but you’re in a good position having got out the two eastern cities, as has been noted. Just pop those borders ASAP to be able to work the resources, get some scientists up in Bursa ASAP to boost research, settle more land and aim for a horse archer rush as was mentioned. I think everyone will agree that your game is very winnable at this early stage and, even if it turns out that you don’t win, what does it matter? Provided you learn from any mistakes, your next game will be better and you’ll have even more fun playing it...and that’s the most important point – always remember that civ is a game played for fun in your leisure time.
Talking of having fun, obviously you now have two choices: (i) continue with the game or (ii) start over. Now, as mentioned, your game is very winnable, there are so many more turns to play and, who knows, along the way, you might pick up a few more tips on your way to victory. By contrast, let’s face it, repeatedly starting over and posting is only going to make you great at the start game.
That said, if you do start over (or indeed post another game after you win this one), perhaps consider four things: (i) if you’re looking for a romp, and want some further experience with imperialistic, try JC or AC and some praetorians for the first time (ii) have a look at the youtube video playthrough from tks2103 (the link is in my sig) – he explains the start game very, very well IMHO (iii) consider posting shorter turnsets during the early game to get a little more advice and (iv) most importantly, re-read the last sentence of the first paragraph. Look forward to seeing what you do.
Edit: Silu: I completely agree, all I’m trying to say when I mention the praets is that (i) maybe deploying praets will tempt Copterman into finishing a game, rather than re-rolling (ii) praets are educational if you’ve never used them before and (iii) let’s not forget, the game’s about having fun too.
Talking of having fun, obviously you now have two choices: (i) continue with the game or (ii) start over. Now, as mentioned, your game is very winnable, there are so many more turns to play and, who knows, along the way, you might pick up a few more tips on your way to victory. By contrast, let’s face it, repeatedly starting over and posting is only going to make you great at the start game.
That said, if you do start over (or indeed post another game after you win this one), perhaps consider four things: (i) if you’re looking for a romp, and want some further experience with imperialistic, try JC or AC and some praetorians for the first time (ii) have a look at the youtube video playthrough from tks2103 (the link is in my sig) – he explains the start game very, very well IMHO (iii) consider posting shorter turnsets during the early game to get a little more advice and (iv) most importantly, re-read the last sentence of the first paragraph. Look forward to seeing what you do.
Edit: Silu: I completely agree, all I’m trying to say when I mention the praets is that (i) maybe deploying praets will tempt Copterman into finishing a game, rather than re-rolling (ii) praets are educational if you’ve never used them before and (iii) let’s not forget, the game’s about having fun too.
I wouldn't start over - not like you have made any grievous errors. City placement is good enough, while many would have made them both 1NE you got the most important part by far right - positioning so that you complete a block by popping borders in those 2 cities. Also your fogbusting looks quite good so there's not a huge pressing need to get a stratreso, though it would have helped. The clam city is much better for early commerce than the horse one so there's merit in that decision as well. Commerce is ATM your problem to get to the economy techs.
Be sure to connect all your cities to each other to get trade routes going - this is easy to overlook as it's pretty "invisible" commerce. Also if either you or Sally get OB then think about roading to him to get foreign trade routes.
EDIT: IMO that's a good map for a learning experience for IMP/PHI (lots of land, food resources, not much cottage heaven, no stone). Certainly 10x more educating than a Praetorian cakewalk
Be sure to connect all your cities to each other to get trade routes going - this is easy to overlook as it's pretty "invisible" commerce. Also if either you or Sally get OB then think about roading to him to get foreign trade routes.
EDIT: IMO that's a good map for a learning experience for IMP/PHI (lots of land, food resources, not much cottage heaven, no stone). Certainly 10x more educating than a Praetorian cakewalk
I got back on to play my next round and realized I had not saved the previous round. It wasn't in my autosave folder either since I had played another game. Kind of glad I had to replay the round actually. I made the following changes in city placement.
I also ignored Masonry and went for Writing. I am working on a library in Istanbul. Putting Philosophical to work early. Researching fishing so that I can make Bursa work for me sooner.
Need to put out workers pronto.
I also ignored Masonry and went for Writing. I am working on a library in Istanbul. Putting Philosophical to work early. Researching fishing so that I can make Bursa work for me sooner.
Need to put out workers pronto.
learner gamer
King
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Glad to see you playing on Copterman! Actually though, the fact that you've had to replay was funny since it occurred to me after my earlier post that there were in fact three - and not two as I mentioned - choices. The third was, of course, to replay that round.
BTW: (i) Was your thinking in placing Erdine 1NE as opposed to the 1E I mentioned due to you wanting a more complete block after 1 border pop on Saladin? (ii) I note from the screenie that Erdine is currently at pop 2 and is producing a worker. Has a monument been built there yet? If not, I'd recommend whipping one ASAP to maximisie the chances of keeping those piggies.
BTW: (i) Was your thinking in placing Erdine 1NE as opposed to the 1E I mentioned due to you wanting a more complete block after 1 border pop on Saladin? (ii) I note from the screenie that Erdine is currently at pop 2 and is producing a worker. Has a monument been built there yet? If not, I'd recommend whipping one ASAP to maximisie the chances of keeping those piggies.
Defending the Piggy isn't an urgent problem, as they're in Mecca's 4th ring which you can deduct from the shape of his culture. That means he needs 500 (Normal speed) culture to reach those pigs and is producing 7 per turn and currently has somewhere around 200. Completing the block is pretty urgent though. He might get a city through but that won't be such a problem since there's no nearby good spots he could steal and when block completes he might even gift the city to you.
Immediate concern is avoiding crashing the economy, which won't be a problem with Pottery/Writing in hand (I assume you have those anyway, either one will do though
). After block you can take your sweet time with settling the rest, he won't send settlers through a complete block even with open borders. He can send them in galleys though so don't delay too much (you can prevent those with closed borders but that hurts trade routes and diplo a bit too much usually).EDIT: Edirne will be under heavy culture fire in the future though when the mega-annoying Madrassa matures on top of other AI culture jazz. Consider trying to get something to countermand that such as Parthenon in Edirne.
Yes, I moved Erdine NE for that exact reason. And I have already whipped a monument in Erdine.
I am researching fishing and then will research pottery. I figured I wanted to start leveraging Philosophical as soon as possible.
So the ways to improve my economy is through:
1. scientists
2. roads
3. cottages
4. open borders
The next wave comes through CoL/Currency, correct?
I am researching fishing and then will research pottery. I figured I wanted to start leveraging Philosophical as soon as possible.
So the ways to improve my economy is through:
1. scientists
2. roads
3. cottages
4. open borders
The next wave comes through CoL/Currency, correct?
learner gamer
King
- Joined
- Sep 4, 2009
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As usual Silu, you've made some great points. The question I'd ask though is whether its worth delaying the library in the capital (which is working 3 tiles) and instead producing a worker or two. (I just read the bit about the monument in Erdine, Copterman. ) Meanwhile, the worker in the capital could be deployed to pasture one (or both) of the other city's pigs. Admittedly, this delays the library a few turns but, IMHO, this can be accomodated by easing the slider down a little until the library is built. IMHO, border pops and workers are more of a priority right now, followed by roads and a library. What do you think?
Edit: I think you've got it Copterman!
) Meanwhile, the worker in the capital could be deployed to pasture one (or both) of the other city's pigs. Admittedly, this delays the library a few turns but, IMHO, this can be accomodated by easing the slider down a little until the library is built. IMHO, border pops and workers are more of a priority right now, followed by roads and a library. What do you think?Edit: I think you've got it Copterman!
Pretty much, though by default my priorities would be (even with PHI)
1. roads & OB and road there
2. some cottages to fuel expansion
3. scientists
PHI isn't at its strongest at this stage, since the strongest uses of GSs, smart bulbing and Academies, can't be utilized to their fullest at this stage (there aren't big science cities and no useful techs to bulb). All that's left that actually benefits is settling which can be suboptimal (but still nice though).
But considering you don't have a lot of workers, are teching very slow already and don't have pottery going fast library in capital as well is probably the way to go. Still, I'd get some workers ASAP to connect your cities to each other and Saladin. Having cities that aren't connected is like throwing money in the trash every turn.
learner gamer
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One last thing to consider Copterman before you start with the science specialists. Just think about which of your core cities will be the early worker / settler pump. This is important since, if its the capital, the presence of science specialists there (if you assign them after building a library) will slow down the rate at which the city builds workers or settlers (since it reduces the food surplus in a city that gets converted to hammers when you build a worker or settler.) If youre going to build that library and use the capital as a worker / settler pump, maybe its therefore best to temporarily reassign those scientists to work tiles (eg. cottages, mines etc) when youre using the capital to build workers or settlers. OTOH, you could simply use another high surplus food city as the worker / settler pump whilst your capital uses the scientists. Longer term of course, the city somewhere NE of the clams in the earlier run through is the best bet for running the 2 science specialists in the early mid game. Look forward to seeing how you go.
Round 3: 1880-1200 BC (17 Turns)
Wow. A lot happened in this short round. I hooked up all my cities for trade routes. I also opened borders with Saladin and created a trade route with Mecca. Doing so allowed me to convert to Hinduism. I discovered Fishing and Pottery and am on my way to Masonry. Also about to build my 5th city.
Here's my first trade route.
Upon opening borders with Saladin, it looks like he's pinned in.
Switching to Hindusim.
I went ahead and whipped out a library at 1 turn to completion. I'll put the overflow into a settler.
It appears Saladin has a little wiggle room. I'm thinking they're just islands though. I'll need to send a work boat over to see.
I whip this warrior. Overflow going into a workboat. Not much to build at this point.
This photo is to ask if I'm doing the right thing in my capital. I made it stagnant because I've reached the happy cap. Going to build a granary here. I could be running scientist specialists instead. Also, I hope to hook up furs next and hopefully Hinduism spreads here soon.
So here's a map of the known world.
I am about to settle up north. Should I go for the furs first? 1 NE of clams is best you think? I'm going to build a few cottages to help with economy. Should I be running scientists in Istanbul? Also, once I discover Masonry, what do you recommend for my science path. I need hunting for the furs eventually, but what about after that?
Thanks guys!
Wow. A lot happened in this short round. I hooked up all my cities for trade routes. I also opened borders with Saladin and created a trade route with Mecca. Doing so allowed me to convert to Hinduism. I discovered Fishing and Pottery and am on my way to Masonry. Also about to build my 5th city.
Here's my first trade route.
Upon opening borders with Saladin, it looks like he's pinned in.
Switching to Hindusim.
I went ahead and whipped out a library at 1 turn to completion. I'll put the overflow into a settler.
It appears Saladin has a little wiggle room. I'm thinking they're just islands though. I'll need to send a work boat over to see.
I whip this warrior. Overflow going into a workboat. Not much to build at this point.
This photo is to ask if I'm doing the right thing in my capital. I made it stagnant because I've reached the happy cap. Going to build a granary here. I could be running scientist specialists instead. Also, I hope to hook up furs next and hopefully Hinduism spreads here soon.
So here's a map of the known world.
I am about to settle up north. Should I go for the furs first? 1 NE of clams is best you think? I'm going to build a few cottages to help with economy. Should I be running scientists in Istanbul? Also, once I discover Masonry, what do you recommend for my science path. I need hunting for the furs eventually, but what about after that?
Thanks guys!
learner gamer
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Well done Copterman...looks like a very good start.
More than happy to take a look, indeed your write up has given me a few ideas already. However, could you post a savegame please? I ask because, looking at the land to the north, I can just about see pigs near the clams. That, and the other resources you've revealed there could change the proposed city sites.
More than happy to take a look, indeed your write up has given me a few ideas already. However, could you post a savegame please? I ask because, looking at the land to the north, I can just about see pigs near the clams. That, and the other resources you've revealed there could change the proposed city sites.
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