New Beta Version - March 1st (3/1)

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Can we somehow make Venice not choose Pyramids as an option for wonder building? Seems a waste to me.

All they are getting is 1:c5culture:, which can be gained by another, easier building and 25% improvement building which also can be sought by taking Expertise as a policy.

Unless they are given a Great Merchant instead of the settler. Not sure, do they?

They do :)
 
Hello!
Just wanted to inform you that the Cultural diversity Mod does not seem to be compatible with the newest version of CP. It crashes as soon as I settle a new city, I tried playing Rome, I am assuming it is because of their "free" liberty opener.

Keep up the good work,

Cheers.:)
 
Hello!
Just wanted to inform you that the Cultural diversity Mod does not seem to be compatible with the newest version of CP. It crashes as soon as I settle a new city, I tried playing Rome, I am assuming it is because of their "free" liberty opener.

I just tested it with the CBP, and have no issues whatsoever. Much less with the CP.
 
I've downloaded the Beta, and tried reinstalling multiple times but every time it's the same UI glitch. I'm using the CBP's EUI of the lastest version.


 
I'm still not sure why we're trying to go with an OR or and AND system when we could go for the Opener and Finisher Wonders not on the tech tree system. Looking them up in the Civilopedia isn't that hard.
 
I'm still not sure why we're trying to go with an OR or and AND system when we could go for the Opener and Finisher Wonders not on the tech tree system. Looking them up in the Civilopedia isn't that hard.

I believe it's because players are too used to a method, and this changes force to a completely different approach. Maybe, if so many players find it a different experience, this versión could be named CPP 2.0.1.

People used to check next wonders in the tech tree, so they keep doing the same thing. People used to maxim growth over other things. People used to win with only artillery and cavalry. Most complains I hear are 'I can't do things as I used to'. In fairness, most of posts are constructive criticism.
It takes time to get used to the new system.

Perhaps a comprehensive list of the changes is needed, after bugs and imbalances are solved. Not just a list of what has changed, but hints of what a new player can expect from a match. First releases of Civ V came with some online rough guides of how to play and not fail, some very basic stuff like 'get a little army to avoid every AI declare war on you' or 'your units get experience with every encounter, so you better don't let them die' or 'generals aid ground military units two hexs away, and they also can steal tiles with their special improvement: earn generals fighting often'. Then you have the magnificent zigzagzigal civs guides, from a seasoned player to initiated Civ players. In reddit, there is a review from a BNW player that has tried CPP (and convinced me this is the mod I was looking for).

First time I played CPP, I was very confused about the diplomatic units (I saw it, but not knowing what to expect, I went cultural instead). My special improvement had changed a lot, and I was able to build it sooner. I didn't know what to do with so many faith, nor how to handle happiness. Many buildings improve forest/jungles yields and that left me fully uneasy, not knowing if choping them would yield even more or less....
In BNW I had similar problems, I didn't know how good a tile was going to be. Jungles seems junk at first sight, until you fill them with trading posts, build the university and add a social policy/tech or two. You are thrown in the wild. Only experience (or opinions from experienced players on forums) saves you from mistakes like chopping all jungles, or a shy early exploration.

Now, you can play trial and error; you can install a mod (I think there is one) that let you know how good this tile (or unit, or building) can be with the correct tech, social policy or improvement; or you can use a guide. Educated decisions come from knowledge.

Note: It's too early to say if current beta plays better or worse if we play with same old tactics.
 
Unfortunately it breaks to disassembly, which means that this is a lua error, not a DLL error. So, mod conflict or thereabouts.

G

thats strange, im not using any other mods aside from this one.

it seems im always crashing at the start of turn 3.
 
May I again suggest Social Policy Point system or S.P.P.

You would acquire Social policy Points through the acquisition of Social Policies
These S.P.P. can be spent to build a wonder, alongside the usual cost.

This system would have the effect of causing players who focus tech but neglect culture to have fewer point to spend on wonders, but have choices not available to their competitors. More advanced wonders could also have higher costs in S.P.P. making them a greater investment.

Players who focus culture could have more S.P.P. always having the wealth of S.P.P. to build the fewer wonders available to them, plus being able to build wonder immediately as they become available through tech unlock.

This would reduce denial style play. As to build a wonder merely to deny others can cost you a wonder that you actually want for your play style later on.

Another strategic balancing possibility is that if a wonder you have started to build is finished by some one else. perhaps you may not recieve all your S.P.P. back. Just one lever to adjust.

The Social policy point system could also cause wonders to be a bit more spread. As players who aren't close to the front of the pack may be able to save some points and catch some wonders too.

If you go for a Tech or Social policy solution similar to this current beta the S.P.P. system would mean while you may unlock multiple wonder per policy you can only build a finite number before you unlock more policies, or you could have made the choice to save points beforehand.

Other possibilities with a social policy point system are that you gain more points for each subsequent policy i.e. more point for policy number 2 than number 1 (though i wouldn't link this to its position in a policy tree but the number of policies you have, as not to punish people from dipping in trees. )

You could also perhaps award points for getting to a number of policies before other players. Ie getting to your 7th policy while others are on their 6th, though I would think this award to be only a fraction of actually unlocking the policy.

Anyway these are just some ideas that could be played with if a Social Policy Point System was implemented.

The point system also good as it is a virtual value like a currency so it can be balanced inflated and deflated unattached to the real value of social policies making it easy to balance with.
 
Posting minidump. It's from one of the several occurences of crashing, though they mostly seem to be non-reproducible, that's why I haven't saved more. I'll post more shall I encounter further crashes. Some of them may be due to mod conflicts, though.

As always, terrific job, everyone. It's truly rejoicing to see so many more new people come into the project and contribute to its development, both idea- and code-wise.

Edit: just got another while loading an auto-save. Uploading.
 

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I believe it's because players are too used to a method, and this changes force to a completely different approach. Maybe, if so many players find it a different experience, this versión could be named CPP 2.0.1.

I think that's an idea that should be considered with all criticism, but I don't believe that to be the case here.

It isn't about something new, or a different approach. It's about the effects of the change.

Example, Last night's game I played with had Poland in it. Poland had almost every wonder built in the game due to his UA.

That isn't about getting used to a new method, that's a consideration about a feature that ties Wonder availability to the number of social policies.
 
Re:crashes. I've played several games with the Beta and have had 0 crashes. I only use the mod, and InfoAddict.
 
Apologies for the update series, wanted to add some input from last night's game.

Poland had almost all the Wonders as mentioned above.

I really think the relations with AI players is much improved, but there is a particular piece that has me unsure if it's a problem, or it's because of how I am used to dealing with the AI.

A Civ will be Hostile for me, and them go to Friendly immediately. My brain always tells me this is an attack coming, and they are being deceptive. So I still treat them as Hostile.

In multiple games with the Beta, I find that I attack them assuming they are bringing an attack, only to find out they are completely unprepared for it, and they were actually friendly.

This is part due to my expectations, and part due to the wild swings between Hostile and Friendly.

I don't have any particular ideas on how to improve that, some thoughts in my head I can immediately poke large holes into, but it would be nice to have it not be so binary. Radically switching from Friendly to Hostile to Friendly doesn't make sense from my perspective. If I see Hostile, I think Hostile, and war should be prepared for.
 
Re:crashes. I've played several games with the Beta and have had 0 crashes. I only use the mod, and InfoAddict.

Between this, and my experience using InfoAddict and Quick Turns, one can surmise that there is something in the beta that doesn't play nice with Quick Turns.
 
Re:crashes. I've played several games with the Beta and have had 0 crashes. I only use the mod, and InfoAddict.

Between this, and my experience using InfoAddict and Quick Turns, one can surmise that there is something in the beta that doesn't play nice with Quick Turns.

Just figured I'd chime in here and mention that InfoAddict is horrible and leads to crashes all on it's own, so please don't go around thinking InfoAddict is safe just because someone was using it successfully.
 
Just figured I'd chime in here and mention that InfoAddict is horrible and leads to crashes all on it's own, so please don't go around thinking InfoAddict is safe just because someone was using it successfully.

I have never crashed due to InfoAddict in my entire time playing, and modding Civ. YMMV.
 
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