New civ unlocks via ingame decisions

[King William I]

Am I the only one who don't follow the logic behind the "Play as Rome" unlock for America?

We yanks have a love and admiration for Greco-Roman culture that borders on fetishistic. The wierd thing is that Greece doesn't unlock America

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

I would have gone for Greece, going with the whole "Founders of Democracy" route.

The Roman Republic was an inspiration to the Founding Fathers as well

 

[Krikkit1]

I would have gone for Greece, going with the whole "Founders of Democracy" route.

Russia gets Greece

 

[Ellye]

Am I the only one who don't follow the logic behind the "Play as Rome" unlock for America?

It's to prevent the game from being review bombed by a certain type of very common American.

We of the rest of the world can just pretend not to see it, or pat them in the head and say "yes, you're a very good Roman Legionarie, Bob, now go eat your mcburger and watch your ads"

 

[Siptah]

The Roman Republic was an inspiration to the Founding Fathers as well

Actually much more so than the famous Athenian democracies of Solon or Cleisthenes, I would say.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

The Roman Republic was an inspiration to the Founding Fathers as well

True. They are both very similar. I just thought the idea of Athenian Democracy might have the edge over Roman Republicanism.
The craziest thing is that apparently Hawaii doesn't unlock America. Do they just go to Meiji Japan?

Russia gets Greece

Not surprised there, considering I believe Greece>Byzantines>Russia will be a thing in the future.

 

[CivLuvah]

Well it's not like the Philippines are going to be playable on launch so....

@queenpea's sarcastic comment has a point though. But I am going to write down my thought process as I think this through:

Yes, we Filipinos are of Austronesian descent. But because of our constant contact with the rest of Southeast Asia, trading contacts with China, and our experience under Spanish colonialism.... it just doesn't make sense. We're not Pacific Islanders, we're Asians (American census checkbox mentality strikes again). If Gitarja is a leader in Civ7 (for argument's sake) does that mean she gets to unlock Hawaii for free? I could hope that if you play as Rizal you get Spain unlocked for free; it's weird and feels inappropriate, but at the same time most Filipinos don't even mind... unless you also include a Philippines civ in the game in the modern era... which the base game doesn't... see this is why I'm wary about the game not including the respective civs of leaders. It makes for fraught combinations.

(I just wanted to mention that this is not how I normally write in this forum, so don't mind the disjointed nature)

 

[ehecatzin]

Marbozir's video says (and shows) that you get unlocks very easily.

That's one of my worries, if the unlocks are so easy they hardly matter, and might as well just be first come first served, a la Humankind. I hope the unlocks are rebalanced to actually feel like "unlocks".

 

[Krikkit1]

That's one of my worries, if the unlocks are so easy they hardly matter, and might as well just be first come first served, a la Humankind. I hope the unlocks are rebalanced to actually feel like "unlocks".

That makes sense for after the expansions... right now 6-7 civs available (seems reasonable) is 60-70% of the total. but once there are 13 civs available that edges up to 8-9... so its probably worth them seeing how it balances and then trimming the easier to get ones.

 

[Siptah]

I think it's especially unnecessary that some civs have two easy to obtain unlocks, e.g., Mongols being unlocked by 3 siege units or 3 horses. I've also seen Ming unlocked in every game, and Inka in many. Potentially, this can also be balanced, e.g., 2 cities with 6 resources instead of 1 with 8, and 5 mountains instead of 3.

 

[chaosprophet]

I care less about you unlocking too many every run or how easy they are, but rather I prefer them to make that civ make sense as a choice, regardless of the difficulty to unlock it. So while the French wine one is funny as a meme, I rather the gameplay unlock is related with you getting things that would make for you to want to pick that civ and likewise, if you don't get those requirements, then likely wouldn't have been a good idea for you to pick them.

 

[Sagax]

I think it's especially unnecessary that some civs have two easy to obtain unlocks, e.g., Mongols being unlocked by 3 siege units or 3 horses. I've also seen Ming unlocked in every game, and Inka in many.

Meanwhile Spain: reconquer a lost settlement, and nothing else gameplay-wise.

I think it’s a tough balance to strike, between overly easy and overly gimmicky.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

That's one of my worries, if the unlocks are so easy they hardly matter, and might as well just be first come first served, a la Humankind. I hope the unlocks are rebalanced to actually feel like "unlocks".

Given that most of the 'in-game' unlocks revolve around the map (having the right resources, coast, navigable rivers, etc) I suspect that the ease of transitions, at least at first, may depend heavily on what type of map you are playing, IF that is intentional, it will badly reflect progressions and for some Civs may limit them severely on some maps.

On the other hand, making terrain-based progressions or anything else balanced across multiple types of maps has always been a challenge in Civ, or am I the only one who remembers re-rolling my start a dozen times trying to get a desert start position for Mali or Nubia in Civ VI?

It will be interesting to see, down the road a patch or DLC or two, how they manage to make the progression mechanics 'balanced'.

 

[Evolena]

I would have gone for Greece, going with the whole "Founders of Democracy" route.

That's Benjamin Franklin. Play as Greece ("strategic choice" for him), then still unlock America

 

[untitledjuan]

We yanks have a love and admiration for Greco-Roman culture that borders on fetishistic. The wierd thing is that Greece doesn't unlock America

I think is a general Western, or at least New World post-colonial Western nations, thing. There's a lot of Graeco-Roman symbols, imagery and revival architecture in the American post-independent republics (USA, Colombia, Argentina, Mexico, etc.) Maybe not much in Canada, which still is technically a monarchy.

Maybe it has to do with the history of those countries being tied to Enlightenment Republican ideas strongly opposing European monarchies in bloody wars of independence.

In-game, for instance, you can get from Greece or Rome to Mexico via Spain, which is perhaps one of the most historical accurate paths in the base-game.

 

[chaosprophet]

I care less about you unlocking too many every run or how easy they are, but rather I prefer them to make that civ make sense as a choice, regardless of the difficulty to unlock it. So while the French wine one is funny as a meme, I rather the gameplay unlock is related with you getting things that would make for you to want to pick that civ and likewise, if you don't get those requirements, then likely wouldn't have been a good idea for you to pick them.

To illustrate my own point here. French Empire seems from the game guide a civ that doesn't really need any specific terrain to have it's abilities. And it is a very culture, happiness and to lesser extend military focus civ. In that case, maybe a good unlock requirement for them would be having a certain amount of a resource that exist in Exploration age and that in modern gives good amount of culture/happiness to a settlement.

 

[TheSpaceCowboy]

We yanks have a love and admiration for Greco-Roman culture that borders on fetishistic. The wierd thing is that Greece doesn't unlock America

Don’t kink-shame our Greco-Roman fetish

I’d love it if a patch made it so that Mississippi, Hawaii, and Greece all unlock America

 

[untitledjuan]

@queenpea's sarcastic comment has a point though. But I am going to write down my thought process as I think this through:

Yes, we Filipinos are of Austronesian descent. But because of our constant contact with the rest of Southeast Asia, trading contacts with China, and our experience under Spanish colonialism.... it just doesn't make sense. We're not Pacific Islanders, we're Asians (American census checkbox mentality strikes again). If Gitarja is a leader in Civ7 (for argument's sake) does that mean she gets to unlock Hawaii for free? I could hope that if you play as Rizal you get Spain unlocked for free; it's weird and feels inappropriate, but at the same time most Filipinos don't even mind... unless you also include a Philippines civ in the game in the modern era... which the base game doesn't... see this is why I'm wary about the game not including the respective civs of leaders. It makes for fraught combinations.

(I just wanted to mention that this is not how I normally write in this forum, so don't mind the disjointed nature)

As you said, even if it sounds strange, Spain might even be a "historically accurate" combination for José Rizal. He had some Spanish ancestors, spoke and wrote much of his works (for which he is most famous) in Spanish and, technically, was born in a Spanish territory/colony/dominion.

However, that would be like claiming that Franklin or Simón Bolívar are "historically accurate" combinations for England and Spain respectively. Seems kinda weird.

It'd be interesting to have a future Philippines civilization that unlocks from Spain and from other Southeast Asian nations.

 

[Sagax]

To illustrate my own point here. French Empire seems from the game guide a civ that doesn't really need any specific terrain to have it's abilities. And it is a very culture, happiness and to lesser extend military focus civ. In that case, maybe a good unlock requirement for them would be having a certain amount of a resource that exist in Exploration age and that in modern gives good amount of culture/happiness to a settlement.

So….Wine. Adds Happiness in the Capital and adds Culture when in a Celebration.

They knew what they were doing here

EDIT: although it is weird that apparently Wine loses its Happiness/Culture aspect in Modern, instead becoming +food/production. There is no Modern resource that provides the perfect yields for France, you can only have either/or.

 

[TheGhostEnthusiast]

To illustrate my own point here. French Empire seems from the game guide a civ that doesn't really need any specific terrain to have it's abilities. And it is a very culture, happiness and to lesser extend military focus civ. In that case, maybe a good unlock requirement for them would be having a certain amount of a resource that exist in Exploration age and that in modern gives good amount of culture/happiness to a settlement.

Doesn't wine do that? Or does it have a different yield?