New terrain features

[Dancing Hoskuld]

I am not in favor of changing the way bonuses, improvements and terrain features work at the moment.

I agree with God_Emperor on discovering resources and point out that the Event system is used for the fauna side ie the "Migration" events are in place for all animal resources (I think).

I really dislike the Great Farmer but think that we could extend or replace the city herd buildings if we allow the subdued animal to place itself as a resource on a suitable plot where a suitable plot for a horse would be

• on cleared scrub, plains, grass or lush terrain
• on flood plains where not the above terrain
• not on peaks
• not next to another horse plot
• not on a plot with another (inc undiscovered) resource

Basically the same restrictions with minor changes as the bonus can now occur at map generation.

The other option we have discussed is the idea of mutations and breeding of animals and plants. I have graphics for an Orange resource so we could have a small Great Wonder/Event that would allow you to replace some of your citrus resources with the orange resource.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Currently only improvements upgrade and only features spread. Bonuses can't even be controlled by North/South let alone East/West - so to get kangaroos in Australia you also have to have them in Europe.

Upgrading features would be nice, I wont have to program them using a plot property.

What if wild animals had a higher chance of making resources upon death? The animals already spawn in the correct part of the globe.

I would be in favor of having one 'flower/herb' resource using those graphics from Dune Wars, but probably not all three. As DH said it dilutes other (more important) resources like Corn and Iron, and as SO said how much of the herbs are similar to each other.

Which one do you think looks the best? Also what terrain would they be generate on? All types (except like Ice)?

The expression system variant of city vicinity that also works with features and improvements is:

<ConstructCondition>
  <IntegrateOr>
    <RelationType>RELATION_WORKING</RelationType>
    <GameObjectType>GAMEOBJECT_PLOT</GameObjectType>
    <Has>
      <GOMType>GOM_FEATURE</GOMType>
      <ID>FEATURE_FOREST</ID>
    </Has>
  </IntegrateOr>
</ConstructCondition>

I know you can have terrain features, I just did not know you could have improvements too.

 

[ls612]

Which one do you think looks the best? Also what terrain would they be generate on? All types (except like Ice)?

The yellow ones look best, and should be on Plains, Grasslands, and Lush which have no Forests.

 

[strategyonly]

The yellow ones look best, and should be on Plains, Grasslands, and Lush which have no Forests.

Marigolds are more known, i believe.

 

[AIAndy]

I know you can have terrain features, I just did not know you could have improvements too.

These are the GOMs (that Has can query for) currently implemented:

Spoiler :

GOM_BUILDING,
GOM_PROMOTION,
GOM_TRAIT,
GOM_FEATURE,
GOM_OPTION,
GOM_TERRAIN,
GOM_GAMESPEED,
GOM_ROUTE,
GOM_BONUS,
GOM_UNITTYPE,
GOM_TECH,
GOM_CIVIC,
GOM_RELIGION,
GOM_CORPORATION,
GOM_IMPROVEMENT,
GOM_UNITCOMBAT,
GOM_HANDICAP,

 

[Hydromancerx]

The yellow ones look best, and should be on Plains, Grasslands, and Lush which have no Forests.

That's fine then. So like ...

Wildflowers (BONUS_WILDFLOWERS)
Graphic: Creosote Bush (Dune Wars)
Bonus: +1 Commerce
Revealed: Gathering
Enabled: Florestry
Improvement: Plantation
Terrain: Lush, Grassland, Plains

Note I picked the name "Wildflowers" since we already have a manufactured resource called "Flowers" (BONUS_FLOWERS).

 

[strategyonly]

These are the GOMs (that Has can query for) currently implemented:

GOM_HANDICAP

Handicap, what kind? And how?

 

[AIAndy]

Handicap, what kind? And how?

That is difficulty level (for instance the XML file in which the difficulty levels are defined is named CIV4HandicapInfo.xml).

 

[strategyonly]

That is difficulty level (for instance the XML file in which the difficulty levels are defined is named CIV4HandicapInfo.xml).

Thats what i figured, Hmm?? So your saying i can change them mid stream or a certain civ, or even era, building etc??

 

[AIAndy]

Thats what i figured, Hmm?? So your saying i can change them mid stream or a certain civ, or even era, building etc??

I have not been saying anything one way or another about changing difficulty?

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

What if wild animals had a higher chance of making resources upon death? The animals already spawn in the correct part of the globe.

We reduced the probability because people were complaining about areas having too many of the same resource on them. Anyway it only affects wilderness plots.

That's fine then. So like ...

Wildflowers (BONUS_WILDFLOWERS)
Graphic: Creosote Bush (Dune Wars)
Bonus: +1 Commerce
Revealed: Gathering
Enabled: Florestry
Improvement: Plantation
Terrain: Lush, Grassland, Plains

Note I picked the name "Wildflowers" since we already have a manufactured resource called "Flowers" (BONUS_FLOWERS).

Except the most expensive flowers come from jungles (orchids) and deserts. I don't agree with adding this as a resource.

 

[Thunderbrd]

Instead of changing a huge amount of stuff by converting a bunch of bonuses to improvements and/or features and then making improvements and/or features do some additional things, why not just make the bonuses do the things you want them to? Save a step.

There is already some resource spreading since farms can randomly add a bonus just like mines do (but for a different set of bonuses, of course), as can jungle camps, and there is no particular reason that the bonuses they can find have to be put on the map by a map script. Pastures can't currently be built on plots without animal bonuses on them so there is no equivalent spawning feature for the fauna that the flora and mineral type bonuses already have, but some animals have an outcome other than "kill" or "capture" which can create a bonus and that could be expanded into more types (although you can't really control where it puts them other than positioning a scout on the desired plot and hoping the right kind of animal attacks him and gets the 2% chance to spawn a bonus there, and it probably doesn't have any chance if there is already a bonus on the plot, even if you haven't revealed it yet). And there is also the option to use some of the subdued animals to make herds in the city, which is similar but not the same.

Good ideas. My only real reason to suggest the change would be to enable multiple 'resources' to exist on a plot, though I believe there's been a number of mods that enabled this in a more direct way. Then again, I would suggest not having multiple types of metal or multiple types of flora/fauna on the same plot, so I figured by splitting the flora/fauna into improvements, it'd be the easiest way to enable such a feature.


@DH: I also like the idea of animals spawning herds rather than herd buildings. THAT seems to be a lot more balanced in concept.

 

[rightfuture]

I don't like the idea of using buildings to solve problems when code can be used more effectively.

I also like the idea of spawning herds, migration patterns, and tying down subdued animals to the nearest 'available' plot as a fixed resource.

 

[0100010]

@DH: I also like the idea of animals spawning herds rather than herd buildings. THAT seems to be a lot more balanced in concept.

I agree. So long as there is a legit place to put it. It also makes things more interesting when you capture an animal you normally don't have access to on a different continent.

maybe this idea can be split off into the map resources thread i just made.

 

[ls612]

Thats what i figured, Hmm?? So your saying i can change them mid stream or a certain civ, or even era, building etc??

What that means is that one could potentially make buildings do different things, or be auto-built or not, on different difficulties. It isn't something we do currently but we could with existing code.

 

[Hydromancerx]

What that means is that one could potentially make buildings do different things, or be auto-built or not, on different difficulties. It isn't something we do currently but we could with existing code.

I am hesitant to make any building disabled on different speeds. Mainly since so many are interconnected. Seems like doing such a task would be too much work for little benefit. Sure faster speeds get overwhelmed by the amount of buildings that get unlocked, but the game was not made with the intent for those faster speeds. As I have said from even before C2C was a mod, my buildings are made to be played on snail speed or slower. I play on snail and test on snail. I know this seems unfair, but I have to start somewhere when trying to balance the game. And so far snail has been the best speed to balance things at.

 

[JosEPh_II]

@ALL Modders
SO is looking for a python file called Terrain_Addons. I have copies of the mod saved of versions 11 thru the current build. Would any modder remember seeing this file and in what approximate version. Was it pre SVN? I'm searching the early versions but need a bit better reference point.

Thank you for any info.

JosEPh

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

@ALL Modders
SO is looking for a python file called Terrain_Addons. I have copies of the mod saved of versions 11 thru the current build. Would any modder remember seeing this file and in what approximate version. Was it pre SVN? I'm searching the early versions but need a bit better reference point.

Thank you for any info.

JosEPh

It was one of mine but I lost it when I lost by back up hard disk.

 

[JosEPh_II]

Do you remember what version it might have been in? I also have some of your additional files that you posted from time to time. Maybe in your zexperimemtal folder?

JosEPh

 

[God-Emperor]

There is a file called C2C_Terrain_Addons_CIV4GameText.xml in all versions from v21 (the earliest I have) through the current v29. It was initially getting smaller but then starts getting bigger again after v25 (more space related stuff, plus some early buildings too).

I see no Python file with a similar name anywhere back to v21. Based on the text keys in the file, I'm not sure what would be in such a python file.