None Shall Pass 2 [Game Thread - Concluded]

[Sprig]

The sole Morgothian found had a cover role, doesn't mean they all have them. I would expect some townies to have cover roles and some scum not to have cover roles, given point 3 and the knowledge that a cover role scanner exists.

 

[spaceman98]

How do we know you're not lying? How do we know you weren't actually the cult leader, and Winston your convert?

Winston was scanned as an imperial night 1, which means he was already a member at the start of the night.

 

[choxorn]

Well, technically, he was scanned as "Not town." For all we know, he could have been a member of a different anti-town faction before being recruited. Or maybe the scan took place after the conversion.

Those both seem rather unlikely, though. I admit that's a valid point.

Even so, why should I believe you didn't start the game as an Imperial?

 

[azzaman333]

What's your point?

 

[Arakhor]

At least Spaceman is defending himself, unlike, say, Christos or DoubleA.

 

[Sprig]

Well, technically, he was scanned as "Not town." For all we know, he could have been a member of a different anti-town faction before being recruited. Or maybe the scan took place after the conversion.

Those both seem rather unlikely, though. I admit that's a valid point.

Even so, why should I believe you didn't start the game as an Imperial?

... Really? even if that were even remotely true it would be absolutely broken. And Spaceman wouldn't be floundering like he is. If Winston was another anti-town faction then the instant he converted, he would be able to expose his former faction. And Spaceman would be listing off the rest.

This is important because it is exactly why spaceman is valuable for town.

We have tons of scanning abilities discovered so far.
-PG scanning
-Coverrole scanning
-Role scanning
-Not town faction scanning.
-Ring scanning.
-Desire for ring scanning.

All of which are fallible.

Spacemans ability is not. He can guarantee that a person is not Morgoth faction. Either through conversion or by testing susceptibility to conversion. (what ever his role actually is.)

This makes him absolute Morgoth faction bait. And worthy of keeping around.


That's the last of what i got to say about it.

 

[Sprig]

What's your point?

I am highlighting your post for others to evaluate. There is some interesting propositions there.

 

[spaceman98]

Another thing for people to think about:

Why didn't the Jedi go for Count Dingdong last night? If you really think they are on your side (even though their an informed minority that already killed a townie), then why NOT target the most scummy person in the thread (as it turns out now, a confirmed morgothian)?

 

[Arakhor]

In my experience, night-killing scummy people is less efficient than killing apparently innocent people, as you can rely on the town to lynch scummy people.

 

[Snerk]

There is some disagreement here but with two lynches I think Space should be one of them. Like Winston, his claims can not be fully trusted. Could be more imperials around, or still a possibility to recruit somehow.

I also don't think we should lynch Christos. For one, he outed another empire member so we owe him a little. And even though he's vague it does seem he can find scums (though we don't know the exact nature of the empire faction yet). And if that is the case, mordor will kill him. Should he remain alive, we should have another look at him.

 

[edse]

Tally based on Zack's latest

7 spaceman98 (christos200, edse, Snerk, remake20, azzaman333, Tanar Aerdoth, choxorn)
6 Double A (Sprig, JohannaK, Takhisis, KingMorgan, Verarde, Legato Endless)

1 christos200 (Buddhafish)
1 CivGeneral (Arakhor)
1 Legato Endless (Kennigit)
1 Takhisis (Swammerdami)
1 Snerk (Newyn)
1 topsecret (spaceman98)
1 KingMorgan (TFT)

-----

1 Abstain (Riedquat)

5 Not Voting (Backwards Logic, BSmith1068, CivGeneral*, Double A, topsecret)

 

[Arakhor]

At this rate, CivGeneral is going to get WoG, so vote: Christos, because he is still being way too vague (and quite deliberately so).

 

[Riedquat]

At this rate, CivGeneral is going to get WoG, so vote: Christos, because he is still being way too vague (and quite deliberately so).

Oh yes he is vague, putting all together I can figure out why some of his vagueness but still I've doubts; an undeniable fact is he wasn't lying, he said spaceman is not town and spaceman is not town... there you have proof of his unexplained ability.

With spaceman all we have is his well explained and put together claim, no proof, only his words. To me spaceman has to go and christos deserve further examination.

Now, please can somebody point to a second valid lynch with something more than I don't like his flinching kind of explanation?

Vote: spaceman as placeholder

 

[KingMorgan]

8 spaceman98 (Riedquat , christos200, edse, Snerk, remake20, azzaman333, Tanar Aerdoth, choxorn)
5 Double A (Sprig, JohannaK, Takhisis, Verarde, Legato Endless)

2 Takhisis (Swammerdami KingMorgan,)
2 christos200 (Buddhafish Arakhor)

My vote was on Takhisis not Dbl A, so have updated edse's tally with the latest summary of the top of table.

 

[remake20]

I don't understand this. We have spaceman who revealed as cult and, with no blaring other options, are choosing to spare him? I understand he's not fantastic, but the other options are just hunches. Preform night actions on Double A/christos and let's guarantee this lynch gets used at least semi-productively.

 

[JohannaK]

Spaceman leads the tally

 

[BSmith1068]

Top two get lynched today. Let’s not waste an opportunity to get a good candidate in the #3 spot as well.

Here's my problem with Winston: he claims the CD is against is evil and against his victory condition. If I have this right, survival is his goal. I don't see how CD (even as scum) could really be against that. However, if Winston is scum, then it makes total logical sense for CD (scum or not scum) to show up as this result. I just don't think Winston adds up, though CD also seems very scummy and should probably be lynched tomorrow.

I don't understand this. We have spaceman who revealed as cult and, with no blaring other options, are choosing to spare him? I understand he's not fantastic, but the other options are just hunches. Preform night actions on Double A/christos and let's guarantee this lynch gets used at least semi-productively.

vote: Remake. Help me understand your almost fanatical insistence that we vote for and only for Empire candidates? Both of these statements have come when both candidates are well in the lead for the lynch. It’s almost like you don’t want to have to focus on anything else.

 

[Arakhor]

A Jedi with a bad poker-face, perhaps?

 

[Legato Endless]

Or the Enemy. Regardless of the Empire's relation to the town, Morgoth absolutely wants them dead considering the Imperial win condition.

 

[Takhisis]

There's a morgothian faction. Or are you claiming that you are literally an Italian guy in a suit? fos: Takhisis

What a nice strawman argument, I never claimed to being a mafia.

For everyone still voting to lynch me because cult and stuff:

1: If the empire was genuinely anti-town, wouldn't Zack have given us cover roles? Yet we have confirmed townie Visor's words to prove that we lacked them. A game in which one of the most prominent anti-town factions lacks cover roles is just a poorly balanced game. The Morgothians had them, after all.

Why would you have cover roles? Why would a convert have a cover role?

4: It is, IIRC, very rare for cults to retain their conversion ability after the cult leader is lynched.

But not impossibru. And we don't actually know that Tarkin was the head of the recruiters, or the only one.

You may not post enough, but you post enough to know better. A small distinction, but an important one.

Also, I have no idea what you're getting at with the QFT or what you meant by it.

In the same post where I posted 'vote: Visorslash', I posted 'I'll hold my vote on <christos200 v. spaceman98> for later'. Don't you know what a QFT is?

I didn't exist, now I do.

Pointing at KingMorgan just to have a vote down for the day(It *probably* won't stick), I will be making one tomorrow after I spend more time rereading.

Why are you pointing at KingMorgan? I know that voting for Takhisis is always a scummy act, but at least specify it's because of that.

At least Spaceman is defending himself, unlike, say, Christos or DoubleA.

Then let's all vote for Double A! He was mafia in my last game, so that's a good starting point.

Or the Enemy. Regardless of the Empire's relation to the town, Morgoth absolutely wants them dead considering the Imperial win condition.

Their declared win condition.