Seems to me that it'd be fun on a continents-like map to raid and pillage the other continent while being a peacenik on your home continent. Considering Norway can enter the deep ocean during the Classical Era while other nations have to wait until the Renaissance, you might even be able to get away with it with no diplomatic repercussions... from those capable of actually doing anything about it anyway
I don't think I like the civ:
- Stave Church is cool idea but doesn't fit the rest of the Norway at all. If you decide to not focus on religion (which is pretty logical if playing as Norway), you don't need Theology at all. Also, additional faith from forest adjacency? After you've built second Holy Site building only? It looks like the weakest improvement so far.
- Pillaging doesn't win the game. It could hurt enemies a lot, it could bring some goods in, but that's it. Maybe in Civ6 we'll see more wars with the goal to weaken opponent instead of grabbing new land, but still it doesn't look very useful to me.
- Early access to the ocean probably means early trade. That's good. May be some early pillaging from civs too far away to retaliate. But doesn't look that strong to me either.
i don't see a plan here. How I[m going to win the game as Norway?
Conquest victory? But if you're going to conquer cities, you don't want to pillage them, reducing Norway offensive abilities to minimal (free embark-disembark, bonus Berserker attack).
Religion? With one adjacency bonus from unimproved tiles available in mid-game when you have strong reasons to get rid of unimproved tiles it doesn't look like a bonus.
Culture or science? You probably get some appeal from unimproved forests which probably converts to tourism and you may get some research from pillaging campuses, but that's nearly unnoticeable.
Well, since Ancient Era wars have no warmonger penalty, just range the coasts and pillage all other civs for the yields. Beyond that, it seems like a good plan to soften up strong enemies by repeatedly pillaging their lands before actually conquering them.
Well, actually there is a reason to have a coastal city when dealing with Norway. Your coastal city will be able to bombard their ships and you can build a navy without a harbor that could be pillaged.
Cool civ. Much improved over the lackluster Denmark in the last iteration.
Only thing that is weird to me is the stave church. If it's supposed to be some kind of "Norse God" reference, it's weird to me to tie that to a building built in the very formal religious district. I would have expected something like an improvement that can only be built on mountains.
- Pillaging doesn't win the game. It could hurt enemies a lot, it could bring some goods in, but that's it. Maybe in Civ6 we'll see more wars with the goal to weaken opponent instead of grabbing new land, but still it doesn't look very useful to me.
Considering you can greatly reduce your warmongering penalty by returning cities at the time of peace, pillaging for yields (like science from a campus) and leveling your opponents districts/improvements and then returning their decimated cities to them could be a great way to cripple/slow down an opponent without becoming hated by the rest of the world.
Only thing that is weird to me is the stave church. If it's supposed to be some kind of "Norse God" reference, it's weird to me to tie that to a building built in the very formal religious district.
Well, since Ancient Era wars have no warmonger penalty, just range the coasts and pillage all other civs for the yields. Beyond that, it seems like a good plan to soften up strong enemies by repeatedly pillaging their lands before actually conquering them.
You mean Norway's current flag? I didn't even think about the modern country of Norway because, well, this Norway obviously doesn't represent any other era besides the Viking era. But it's probably why they choose those colors yeah.
Speaking of taking off his helmet though, I hope he throws his helmet away and storms off the lederscene if we destroy him just like how Bluetooth did in Civ V. I always loved that!
Yes it was but that's beside the point. Norway as a Faith civ just because some churches were built there once, and moreover, a Christian faith civ? Doesn't fly for me with Norway's pop culture image. It's like if the "megachurch" was a building for America just because of people like Joel Osteen and the history of the Puritans. The fact that a building exists in an area doesn't make it sufficient to be the focus of a civ to me. The stave church is a weird addition.
- Pillaging doesn't win the game. It could hurt enemies a lot, it could bring some goods in, but that's it. Maybe in Civ6 we'll see more wars with the goal to weaken opponent instead of grabbing new land, but still it doesn't look very useful to me.
- Early access to the ocean probably means early trade. That's good. May be some early pillaging from civs too far away to retaliate. But doesn't look that strong to me either.
i don't see a plan here. How I[m going to win the game as Norway?
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Sure it can. Pillaging isn't a minor inconvenience anymore. I mean when you pillage not only do you get bonuses, you CRIPPLE the person you are harassing. Take out their campuses and while you get a boost to your science they have effectively zero. AND you can do this in a position they literally can't retaliate (across the Ocean early). You can send out literal Viking raiding parties and while the world recoups you take the spoils home and grow stronger.
Yes it was but that's beside the point. Norway as a Faith civ just because some churches were built there once, and moreover, a Christian faith civ? Doesn't fly for me with Norway's pop culture image. It's like if the "megachurch" was a building for America just because of people like Joel Osteen and the history of the Puritans. The fact that a building exists in an area doesn't make it sufficient to be the focus of a civ to me. The stave church is a weird addition.
Maybe. I'm thinking that Firaxis just wanted to give Norway some type of religious/faith bonus and they figured the stave church would be a neat unique building for doing that. It just depends on what you want the focus to be. If you wanted America to have a religious focus, giving it the "megachurch" unique building would actually be quite appropriate IMO. It could get +2 faith and +2 gold.
Maybe. I'm thinking that Firaxis just wanted to give Norway some type of religious/faith bonus and they figured the stave church would be a neat unique building for doing that. It just depends on what you want the focus to be. If you wanted America to have a religious focus, giving it the "megachurch" unique building would actually be quite appropriate IMO. It could get +2 faith and +2 gold.
Sure it can. Pillaging isn't a minor inconvenience anymore. I mean when you pillage not only do you get bonuses, you CRIPPLE the person you are harassing. Take out their campuses and while you get a boost to your science they have effectively zero. AND you can do this in a position they literally can't retaliate (across the Ocean early). You can send out literal Viking raiding parties and while the world recoups you take the spoils home and grow stronger.
Norway is really cool at pillaging tiles near coast. Either from ships directly or by sending berserkers a couple tiles away from the sea. And it could be devastating against civ not expecting attack from the sea. But if we speak about continents maps, standard size (the setup for which the game is usually balanced for), civilizations usually have their main part inland. If they aren't England, of course.
I don't think I like the civ:
- Stave Church is cool idea but doesn't fit the rest of the Norway at all. If you decide to not focus on religion (which is pretty logical if playing as Norway), you don't need Theology at all. Also, additional faith from forest adjacency? After you've built second Holy Site building only? It looks like the weakest improvement so far.
- Pillaging doesn't win the game. It could hurt enemies a lot, it could bring some goods in, but that's it. Maybe in Civ6 we'll see more wars with the goal to weaken opponent instead of grabbing new land, but still it doesn't look very useful to me.
- Early access to the ocean probably means early trade. That's good. May be some early pillaging from civs too far away to retaliate. But doesn't look that strong to me either.
i don't see a plan here. How I[m going to win the game as Norway?
Conquest victory? But if you're going to conquer cities, you don't want to pillage them, reducing Norway offensive abilities to minimal (free embark-disembark, bonus Berserker attack).
Religion? With one adjacency bonus from unimproved tiles available in mid-game when you have strong reasons to get rid of unimproved tiles it doesn't look like a bonus.
Culture or science? You probably get some appeal from unimproved forests which probably converts to tourism and you may get some research from pillaging campuses, but that's nearly unnoticeable.
My gut tells me that you might underestimate the importance of pillaging in CiVI.
1) I think it is safe to say that declaring war, pillaging and not capturing cities might get you way lower diplomatic hate than a "classic" conquest war. Allowing for some kinda constant bullying.
2) For science, considering what we saw so far, i dont think we will reach spectacular number in science per turn the way we could in CiV. So, coming in and pillaging some science, gold, culture might be a veeery interesting if the scaling is decent through the different eras (and it should be). Also, i seem to remember that you can pillage a district once for every building and then the district itself. So if pillaging a district twice in 2 turns nets something like 10 turns of your science because you dont have much adjacency bonus for you. It's very interesting.
So that bonus in pillaging might end up very useful in any game.
All of this is raw thinking until hands on product but since they announced unstacking of cities, i just cannot shake the feeling that we'll have many different ways to make a war worth our time.
Yes it was but that's beside the point. Norway as a Faith civ just because some churches were built there once, and moreover, a Christian faith civ? Doesn't fly for me with Norway's pop culture image. It's like if the "megachurch" was a building for America just because of people like Joel Osteen and the history of the Puritans. The fact that a building exists in an area doesn't make it sufficient to be the focus of a civ to me. The stave church is a weird addition.
I don't think it makes any sense to characterise Norway as a "faith civ" when nearly all of their abilities are to do with naval movement and pillaging
Sure, the stave church doesn't fit with he rest of the civ, but it's quite common in Civ games to get a unique that's seemingly unrelated and lacklustre when they have a suite of other powerful abilities which comprise the core focus.
Norway is really cool at pillaging tiles near coast. Either from ships directly or by sending berserkers a couple tiles away from the sea. And it could be devastating against civ not expecting attack from the sea. But if we speak about continents maps, standard size (the setup for which the game is usually balanced for), civilizations usually have their main part inland. If they aren't England, of course.
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But it's probably why they choose those colors yeah.
I always loved that!
