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[NFP] November Update Analysis

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by Lily_Lancer, Nov 20, 2020.

  1. Archon_Wing

    Archon_Wing Vote for me or die

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    I really don't care if you don't encounter it or if Lily always encounters it. It seems like you and others are insisting on shooting the messenger.
    Moderator Action: Please engage with posts and ideas not other posters --NZ

    Are bugs ok as long as you don't encounter them? What if the game crashes if you build Stonehenge? Most people don't build it, so it's not an issue?


    You can avoid this discussion too. If it's not a big deal, then you don't have to spend so much effort convincing people it's not a big issue. You don't get to decide how anyone approaches the game.What if it does affect their playstyle? Screw them i guess?

    And I have never abused it (probably don't even have the opportunity to), so this advice doesn't really mean anything to me.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 22, 2020
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  2. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    I am unconvinced with the “just ignore it aspect” with something like peace cities because I typically only take 1-2 cities then sue a civ for peace. And this is right in my way.
    Another example would be tracking over water. I cannot count the amount of times my units jump onto land because I did not move them tile by tile. Now I can avoid the bug by moving tile by tile but the bug gets in my way.

    Bringing up bugs is good regardless of motive.
     
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  3. Fluphen Azine

    Fluphen Azine What is Fluphen Azine?

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    Recently I played a game as Gran Columbia and put Babylon as the AI.
    Along with Korea and a bunch of Warmongering Civs.
    I was crushing Genghis by around turn 80 and was about to take his last city.
    Somehow he snuck a settler around some CS's and had a new city to the far NE.
    So I took a peace deal with him because why bother.
    Not sure what point I am trying to make here lol.
    I guess sometimes you just have to make peace in this game.
     
  4. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    I just quite like taking cities and still trading and having allies... sort of like, history, you know.
    The ownership feeling of crushing now makes me feel like the game is using me rather than the other way around.
     
  5. iammaxhailme

    iammaxhailme Emperor

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    To be honest, I've never even encountered the peace cities trade deal bug/exploit/whatever personally, so I'm not even sure how it's triggered or how severe it is. Maybe I should start warmongering more...
     
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  6. pokiehl

    pokiehl Emperor

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    Calm down pal :) No one is attacking anyone or shooting messengers and I'm very sorry you've got to feeling that way. I think you've misunderstood my entire point here because I'm not talk about anything other than suggesting a common sense workaround to someone for a game ruining bug :dunno:. Yes I'm poking a bit of fun at Lily because he makes it seem like he has no other option than to cheese the AI when he's actually one of the most hardcore serious civ players here and certainly doesn't need any help for the AI.

    I'm certainly not saying people shouldn't talk about bugs! I am fairly active on the bug reports subforum myself and the first thing I always look at in the patch notes is bug fixes :)

    The pathing bug can be really frustrating. This one is inconsequential but I also wish they'd fix some of the clipping in buildings. Like the water mill clips into walls and it can look ugly. And the ends of city center canals clip into cliff rocks which drives me crazy :run:

    I guess we all have our hangups :)
     
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  7. Lily_Lancer

    Lily_Lancer Deity

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    It's reintroduced since Octobor patch.

    Well, yes. As this bug exists you actually don't know what is the "real supposed value" for a peace deal, or in fact, for any tradable items, when AI offers you an amount, you don't know whether the item worth the amount, or it is just bugs. So as long as you trade with AI you're "having no other option than to cheese the AI".

    Eventually you have to ban trading at all in order to avoid those value bugs, which definitely alters the game to somewhere which it is not designed for.
     
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  8. pokiehl

    pokiehl Emperor

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    I hear what you're saying but I've honestly never come across any of these bugs. Taking advantage of tradable items typically requires some impetus from the player to purposefully alter the deal or make multiple deals to get the biggest possible take from the AI. In the case of peace offerings, their initial peace offerings are fair, at least in the sense of being consistent with peace deals they've given in prior patches. So for someone to encounter this bug is to purposefully try to extract more and more favorable terms from the AI. I don't do that. The game is easy enough and I'm not interested in getting victory as fast possible or doing Deity challenges or anything.

    We both have extremely different approaches to playing the game obviously so I'm sure that factors into our different experiences here. But we can agree on this point - the bug (all bugs really) should ideally be fixed. Because even if you take my suggestion and can avoid abusing the bug, that doesn't mean people playing multiplayer aren't going to come across bad actors who abuse it to get ahead.
     
  9. lotrmith

    lotrmith King

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    I haven't been able to get more than 7 or 8 gold per favor. Average is probably 4 and the mode seems to be 2.
     
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  10. RealHuhn

    RealHuhn Emperor

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    The problem is that the AI basically gives you diplo favor for free in the early game and a few turns later you can sell everything for a quite impactful amount of money. It's bad balancing. Of course, I can choose to ignore the cheap prices in early game but I like to have at least 30 diplo favor as early as possible to be able to ask for promises. I have to actively ristrict myself which isn't fun.
    Do you ever ask the AI to declare a joint war? More often than not the AI offers me all of their gold, resources and great works. How am I supposed to know the real value? I usually just take some gold, like 200 or so, but it's annoying to deal with and it ruins immersion in that moment. Fixing these bugs is important.
     
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  11. Pistol90

    Pistol90 Warlord

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    I was saying this when vampires were annnounced, but others were like 'it will be fine, this is just small distraction'.

    4 game modes and none is what I expected, I only love them because I hope modders will found way to make them better, or for something entirely different from what they were designed
     
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  12. Noble Zarkon

    Noble Zarkon Elite Quattromaster - Emperor (BTS) Moderator Hall of Fame Staff Supporter GOTM Staff

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    You can play without any of the modes enabled ....
     
  13. Pistol90

    Pistol90 Warlord

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    How long before that become "You can play without any expansion", and after that "You can play some historical game, not civ"
     
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  14. 8housesofelixir

    8housesofelixir Emperor

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    無何有鄉,廣莫之野
    To be fair, if you do want to play a historical game, civ will not be your choice, at least not your immediate choice. The same goes for Civ I, II, III, IV, and V as well, you are asking for something the series cannot 100% offer.
     
  15. AntSou

    AntSou Emperor

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    When that happens you can complain about it. It seems rather silly to get offended in advance about stuff that only exists in your own imagination.

    Besides, that's just a typical gateway argument: "If you let your son listen to rock and roll, how long until he becomes a Satan worshiping murderer?"
     
  16. pokiehl

    pokiehl Emperor

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    I will repeat again: nowhere in this thread or on CFC in general have I suggested that fixing bugs isn't important or that Firaxis should not fix bugs.
     
  17. Josephias

    Josephias Emperor

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    I've to say I am with Lily in this one. I'm not exploiting trades, and because of that, this bug is annoying as hell (even if you encounter it only seldom).

    Situation is: you might want to end a war early, because it's just annoying to keep focusing on units and be distracted from everithing else (be it religion, building or expanding in a different direction), but you want as well to get from the war some cities that for you have certain strategic meaning (empire continuity, access to a specific sea, access to certain resources, etc...).

    Normally, the AI offering peace should be an opportunity: they want to make peace because you're superior, so let's make a deal: I'll get some cities in exchange for the peace. Of course cities will not be part of the initial trade deal, but why not?
    Before october, I was able to get a "fair" trade for some cities that were not strategic for the AI (small cities whit duplicate resources -for them-, mainly). And by "fair" I mean paying around 100 gpt. in example. (It's ok, my treasury can handle it, and if I get less focus on war and the economy running that is just peanuts).
    But with the bug that Lily mentions, asking for a city immediately gets you peace, and the city at no cost (and you can ask for all cities). Asking for all cities would be an exploit, of course, but being denied a "fair" land for money deal because of this just means you need to keep warring (or exploit the bug) if you want those cities. Not fun.

    So, maybe it's not a gamebreaking but indeed a bug that impacts gameplay and should be considered.

    Edit: (added just in order to not double-post)
    Now that we are at bugs: ¿Anyone noticed if Gilgabro can make alliances whith Heroes & Legends mode enabled?. He is in my current game and it looks like alliances are not available for him. ¿Maybe it is a secondary effect for his ability change?
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2020
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  18. God of Kings

    God of Kings Ruler of all heads of state

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    It would be great if there were a list of relics left behind by the heroes such as Hercules' club and the Girdle of Hippolyta.
     
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  19. Alexander's Hetaroi

    Alexander's Hetaroi Deity

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    I mean the expansions have always been optional and scenarios with magic and sci-fi have existed since Civ 2.
     
  20. AntSou

    AntSou Emperor

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    I don't think everyone got the memo.



    But I understand people who don't like this and would rather not have it at all in Civ, optional or not (it does consume resources and time after all).

    It's the people who keep making the "make Civ great again" argument, wishing back for a past that has never existed, that are starting to get repetitive. They just need to argue "I would rather Civ games had no fantasy at all" and that would be fine.
     

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