Orbis Bug Thread (Old)

moshi · Nov 12, 2009

~looks like assassins are still targeting the weakest unit in a stack even with guardsmen promoted units protecting them.

~with traits that allow building of captured civs units (conqueror, tolerant etc), if you capture a city that the AI had previously taken from another civ, you build the founding civ's units and not the civ you actually captured it from. so in my current game the svarts were eliminated by mahala in an early war, but were magically brought back into the world when i captured a doviello city originally built by rivanna.

~can't cast rally. and yes, i *am* running the crusade civic

Master_Hugian · Nov 13, 2009

The Unholy Taint promotion granted by the Sheaim pagan temple is not applied to any unit as it is not available for any unit types.

Belizan · Nov 14, 2009

Patch N:

The Nexus does not produce obsidian gates in team mate's cities (unlike the other wonders of that type).
Hiring Mercenaries (via Guild of Eight) in a team causes an OOS (and brings up the dialog on all team mates screens).
Automated workers will merrily work through Haunted Lands (and die).
All units will happily path through Haunted Lands (potentially dying).

Ara2be · Nov 15, 2009

Patch N:

Cultists, StygianGards are losing their waterwalking ability because of its 1 round duration.

Luchuirp: Although I have all requirements (Blasting workshop, fire mana and sorcery) the newly produced golems won't get the FireII Promotion. Perfect sight and hidden are functional though.

arkham4269 · Nov 15, 2009

Been awhile since I've played Orbis so maybe many changes has happened since I played last.

Did the whole "Play Now!" after loading and patching everything (including FfH) to the current level. Thought I'd play as one of my favorite Civs (Mechanos) and started a game on a small 60% water tectonics map with 2 good, 2 neutral (including me) and 2 evil Civs.

Well nothing crashed but the game felt odd. I've included a semi-late game save. The 'problems' I've noticed is that that I'm way ahead of everyone. Yes, it's a game on Noble, but normally even on normal the other Civs still kick ass. My only neighbor on my continent (before I wiped them out) was Decius ruling the Calabim. They basically ignored me while I expanded. I kept myself strong enough for them not to mess with me and we also had a Giants steading and a goblin for between us that sort of ran interference anyway. I thought that maybe the Calabim where busy fighting another Civ because they got a lot of Generals so I figured I got ahead of them due to the fact I wasn't fighting anyone.

However, when I finally got around to exploring (I like the new "Isolation" civic; fits my style of play) I found that everyone was way behind me. Plus, as my save shows, practically no one developed a religion to really late in the game compared to what I'm used to. I'm up to technopriests and still the FoL hasn't been founded and the Svarltahar are in the game!

Plus for the longest time the AC was at zero. By the time Hypeborem has entered the game, it's at 4!

Anyway, have an odd question about the Infernals. In my current game (later than the included save) they entered the world in one of my cities! Yet there is still some unclaimed land over by Capria and I'd think they'd take over a AV city of Os-Gabella. Why chose a major city of my aesthetic techno geeks?

Plus, after I created the Nature Wonder, I got a paw-print as a religion, yet when I founded Humanism and 'converted' to that, I don't have any icon showing that's what I follow.

Anyway, I must say so far things look good. Like some of the new skins. I do wish the basic warrior from Civ was done away with and a Civ specific skin was done. That and I wish the Mechanos got music of their own. Beyond looks good.

Belizan · Nov 15, 2009

I now have a reproducible CTD patch N game on turn 394, 2 players, 9 (8 still living) NPCs. Not sure if anyone is doing this sort of debugging. I can post it up if someone is (it's fairly large).

Belizan · Nov 15, 2009

More bugs:

Sometimes pillaging using movement, sometimes it doesn't. The inconsistancy is very frustrating. (In all cases with horsemen and the raider trait).
You can not range strike once a ranged unit is out of movement. The computer player has no such difficulty.
When the AI withdraws from combat within your borders (far more often then he aught to statisticly, btw), he teleports several squares away so as to be out of your territory.
The AI's units heal faster then my own units in my own territory.

Ahwaric · Nov 16, 2009

tokala said:
-Are barbs supposed to pop graveyards?

Why not? But if it is easy to fix if you want that change.

-Grigori Adventurer counter starts with +1 per turn, gets reset after first civic change to +3.75 (normal speed). Should probably be 3.75 from the start.

Was the civic city states by chance? It improves adventurer generation odds.

-Regarding the Auto-commando catapults: Flavourwise it's a really strange image of lumbering war machines charging ahead via road, leaving infantry and even nimble recon troops behind, with only cavalry able to keep up (I encountered this while moving troops through Illian territory). Would it be possible to generally restrict siege engines to roads, without granting the effects of a commando promotion?)

I think it is possible. But that is just few catapults while you have whole large units of men, and each of them need a lot of supplies, secure the area etc, while siege engines just need to be transported to the spot. So it is not that unrealistic.
Also, it is balance measure. Siege engines are slow, and this change lets them keep up with the army a bit better. But you still need to protect them, so I do not think they will move faster than the rest of the army.

Lark said:
- Judging by the bony guy I saw in the WB afterward, Decius got the Skeleton from the Ancient Grave event, threw all (or all but one) of his city defenders at it, and the Skeleton then moved into his defenseless city. B'bye, Dumb Deci. (Also, didn't I see a Shackled promo when I got it in another game?)

Skeleton is not shackled if you pillage the grave...

moshi said:
~looks like assassins are still targeting the weakest unit in a stack even with guardsmen promoted units protecting them.

Works fine for me. If guardsman is in stack, marksman ability is ignored.

~with traits that allow building of captured civs units (conqueror, tolerant etc), if you capture a city that the AI had previously taken from another civ, you build the founding civ's units and not the civ you actually captured it from. so in my current game the svarts were eliminated by mahala in an early war, but were magically brought back into the world when i captured a doviello city originally built by rivanna.

WAD. The city always keeps the culture of first non-barbarian owner (usually the founder)

Belizan said:
Hiring Mercenaries (via Guild of Eight) in a team causes an OOS (and brings up the dialog on all team mates screens).

That is a problem with expanded version of the spell - standard one works fine and should be used in MP games.
I should have disabled the expanded one for MP games long ago. But I want to rewrite the whole mercenary system anyway.

Automated workers will merrily work through Haunted Lands (and die).
All units will happily path through Haunted Lands (potentially dying).

Should definetly be adressed, but so for no ideas.

Belizan said:
I now have a reproducible CTD patch N game on turn 394, 2 players, 9 (8 still living) NPCs. Not sure if anyone is doing this sort of debugging. I can post it up if someone is (it's fairly large).

Actrually, I wanted to ask you if you can take a look. I am out of ideas how to track that particular bug. It is an elusive one...

Thanks a lot for all bug reports people, I am working on fixes.
Also, decided to pack improvements rebalances, tech changes and fixes as patch O. 0.30 is still far away and what is in the changelog fits patche better.
I hope to release 0.24 later this week (weekend?)

tokala · Nov 16, 2009

Ahwaric said:
I think it is possible. But that is just few catapults while you have whole large units of men, and each of them need a lot of supplies, secure the area etc, while siege engines just need to be transported to the spot. So it is not that unrealistic.
Also, it is balance measure. Siege engines are slow, and this change lets them keep up with the army a bit better. But you still need to protect them, so I do not think they will move faster than the rest of the army.

Emphasis should be on the "just" :lol:

, its called siege train for a reason I think. But nevermind, its no big thing, and after all it is documented.
Re: Graveyards, I was just surprised that it was popped by a barb, never saw this in another FFH flavour :crazyeye:

Whereas the Grigori Adventurer spawning issue should probably be addressed. Using Adventurers to the max is the best strategy for Grigori. So if City States almost quadruples the adventurer output it should be a) the default civic and b) documented somewhere where even a half-blind mole like me can find it

BTW, are there more parameters that affect the adventurer spawn rate?

And thanks for giving us the new yields already in a minor patch, I am certain this will again stimulate the lively discussion in the "rebalancing" thread

Valkrionn · Nov 16, 2009

Here's the relevant code.... Just switch Apprenticeship with City States.

Code:

            iPalaceMod = iNumPalace 
            iMuseumMod = iNumMuseums * 0.33
            iTavernsMod = iNumTaverns
            iGuildsMod = iNumGuilds * 0.5
            iCivicMod = 0.00
            iCivicMult = 1
            if pPlayer.getCivics(gc.getInfoTypeForString('CIVICOPTION_LABOR')) == gc.getInfoTypeForString('CIVIC_APPRENTICESHIP'):
                iCivicMod = 2
                iCivicMult = 1.25



            iGrigoriSpawn = round(((iPalaceMod + iMuseumMod +iTavernsMod + iGuildsMod + iCivicMod) * iCivicMult * iAImod / iSpeedMod), 2)

Basically, you ALWAYS get +1 from the palace. You then get +0.33 for each museum, +0.5 for each Guild, +1 for each Grigori Tavern. Believe Ahwaric also added a modifier for the pagan temple he added?

When following the correct civic, not only does the rate increase by +2, it is also multiplied by 1.25... Which is important, as it keeps the civic important even late game when +2 is trivial.

Belizan · Nov 16, 2009

Ok, more bugs from Patch N...

- When a unit with items dies to Haunted Lands (or presumably any other non-combat death), the item is dropped on the ground, but owned by the unit's faction and therein unclaimable (unless you are at war with them).
- The fire in you city destroys a building event can destroy your palace in your capital. If you have fewer then 4 cities, you can not rebuild your palace.
- The burial ground of a warrior from a previous age event has (at least) two bugs. First, selecting "loot the grave" never appears to produce loot (done it about 7 times now). Second, if the looted square takes place on a city, the city is automatically captured/destroyed by the generated skeleton, regardless of garrison.

Bootsiuv · Nov 17, 2009

Belizan said:
Ok, more bugs from Patch N...

- The burial ground of a warrior from a previous age event has (at least) two bugs. First, selecting "loot the grave" never appears to produce loot (done it about 7 times now). Second, if the looted square takes place on a city, the city is automatically captured/destroyed by the generated skeleton, regardless of garrison.

I think the "no loot" thing may be by design. IIRC, if you choose to loot the grave, all you get in return is a 3/4 :strength:

skeleton who IS NOT held and can thus be a minor annoyance in the extreme early game (I almost always send my initial warrior out to explore and have an undefended city for 5 to 7 turns (on Emperor). It will ruin about 1 in 20 games I would say, so not a big deal.

The real "reward" for that event, at least IMO, is to choose the -1 :food:

, +2

option, which yields a better tile and a HELD 3/4 :strength:

skeleton, which need only be killed to work the now better tile.

JujZe · Nov 19, 2009

A little problem: Infernal can't build sect of flies. (but heavy infantry instead)
Is there an easy way to fix this?

Del Valle · Nov 20, 2009

I have had a staggering amount of CTDs with this modmod. I've started three games with Scions of Patria and have had to stop playing each succesive one due to me saving the turn before the CTD. Some times I saved some turns before the CTD came up, so I would continue to play from that point a bit differently to avoid the same CTD until yet another CTD would occur. I love this modmod, but the stability is really irritating.

Just to compare, I've been playing vanilla FFH2 for two months and have had only seven crashes.

Here's the event logs:

Spoiler :

Belizan · Nov 20, 2009

Del Valle said:
I have had a staggering amount of CTDs with this modmod. I've started three games with Scions of Patria and have had to stop playing each succesive one due to me saving the turn before the CTD. Some times I saved some turns before the CTD came up, so I would continue to play from that point a bit differently to avoid the same CTD until yet another CTD would occur. I love this modmod, but the stability is really irritating.

Just to compare, I've been playing vanilla FFH2 for two months and have had only seven crashes.

That's surprising to me. I'd try reinstalling. I've found Orbis to be pretty stable. We play it *alot*, and so far we've had only one game go sideways on us around turn 400. And that game was messy :/.

Here's the event logs:

I don't know that the event logs are terribly useful for debugging purposes. Anyone whose going to try to debug your CTD issues directly would need the actual save games.

KrugSmash · Nov 21, 2009

Units killed by the Mercurian Herald's "Herald's Call" ability aren't being reborn as angels.

Belizan · Nov 21, 2009

A few more Patch N/FFH bugs:

- When you trade an arcane unit from one player to another, it gets to pick a free promotion again. (It also keeps any special traits it had from being in its original faction, e.g. Horselords, Aptitude, etc.).
- When conducting resource trading with another player, the trade interface does not take into account resources each player has access to as a result of other trade agreements.
- Pyre of Seraphic produces nothing (other then fire mana, of course).
- +1 Fire Affinity + Fire 1 = Fire 1. I *think* this is a bug? (In this case from the Scorched Staff). Similarly, +1 Wind Affinity + No Air = No Air.
- The Academy Training option is available on units who have already trained in the academy. Training a second time yields no benefits.
- The crazy old man shows up at the temple event has an option for every religion but Order.
- And there's some benefit which you get as Order that says "Requires Empyrean"... I'm just forgetting what it is now.... I'll try to find it later.
- Auric Ulvin and Charadon as a team summoned Basium. ... .....

Have I mentioned ranged striking xp?

Belizan · Nov 21, 2009

Hrm... another CTD save. Is there a debug DLL for Patch N around, Ahwaric?

Falc · Nov 22, 2009

Belizan said:
- +1 Fire Affinity + Fire 1 = Fire 1. I *think* this is a bug? (In this case from the Scorched Staff). Similarly, +1 Wind Affinity + No Air = No Air.

I think you've misunderstood what affinity means: it increases a unit's combat strength,*not* their 'rank' in that particular element. +1 affinity and 5 mana of that type = +5 strength.

scar2496 · Nov 22, 2009

..it seems that my scout is a big red blob ...why is that... i have bts 3.19 and all current patches of orbis.....still....

am playing as ethine the white of elohim.....

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