PAE V Patch 3

[H4run]

PAE V Patch 3 is out! See first post or PAE download thread.

HAVE LOADS OF FUN! The Germans do.... ​

downloading right now!

 

[Ramkhamhaeng]

The postcard-thread seemed to shoo away your users

 

[pie_at]

Do you think so?

But there is no need for writing a postcard! It's completely voluntary.

I'd say: CIV 4 gets old. Perhaps PAE with CIV 4 has reached its end....

 

[Antigenes2]

I haven't been driven away, but Pie deserves a rest before hearing lots of comments. Not that I have lots of comments. Well, one or two, but they might go away with further playing. So for now I'm just getting to know the new game

 

[pie_at]

Yes, thanks! Let me have a short break of modding! And in three or four weeks, I'd plan to go on. But time will tell...

 

[mourndraken]

It is fun to play this newest parch. It sure has some new play options from the 17 turns I've taken in scenario.

I can't count how much this game has amused me over the years. PAE keeps it new. There is so much content implemented in PAE, I doubt if I will ever be done with all of the games and nations that come to life in this mighty mod !

Very nice master creation by Pie.
How many years in the making ?

 

[Antigenes2]

I agree. PAE is always fresh and not old. Not that there's anything wrong with old games, new games may have a wow factor graphically but gameplay-wise most of them suck big time.

I'm still playing games like Panzer General and Terror From The Deep, which make CIV IV look like a spring chicken.

 

[mourndraken]

I don't think I play video games. I only own CIV4 and when I decide it's time .. it's PAE . I haven't any ambition to spend my wasted time playing some other game.

 

[H4run]

I don't know if civ 4 is really gets old, I mean the number of people who are viewing creation and customization of civ 4 currently for example are around 109 viewer, while those who are viewing civ 5 are around 169, in many other time the number even not so much different. The user are still quite active. And for me civ 4 is way much more powerful and the graphic is more beautiful than civ 5. I just hope they can do better for civ6 but for now I just stick with civ4.

 

[pie_at]

It is fun to play this newest parch. It sure has some new play options from the 17 turns I've taken in scenario.

I can't count how much this game has amused me over the years. PAE keeps it new. There is so much content implemented in PAE, I doubt if I will ever be done with all of the games and nations that come to life in this mighty mod !

Very nice master creation by Pie.
How many years in the making ?

thx mourn for your words!
Modding now takes about 5 years. But I have to say, I have no chance to spend lots of hours a day or even mod every day. And most of the time I read.

I agree. PAE is always fresh and not old. Not that there's anything wrong with old games, new games may have a wow factor graphically but gameplay-wise most of them suck big time.

I'm still playing games like Panzer General and Terror From The Deep, which make CIV IV look like a spring chicken.

That's true. I did also prefer X-Com - Enemy unknown!!

I don't think I play video games. I only own CIV4 and when I decide it's time .. it's PAE . I haven't any ambition to spend my wasted time playing some other game.

Thx!

I don't know if civ 4 is really gets old, I mean the number of people who are viewing creation and customization of civ 4 currently for example are around 109 viewer, while those who are viewing civ 5 are around 169, in many other time the number even not so much different. The user are still quite active. And for me civ 4 is way much more powerful and the graphic is more beautiful than civ 5. I just hope they can do better for civ6 but for now I just stick with civ4.

hm. ok.

 

[mourndraken]

trade winds and currents are disabled although the arrows still show up

 

[Antigenes2]

I've been playing for a couple of weeks now and I really like this new patch.

The only thing I don't like is the charge for using arrows. It doesn't make much sense to me to send your economy into the red for shooting a few arrows. The cost of swords/armour/training is abstracted into the cost of producing the unit so why does an archer have ongoing costs anyway?

It also feels like the cost is disproportionately high. I don't have any specific knowledge but I'd have thought the cost of even thousands of arrows wouldn't come close to knocking out even one suit of armour. On the American frontier arrowheads were being sold for 6 cents a dozen. I know that's mass production but it's an indication that these things are not expensive.

My other objection is just in gameplay terms. I find that now I'm not producing archers or using ranged combat hardly at all, one of the innovations of this mod. And I think that's a shame. I'm sure there are valid reasons for introducing it so this is just my opinion .

 

[Keinpferd]

I've been playing for a couple of weeks now and I really like this new patch.

The only thing I don't like is the charge for using arrows. It doesn't make much sense to me to send your economy into the red for shooting a few arrows. The cost of swords/armour/training is abstracted into the cost of producing the unit so why does an archer have ongoing costs anyway?

It also feels like the cost is disproportionately high. I don't have any specific knowledge but I'd have thought the cost of even thousands of arrows wouldn't come close to knocking out even one suit of armour. On the American frontier arrowheads were being sold for 6 cents a dozen. I know that's mass production but it's an indication that these things are not expensive.

My other objection is just in gameplay terms. I find that now I'm not producing archers or using ranged combat hardly at all, one of the innovations of this mod. And I think that's a shame. I'm sure there are valid reasons for introducing it so this is just my opinion .

In theory, it sounded convincing, that charging only the human player money for arrowheads and the AI not, would strengthen the AI a bit further. But in practice, it shows, the money costing ranged combat harshly devalues other game features, that involve money. For example, a spy destroys my farm, worth 10 gold. But I spent 35 gold for ranged combat during the last turn and will do the same on the next turn. Five turns later, another spy shows up and destroys one of my mines, worth 25 gold. So what.

I haven't calculated it, but I reckon, building cheap suicidal units in masses could be cheaper than maintaining a few ranged combat groups in different war theaters over a long period of time, who literally burn your money with their fire arrows.



New map
PAE players who don't like random maps and are looking for new playgrounds: Check out Thorgal's great new map, using the new black ice to decrease useless desert and tundra tiles. He added more space to the East and reduced some overabundant resources from previous versions. The map is based on InEx's superb original map, which I made useable for PAE.

 

[pie_at]

thx Antigenes for your post.

I don't think it's that expensive you can't afford it. First of all: a simple tactic before was: going through the map with 15 archers and 5 melee. You could win everything and conquer cities every few turns. THAT was not my intention with ranged combat. And that's why it was necessary to find a new solution.

I began to research.
Archery was not often used. It was a long time (to the Middle Ages) a dishonorable thing. But how can I tell that a human player? The HI uses this to excess!

The gold per turn corresponds to the unit rations. Not to shoot means no cost of money. Therefore, I did not increase their cost per turn.

And there was one scene in the movie Braveheart, that fairly well illustrates this:

Not the archers. My scouts tell me their archers are miles away and no threat to us. Arrows cost money. Use up the Irish. The dead cost nothing.

That's the truth.

But ok, if you find it too expensive in the first era, I can set it one gold cheaper (so 1 instead of 2).
But what do others think about? Is it really too expensive? (later on (late antiquity) it is possible that you earn between 100-300 gold per turn)

 

[Antigenes2]

thx Antigenes for your post.

I don't think it's that expensive you can't afford it. First of all: a simple tactic before was: going through the map with 15 archers and 5 melee. You could win everything and conquer cities every few turns. THAT was not my intention with ranged combat. And that's why it was necessary to find a new solution.

I began to research.
Archery was not often used. It was a long time (to the Middle Ages) a dishonorable thing. But how can I tell that a human player? The HI uses this to excess!

The gold per turn corresponds to the unit rations. Not to shoot means no cost of money. Therefore, I did not increase their cost per turn.

And there was one scene in the movie Braveheart, that fairly well illustrates this:

That's the truth.

But ok, if you find it too expensive in the first era, I can set it one gold cheaper (so 1 instead of 2).
But what do others think about? Is it really too expensive? (later on (late antiquity) it is possible that you earn between 100-300 gold per turn)

Lol. I think that quote shows as much about the speaker's contempt for the Irish as it does about the cost of arrows, even if you consider Braveheart to be historically accurate.

I accept that the HI uses archers to a greater extent than they were used hisorically, but so too does the AI. I suspect that in random games and non-barb maps that archer costs are not that big a handicap. But on barbarian maps, where you may face a horde of barbarian archers? If you can't use your own archers to wear them down (and you can't afford to) only the most experienced players are going to survive.

I still disagree as to cost. After a battle soldiers will retrieve spent arrows wherever possible and wastage would be considerably less than every arrow. Nor would there be a continual drain on the treasury while on campaign. Rather, there'd be a continual drain of arrows (which I accept you can't model).

I get the desire to continually make the mod harder, and that's perfectly fine. Don't get me wrong, I still love it and will continue to play it but I do wonder if the mod is becoming too hard for new or casual players.

Now I'll shut up

 

[mourndraken]

there are so many ways to get cash in PAE.

1. sell my map
2. use merchant / trader
3. sell a unit
4. sell a slave
5. go with zero research the turn before (my favorite)

we can always get some cash, but human wave attacks cause lots of collateral damage..

 

[Keinpferd]

That's true. (And number 6: sell cheap old techs to the techwise behind civs; they give you all the money they have.)

Maybe in late antiquity, your people should ask for festivities and ludi frequently or expect subsidized grain prices, that you have to pay extra money for? But that would be to Rome centered, I guess. Leave alone the most hated "inflation" from Civ 3…

 

[mourndraken]

That's true. (And number 6: sell cheap old techs to the techwise behind civs; they give you all the money they have.)

Maybe in late antiquity, your people should ask for festivities and ludi frequently or expect subsidized grain prices, that you have to pay extra money for? But that would be to Rome centered, I guess. Leave alone the most hated "inflation" from Civ 3…

yes more things to amuse the Human.

 

[thatoneguy_2008]

Haven't used the previous patches, so need a little help. Do you have to individually go into every single sub-folder and copy every single file into the corresponding sub-folder, or is there an easier way (windows). Seems like it would take forever?

And do I need to do the first 2 patches first, or if I just do this one will it include everything?

 

[Ramkhamhaeng]

Hello,

no you can copy recursively.
Firstly, go into
[...]\Mods/PieAncientEuropeV and remove the PublicMaps folder.
Secondly, extract the rar-Archive. This should create the folder 'PAEV_Patch3'. Now, select all files+subfolders in this folder and copy them into the mod directory. If windows asks if you really want overwrite existing files, say yes to all. (If windows not ask you probably not copied into the right destination!)