Discussion in 'Civ4 -ISDG 2012' started by Sommerswerd, Aug 17, 2011.
I think it's the other way around. You pick leader first.
I think WePlayCiv gets to choose Civ OR leader, either one. Then Civforum chooses Civ OR Leader, regardless of which one WePlayCiv picks. Then Apolyton, etc, so it would be entirely reasonable to expect something like:
Someone authoritative wanna clear this up?
There is no obligation to pick nation or civ 1st. You can pick either one.
civs/leaders. OK, I see
Still not convinced Filon understands, but thank you plako for confirming 'no restrictions'.
I understand your example
Oh, good. Never mind, then.
@LP Germans vote on difficulty was Immortal.
(We didn't want to scare you off with deity )
That's the correct interpretation of "snake pick". Each team can decide whether it seems more valuable to them to pick civ first or leader first.
Okay... if that's your vote, that's up to you. (I didn't have a chance to update the excel sheet yet.)
Remember that Immortal + Toroidal would have crippling maintenance costs for everyone (expansion painfully slow), not to mention further skewed barbarians (if they're on).
We're fully aware of the consequences LP
Manolo, your mod enforces a turn order upon the declaration of war, correct? So what about double moves occurring on the turn war is declared?
Team B plays
Team A plays, moves units out from hiding (e.g. mounted or naval stack)
Team A plays, declares war and moves units again
Team B plays
Is there anything in the mod to prevent this? Generally the double moves on the first turn of a war are the MOST harmful.
If it turns out we're going to have to rely on a written rule against double moves regardless, then it rather defeats the purpose of using a mod. Far simpler to just have a rule, rather than a rule + a mod which doesn't fully fix the problem.
Agree, it would be great and complete work if this feature to not allow declaration if will conduct double-move could be implemented in the mod.
Wait a moment ....
I'm trying to find someone to translate my answer
Even if the original (tested) version of the mod does not address the first turn of war (ie the move order on the turn BEFORE war is delcared), the only alternative to using the double move mod is having a rule. Even those who are not as keen on the mod are OK with a rule. So it should be perfectly fine to have a rule to address the first turn of war and let the mod take over after that.
actually, you are correct on that the mod no not control the first turn double turn . But the wabpage aptmod.con does it. It not prevent to do in it, but if you do it the page will send a mail to all team taking notice of the situation.
If you have to have a rule anyway, why have the mod?
The argument has been that a mod to prevent double moving is superior to a rule governing it. For those of us that believe this argument, it does not simply evaporate if the mod misses a single turn of combat. For those remaining turns a mod to prevent double moving is still superior to a rule.
Generally I come down on the side of trusting players, and teams, to act honorably. However in this case, with a mod that is well tested, and prevents not only malevolence, but also accidental double moving, I see so little downside to using this mod that I'm all for it. If we only need to focus on avoiding double moves for a single turn each war there's going to be far less conflict over this issue than you'd see in a normal game.
Also, do we know that the timing for Civ and leader selection will be? Should teams be submitting a short list of ranked choices for the first round, or will there be time for us to discuss what our selection should be based on the actions of the teams preceding us?
Once two civilizations get in war, the mod assures these civilizations are always in the same turn order (and it gives the same time for each one of them)
This feature is optional now. It can be enabled/disabled by the admin through the website.
In the Spanish forums, we have a rule for the first turn which we didn't want to implement in the mod, so we do it on the website.In the case you mention, in turn X+1 a warning is displayed on the website to remain A-Team of it cannot declare a war until B-Team has played -and if it did it in spite of this, a warning is sent to the game admin-.
Currently, we allow A to declare a war upon B, but just after at least 12 hours since the turn begins we firstly thought this was time enough to B for having a look on the game, but currently a new mod/web version will change this feature as follows:
Turn X+1. A-Team will see on the web that they cannot declare a war upon B until B has played this turn.Problem: if B takes too long to play, A-Team will run out time to play at worst, A-Team will have 5 minutes to play before the turn ends-.
Solution: If this situation occurs, A-Team can click a button on the website which will enlarge the As turn for 24 hours as soon as B play its turn and B are forbidden to entry the game again for this turn. Then A-Team has 24 hours to log in and declare war upon B -by playing as second player in the turn-.
A question on snake pick draft -- do the teams' choices get revealed before the next team picks? I'd assume yes...
I'd suggest planning a date/time for the leaders to get together and do this live. Maybe an IRC chat, and/or the picks being posted in the forum as it goes? The various teams might want to have team chats to discuss their strategy, and maybe give each team up to 30 minutes on the clock to make their pick? Or a set time when they pick?
It might be interesting to have trades, like you see in professional sports. "We'll swap picks with you in exchange for 10gpt for 20 turns" type trades. But I don't think that's actually doable so it's not a serious suggestion.
Since WPC got the top position, I guess this is less of an issue for us than most, but I personally don't like the idea of doing it that quick. Our team is spread out over all different timezones, so getting them all together for one chat is highly unlikely for that reason alone. And having such a big choice as this made by only the few members able to attend is undesirable.
We're "allowing" at least a week for the map to be made, right? So I'd say give each team 24 hours to make a pick from the time the previous team posts their pick. (Lord Parkin seems to have stepped up as master of rule-making ceremonies, so give WPC 24 hours from his officially closing of rules voting on the 4th to start things off.) I realize that could stretch out a ways in the absolute worst case, but teams are gonna want to react to the picks made before them.
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