Power TO the people

ok. maybe then it should be clarified there when those should take place (they never did though to override a forum decision)
 
Regarding the discussion on citizen input. I think I've found a fair method to address this. What I've been doing is not carrying on conversation in my department thread. I've only been posting links to things there (polls, discussions, etc). When an item is closed I then edit the original post with a closure message. This keeps the official thread pretty clean. People can subscribe to that thread to be advised of when something new happens but don't have to be deluged with many alerts when the conversation on an item isn't interesting to them. It also keeps things on target as there won't be several different conversations for different topics happening at the same time.

I start a new thread with my proposed chat instructions for each turn as soon as I can evaluate the last save (and then post a link to this thread in my department thread).

Note that I haven't discouraged anybody from posting in the Foreign Affairs thread. I just don't start conversations there so there don't tend to be any in the thread.

Anyway, I've gotten very good feedback for the past two chat turn instructions and I'm much more comfortable that my proposals are accepted by the general public.
 
Originally posted by disorganizer
ok. maybe then it should be clarified there when those should take place (they never did though to override a forum decision)
Actually, I think we're on the same page and are just getting messed up by terminology.

If a Citizen Spot Poll is basically anything the Designated Player (Pres) wants an opinion on then that's got no problems with the constitution as it is. A Council Spot Vote is for when the President needs to override a Leader. As long as those two are kept separate then there's nothing wrong with that part of the proposal.

There is still a problem with the wording on how the polls are valued though. I believe very strongly that if a poll is held the results should be followed.
 
poll in the forum:
poll must be followed

poll in the chat (citizen spot-poll):
veto right is needed to prevent citizens to take over the chat-polls (like a complete citizen group joins the chat and over-voted all others). the problem of misusing the veto is adressed by an automatic investigation in the forum. if veto is misused, then the responsible person in sued.
 
1.) Citizens can talk if they have productive advice or are asked by an official.

I think this should be changed to:

"Citizens are encouraged to provide constructive advice & positively contribute to the chat."

I think the background for the original rule was that we got a bit of bad traffic when we started turn chats. However, the wording of this rule seems a bit negative when read in context.
 
  1. Only citizens of the demogame will be voiced.
  2. Citizens are encouraged to provide constructive advice & positively contribute to the chat. They can also take part in any Citizen Spot Poll.
  3. The Designated Player reserves the right to use Cabinet Votes instead of Citizen Spot Polls.
  4. Spaming, lobbying, repetive questions and any other unnecessary traffic in the chat is forbidden.
  5. Clones are not allowed!
  6. Violations of the chat rules will result in the offender being devoiced.
  7. The chat operators hold the right to devoice all non-officials if the chat gets too confusing or is disturbed by someone permanently. The decision for this is taken by the Designated Player.
  8. Devoicing actions will be investigated in the forum.
  9. During turn-chat, #civfanatics is still open for totally free discussions. Departments or special interest groups can also open private discussion rooms.
    [/list=1]

    A bit of reorganizing and editing. Changes are rewording the "invitation to speak" per chiefpaco's suggestion and altering the Poll Veto clause. Instead of reserving the right to Veto, it reserves the right to not use the Citizen Polls. I am very, very against taking a poll and ignoring the results. If the dynamics of the room would lead to catastrophic Citizen Poll results this lets the Designated Player use Council Votes instead.

    Comments? Suggestions? Anybody care for a mint? :)

    EDIT: Should devoicing everybody except the officials require a Council Vote? This is a heavy burden with equally heavy repercussions. It's a lot to lay on one person.
 
I like it Shaitan. I say, the first non-cabinet citizen of this game that replies here gets a mint & a brand new home in Miami :) In fact, what do the non-cabinet members think about this motion?
 
If I resign my post and then reply here can I get the home in Miami? Could it be in Chatanooga instead? Florida's too hot for me. I like it nice and cool, like it is here in Georgia. ;)
 
there should also be a investigation when the "cabinet-poll instead citizen poll" option is used. otherwise the cabinet could easily go over citizens opinion when critical decisions are taken. they should have a reason for doing it.
 
Originally posted by disorganizer
there should also be a investigation when the "cabinet-poll instead citizen poll" option is used. otherwise the cabinet could easily go over citizens opinion when critical decisions are taken. they should have a reason for doing it.
Good point. Checks and balances...

8. Devoicing actions and the exclusion of Citizen Spot Polls will be investigated in the forum.
 
Clones are not allowed!

Um, regarding this, could I have an unvoiced clone in case my java client crashes as in the last turn chat? The clone would only be voiced if I ping timeout. This avoids me "blacking out" for a few minutes. I am forced to used the java client due to firewall reasons.
 
well. you should ask the op which is in the channel. when he allows this, yes. but this clone will not be allowed to vote then. you know we will still handle the chat as unburocratic as possible.
all and everything for our citizens, you know?
 
It looks like Padma has won the new home in Miami! Congratulations! :lol: Will you be moving? What will you do with your mint? ;)
 
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