mazzz
Emperor
People are always making threads challenging believers to prove God exists. Now lets see if you guys (Curt,ect.) can make your case.
Prove God does not exist!
- Thread starter mazzz
- Start date
hbdragon88
haunted by blackness
When Homer got the cryon removed from his brain and became smart, he proved that God did not exist. Flanders could not disprove Homer's work and burned the proof up.
newfangle
hates you.
BLARRRGGGHHHH!!!!
If ONE more person completely ignores the art of logic, I am going to kill 100 puppies!
THE ONUS OF PROOF IS ON THE ONE WHO ASSERTS THE SILLINESS! Get over it!
If ONE more person completely ignores the art of logic, I am going to kill 100 puppies!
THE ONUS OF PROOF IS ON THE ONE WHO ASSERTS THE SILLINESS! Get over it!
Perfection
The Great Head.
Why not kill them anyways? Puppies are vile.newfangle said:
Duddha
His Dudeness
mazzz, if you are going to put hypothesis forward that god exists, you also have to set forth conditions that would either prove you right or wrong. So do it!
Edit: You would be smarter than any of us if you succesfully did.
Edit: You would be smarter than any of us if you succesfully did.
No, the onus of proof is on whoever makes any sort of claim, whatever that claim may be. And correct me if I'm wrong, but Curt regularly claims that God (and all of its equivalent incarnations) does not exist, seemingly with as much assurance as the theists claiming God (or an equivalent incarnation) does exist.newfangle said:
You cannot prove a negative. So, as frustrating as it is, the burden of proof lies with those who claim something positive.
Prove...
God exists
Evolution is true
aliens built the pyramids
the big bang really happened
flies come from meat
Curt is an evolved alien god who built the pyramids
etc.
Prove...
God exists
Evolution is true
aliens built the pyramids
the big bang really happened
flies come from meat
Curt is an evolved alien god who built the pyramids
etc.
Sanaz
Gorilla Joe
Of course you can prove a negative, that's a silly statement to make. Then again, maybe you just cannot prove you cannot prove a negative?Birdjaguar said:
Both proving and disproving the existence of god is probably equally difficult/impossible.
I define god as everything that exists just beyond my knowledge. I can gather facts and pieces of information, but when it comes time to make a decision, there is always at least one thing I don't know, and by definition, I don't know what this is or how to find out what it is. I depend on my intuition to fill in that last bit for me, and for that intuition, I pray to god. Anyone can make a judgment for what that is I am praying to/for.
KaNick
Deity
You wish me to prove god does not exist? Fine. The existance of God has never been proven so therefor it is a myth, a legend.
Aphex_Twin
Evergreen
- Joined
- Sep 7, 2002
- Messages
- 7,474
Of course, one could simply claim ignorance and get away with itnewfangle said:
Sims2789
Fool me once...
The Laws of Physics state that there is a finite amount of matter in the Universe, thus God could not have created the Universe. However, I cannot prove that God doesn;t exist. However, there is also no proof of His/Her/Its/Their existance, so I choose to not believe in God. It is the believers who hold the burden of proof, not I, just like in court, someone isn't convicted of something until proven guilty.
Stapel
FIAT 850 coupé
In a not so serious way:
Give me proof that the pink invisible, untouchable teacup did not create our world and did not send his son to die for our sins.
Then give me proof there is no invisible planet 12 lightyears away, where CIV 83 is already out, and nude girls run around to please all men.
Then I will proof God doesn't exist.
Give me proof that the pink invisible, untouchable teacup did not create our world and did not send his son to die for our sins.
Then give me proof there is no invisible planet 12 lightyears away, where CIV 83 is already out, and nude girls run around to please all men.
Then I will proof God doesn't exist.
valamas
Prince
Religion is hypicritical because it is based on and is a lie.
"Oh god in heaven, please help the people crushed by the earthquake you set upon their church."
Eat my shorts!
"Oh god in heaven, please help the people crushed by the earthquake you set upon their church."
Eat my shorts!
philippe
FYI, I chase trains.
Stapel said:In a not so serious way:
Then give me proof there is no invisible planet 12 lightyears away, where CIV 83 is already out, and nude girls run around to please all men.
QUOTE]
I want that so badly!!!!!!!
anyway it is easy to proof he doesn't exists.
He has no father or mother so he cannot be born so he doesn't exists
or you could say he is a 1 celled organism but they don't create universm and dont look like humans
The way I see it, if you wish to assert anything as truth, you need to be able to prove it. If you simply believe that god exists or doesn't, there is no burden of proof, as you are entitled to your beliefs. However, when you begin to claim that your viewpoint is a truth, then you must prove it.
Now, I would like to see one of the quite devoit atheists here prove to me that god does not exist...
Now, I would like to see one of the quite devoit atheists here prove to me that god does not exist...
Stapel
FIAT 850 coupé
In a more serious way:
The non-existance of anything cannot be proven. Therefor the non-existance of any deity at all cannot be proven.
The non-existance of God, Allah, Hindu spirits or Buddha spritits can be proven to a certain extend: The exclude each other.
What does this prove? This simply proves that billions of people can believe in the same non-existant deity or deities. It proofs that if there is no deity, people will still believe in it.
The only religion I really know something about, is the Christian religion.
There are many pieces of evidence (which is, I agree, not the same as proof), that is was created without any divine influence.
In general, the bible looks exactly like it was written by humans, without any divine influence. Some authors were probably thinking they were inspired by God, others were probably faking it.
By pure chance, I did read Jeremiah's tow old testament books: When I read that Jeremiah tells people to give up resistance to the the Babylonians, as the near defeat of Judah is the punishment of God, and then I read that Nebukadnezzar orders all men to be killed, except Jeremiah, I draw a very very simple conclusion:
Jeremiah was a dirty traitor. Bribed by the Babs. He simply wrote his books to cover his own behind! From a non-theistic, purely historic point of view, this makes so much more sense!
The New testament, the actual basis of the Christian religion, is quite something.
For those who are really interested in its origin, I recommend Robert Eisenman's analysis on the dead sea rolls (Jesus' brother James' view on Saul/Paul is rather interesting) and also Timothy Freke and Peter Gandy's "The Jesus Mysteries", who tell us about the Dionysos myth, which origin from 100BC or so, and has the following aspects:
-a virgin mother
-driving out demons
-healing sick people
-turning water into wine
-dying for our sins
-being crucified
-having 12 disciples
-rising from death on the 3rd day.
-having 3 females visitors, finding an empty tomb
-birth being predicted by a star
-born on 25th of december or 6th of january
-dying and rising around easter
-several other similarities
This clearly proves that Jesus' miracles were copied, when the synoptic gospels were created.
From a historical view, there is no doubt Jesus was an afterwards constructed hero!
There might have been people who thought Jesus of Nazareth was the Messiah sent by God, during his life, but around 0 AD, many people were seem as the promised Messiah.
It is more likely that only after Jesus' death or disappearance, he was seen as the Messiah.
Then Saul of Tarsus comes along. He is a Roman. He is an early-christians chaser. He used to work for the Roman army. He writes down pro-Roman epistals. He is constantly protected by the Roman. He knows many Roman officials.
Furthermore, there is historical evidence the Romans had an efficient secret service system at the time (read work from Col. Rose Mary Sheldon, Department of History, Virginia Military Institute). It is simply almost impossible Paul was not asked by the Roman government to work for them.
Once you can accept the bible is NOT devine, it all makes so much sense!
The non-existance of anything cannot be proven. Therefor the non-existance of any deity at all cannot be proven.
The non-existance of God, Allah, Hindu spirits or Buddha spritits can be proven to a certain extend: The exclude each other.
What does this prove? This simply proves that billions of people can believe in the same non-existant deity or deities. It proofs that if there is no deity, people will still believe in it.
The only religion I really know something about, is the Christian religion.
There are many pieces of evidence (which is, I agree, not the same as proof), that is was created without any divine influence.
In general, the bible looks exactly like it was written by humans, without any divine influence. Some authors were probably thinking they were inspired by God, others were probably faking it.
By pure chance, I did read Jeremiah's tow old testament books: When I read that Jeremiah tells people to give up resistance to the the Babylonians, as the near defeat of Judah is the punishment of God, and then I read that Nebukadnezzar orders all men to be killed, except Jeremiah, I draw a very very simple conclusion:
Jeremiah was a dirty traitor. Bribed by the Babs. He simply wrote his books to cover his own behind! From a non-theistic, purely historic point of view, this makes so much more sense!
The New testament, the actual basis of the Christian religion, is quite something.
For those who are really interested in its origin, I recommend Robert Eisenman's analysis on the dead sea rolls (Jesus' brother James' view on Saul/Paul is rather interesting) and also Timothy Freke and Peter Gandy's "The Jesus Mysteries", who tell us about the Dionysos myth, which origin from 100BC or so, and has the following aspects:
-a virgin mother
-driving out demons
-healing sick people
-turning water into wine
-dying for our sins
-being crucified
-having 12 disciples
-rising from death on the 3rd day.
-having 3 females visitors, finding an empty tomb
-birth being predicted by a star
-born on 25th of december or 6th of january
-dying and rising around easter
-several other similarities
This clearly proves that Jesus' miracles were copied, when the synoptic gospels were created.
From a historical view, there is no doubt Jesus was an afterwards constructed hero!
There might have been people who thought Jesus of Nazareth was the Messiah sent by God, during his life, but around 0 AD, many people were seem as the promised Messiah.
It is more likely that only after Jesus' death or disappearance, he was seen as the Messiah.
Then Saul of Tarsus comes along. He is a Roman. He is an early-christians chaser. He used to work for the Roman army. He writes down pro-Roman epistals. He is constantly protected by the Roman. He knows many Roman officials.
Furthermore, there is historical evidence the Romans had an efficient secret service system at the time (read work from Col. Rose Mary Sheldon, Department of History, Virginia Military Institute). It is simply almost impossible Paul was not asked by the Roman government to work for them.
Once you can accept the bible is NOT devine, it all makes so much sense!
It's funny how often this comes around.....
Some agreed constants might help:
1. It is impossible to prove or disprove the existence of an abstract principle such as god
2. Given the 'exclusive' nature of many religions, it is clear that many people believe in a non-existent god - hence belief in god and personal 'god-affirming experiences', however sincere, can carry no value in support of the proposed existence of god (argument copyright Stapel 2004!)
3 Sincere belief in a religion may help people achieve inner balance and enhance their ability to deal with life's difficulties.
4. Sincere belief in a religion may encourage the performance of 'good' deeds, i.e. actions generally considered to be of benefit to society generally rather than the individual.
5. Organised religion is a powerful tool for control and management of society, and has been used for this purpose by rulers across many religions, cultures and time periods.
6. Religion as an institution has been misused by many individuals throughout history, and misused/misdirected religion has been a source of great harm to the world.
OK, now have fun folks....
Some agreed constants might help:
1. It is impossible to prove or disprove the existence of an abstract principle such as god
2. Given the 'exclusive' nature of many religions, it is clear that many people believe in a non-existent god - hence belief in god and personal 'god-affirming experiences', however sincere, can carry no value in support of the proposed existence of god (argument copyright Stapel 2004!)
3 Sincere belief in a religion may help people achieve inner balance and enhance their ability to deal with life's difficulties.
4. Sincere belief in a religion may encourage the performance of 'good' deeds, i.e. actions generally considered to be of benefit to society generally rather than the individual.
5. Organised religion is a powerful tool for control and management of society, and has been used for this purpose by rulers across many religions, cultures and time periods.
6. Religion as an institution has been misused by many individuals throughout history, and misused/misdirected religion has been a source of great harm to the world.
OK, now have fun folks....
CurtSibling
ENEMY ACE™
- Joined
- Aug 31, 2001
- Messages
- 29,453
mazzz said:
Simple answer.
I don't have to.
I don't believe in a god anyway.
You are making the claims - Prove them.
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