Prove God Exists - Act Three

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WS78 said:
Maybe we should ask proof of Satan, then we will know that God exists.

'Satan' is pure myth, invented by ancients to scare the flock, and rebranded from Persian lore in the dark ages.

As a metaphor for human action, I guess this figures makes interesting study.
 
I suppose I will, briefly, enter this fray.

The facts:

- There are no facts to prove that God exists.
- There are no facts to disprove that God exists.
- Individuals have to make their best "guess".
 
John HSOG said:
I suppose I will, briefly, enter this fray.

The facts:

- There are no facts to prove that God exists.
- There are no facts to disprove that God exists.
- Individuals have to make their best "guess".

Refreshlingly open-minded, John!

Good post.
 
Was that supposed to be sarcastic or serious?
 
FearlessLeader2 said:
As we have gone over in some detail in an older thread, the Bible book of Genesis, supposedly authored by a 'Palestinian goatherd' (Moses) managed to get every detail of Creation right that it recorded, even those that pre-dated man, and even life. Are we then, to assume that Moses, a 'Palestinian goatherd', managed to conjure up one lucky guess after another starting with the Big Bangs and ending with the arrival of man? Luck like that IS a miracle.

I hate to get into an argument like this, but I'm afraid the views here are not at all those of academics and scholars. Genesis was certainly not written by Moses, who, if he existed, lived in around 1,200BC. In any case, he was not Palestinian but Egyptian; the explanation given in Exodus 2:10 for Moses' name is improbable, given that it is simply a slight variation on a typical Egyptian name.

In fact, the Pentateuch makes no claims to authorship of any kind and indeed describes the death of Moses near the end of Deuteronomy. In fact, most scholars agree that the whole Pentateuch, including Genesis, as we know it came into being in the sixth century BC or thereabouts (that is, approximately the time of the Babylonian exile). It was based on various stories that had circulated for many years beforehand, so what we have is not what someone simply sat down and wrote one day, but has a long tradition of oral and written transmission behind it. Since the early nineteenth century, scholars have been able to sift the text and discern some of its sources, because different passages feature different vocubulary and different ideas. For example, although people talk about "the creation story", Genesis actually has two - 1:1 to 2:6, and then 2:7 to 2:25. In the first, God creates the world bit by bit, ending with men and women. In the latter, God creates man, then the world around him, and finally woman. Moreover, each story uses a different name for God. It's clues like these that indicate different sources and traditions behind the text as we have it.

I don't understand the claim that either of these stories reflects modern scientific thinking. Modern scientists believe that birds evolved from land animals, not before them. They also think that land animals evolved from water-dwelling life, rather than being spontaneously generated by the land itself in Aristotelian fashion. They also regard whales as the descendants of land mammals, and did not exist before them or come into being with fish. The notion that all animals were once wholly herbivorous, and that carnivorous animals came into being only after human beings had appeared, does not tally well with the body of scientific opinion. And I am unaware of any scientific evidence that female humans developed out of male ribs.
 
And I am unaware of any scientific evidence that female humans developed out of male ribs.

I don't know if you meant it to be so, but that was funny as hell! :lol:
 
John HSOG said:
Was that supposed to be sarcastic or serious?

How suspicious thou art!

I was being serious and complimentary! :(

Ho-hum, I guess you regard me that much an adversary.
 
CurtSibling said:
How suspicious thou art!

I was being serious and complimentary! :(

Ho-hum, I guess you regard me that much an adversary.

I was confident that you were being serious, but I wanted to be sure and, also, add another post to my total so I could be cool, like you, someday. ;)
 
John HSOG said:
I was confident that you were being serious, but I wanted to be sure and, also, add another post to my total so I could be cool, like you, someday. ;)

I will overlook your transgression this time, my son! :D
 
BRAIN FART!

EDIT - Pretend I said something very interesting and provocative, then quote me and go "wow!"
 
John HSOG said:
BRAIN FART!

EDIT - Pretend I said something very interesting and provokative, then quote me and go "wow!"

You get more academic each day, sir! :lol:
 
Oh, I was browsing your websites. You do good work.
 
Bah!

One or two of several hundred posts being off-topic will do no harm!
 
Plotinus said:
And I am unaware of any scientific evidence that female humans developed out of male ribs.
What better scientific evidence you want, you unbeliever, than the quotes from the Bible? It was written by the scientist known as Moses; this is also known as Moses' Evolution!
 
Perfection said:
The acknowldegement that we don't know is less wacky than asserting god created it.

FearlessLeader2 said:
With no other factors to consider, I'd agree with you. But the Bible exists. As we have gone over in some detail in an older thread, the Bible book of Genesis, supposedly authored by a 'Palestinian goatherd' (Moses) managed to get every detail of Creation right that it recorded, even those that pre-dated man, and even life. Are we then, to assume that Moses, a 'Palestinian goatherd', managed to conjure up one lucky guess after another starting with the Big Bangs and ending with the arrival of man? Luck like that IS a miracle.

Really, FL2? So you are saying the Bible is proof of god's existance? I would have expected better logic from a seasoned debater like you. I could easily say that the Iliad and the Odyssey are proof of Zeus's existance. And the fact that the illogical creation story in Genesis is included only serves to amplify our notion that it was written by man, without divine influence.

I have a question for you, and all the other Christians browsing this thread. How can you trust the Bible? If the Bible was written by man, it could have mistakes in it, and even if it was written by god or with divine influence, then god could have lied in it. The Bible was either written by man or god. Therefore either it could have mistakes or it could have lies in it. Also, it was written 2000 years ago. People believed in all sorts of crazy crap back then. In any case, it is unreliable.

And since you are against evolution, FL2, why not take the challenge in my signature? Not doing so will cause you to burn in hell. :satan: ;)
 
Interesting fact rarely mentioned by evangelicals: 1 Kings 22 presents God as deliberately lying in order to mislead someone. Therefore you can believe that God always tells the truth, or you can believe that the Bible is true in every part, but you cannot consistently believe both.
 
Good find, Plotinus. See, FL2? The Bible is not to be trusted as fact.
 
Hmm... *unwilling to go back and read through the great multitude of posts*... so I'll just ask: Has anyone here read Angels & Demons by Dan Brown? It won't give you any definite answers on God or science, or any answers at all, really, but it will sure as hell make you think... [The Da Vinci Code is better, though, so make sure you read that, if you somehow haven't ;) ]

I don't think God exists, evolution rules... and all that crap. I don't really feel the need to defend my grounds for this, since they've all been covered by my predecessors ( :king: ). But if anyone really must know, just ask... *i have a feeling i'm making a mistake* :rolleyes:
 
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