Quick Answers / 'Newbie' Questions

I've never played civ4 multiplayer but i'm just curious. do you wait all the way until other player finish their turn? that will be a kind of boring i think.
Depends on the game type. PBEM's are the slowest and generally average about 1 turn per day with reliable players. Pitboss games generally tend to be about 1 turn per day as well. However, you can set up 'quick fire' Direct IP matches quite easily, which are far faster than Hotseat and almost the same speed as your normal single player game (2-3 turns per minute).
 
hi,
I win at prince fairly easily by now and want to try monarch level. can you give me advice as to which world size/ map type/ civilization or leader works best for an "easy" monarch game, so the step up is not quite as fatal for me?

If you have any good general tips for monarch I`ll be grateful for those as well

thanks :)
 
hi,
I win at prince fairly easily by now and want to try monarch level. can you give me advice as to which world size/ map type/ civilization or leader works best for an "easy" monarch game, so the step up is not quite as fatal for me?

If you have any good general tips for monarch I`ll be grateful for those as well

thanks :)

I don't have preferences for certain leaders. I do like the financial and charismatic traits, but other players prefer other traits so that's just linked to your playing style.

Smaller maps are deemed easier because military aggression leads to relatively larger gains. The human player will always be the better military tactician.

Some general tips to make the jump to higher difficulty levels:

1) If you like to build many wonders, then you might want to reconsider that preference. In the early game, a world wonder costs about as much as a settler or two. So you have to ask yourself if you would rather have a world wonder and 3 cities or no world wonder and 5 cities. The world wonder is often not worth it.

2) The barbarians will appear sooner and in bigger numbers. So you can't just research some stuff and expect to have decent defenders when the barbarians start attacking. You have to make sure you develop the military technologies and find some horses or copper in time. Archers can save you without these resources, but it is easier with horses or copper.

3) When you start with mysticism and research for hinduism or budism, then it's not sure that you'll get it. It depends on the starting position of you and the AI and whether the AI happens to be researching the same technology. It's a bit of a gamble. On the lower difficulty levels you tend to win this race. And when you lose it, then it's not that bad. On the higher difficulty levels, you can't miss too many gambles.

What sort of bonuses are there for the AI at Noble? And I thought that, for example, the difficulty level being at Diety made you at Noble and the AI at Settler, or something like that, is that correct?

At noble, the AI has 70% of your inflation, 70% of your war weariness, 30% of your upgrade costs and 35% of your supply costs, but the main modifiers like growth rate, production rate and science rate are all the same as yours. There are no big bonusses for the AI at noble level.

The AI has lots of bonusses at deity level. Take a look at the file CIV4HandicapInfo.xml in ...\Civilization 4\Warlords\Assets\XML\GameInfo
This file contains all of the modifiers. If you don't understand some of them, then just ask here.
 
Question: I'm playing with Sevomod's mod, and am noticing a significant lack of warfare between civilizations in my first game. Aggressive AI is turned on, there are 14 civs and I've got wind of at most 2 foreign states of war and I'm 716 turns in. Looking at the attitude matrix in the foreign advisor section most of the attitudes are generally in the plus, while I have 4 in the positive, 7 in the negative, and a few evens. Among foreign relations, there are 27 marks that are in the negative, in a grad that includes 144 A:B relationships (that don't include my civ).

I wonder how this could be because I have no choice but to irritate other civilizations. If I make any one trade with Civ X, some other civ (Civ Y) might have a simple -1 perception of that Civ X for whatever reason. When I refuse to cease trading with Civ X, and I then get docked -1 in Civ Y's estimation. While I illustrated that there are not many bad relationships (18%), these are enough to get most of the civs in the game angry at me for trading with their "worst enemies". I find this to be a laugh since I wonder how bad can they be if you've never been at war with them?

Mostly I have no question with this, since I can handle having people not like me. What bugs me is that the game doesn't seem to model one AI demanding of another that it stop trading with a third. The matrix shows you the plusses and minuses for all civs and there's not a "You refused to stop trading with our worst enemy!" to be found. I figure this is partly why there's so little war. Am I right, and is there a way to remedy this? I've mucked a little with XML a little, in order to decrease the happiness a civ gets by being the same religion, and to increase the tension caused by close borders, but to little avail.
 
Question: I'm playing with Sevomod's mod, and am noticing a significant lack of warfare between civilizations in my first game. Aggressive AI is turned on, there are 14 civs and I've got wind of at most 2 foreign states of war and I'm 716 turns in. Looking at the attitude matrix in the foreign advisor section most of the attitudes are generally in the plus, while I have 4 in the positive, 7 in the negative, and a few evens. Among foreign relations, there are 27 marks that are in the negative, in a grad that includes 144 A:B relationships (that don't include my civ).

I wonder how this could be because I have no choice but to irritate other civilizations. If I make any one trade with Civ X, some other civ (Civ Y) might have a simple -1 perception of that Civ X for whatever reason. When I refuse to cease trading with Civ X, and I then get docked -1 in Civ Y's estimation. While I illustrated that there are not many bad relationships (18%), these are enough to get most of the civs in the game angry at me for trading with their "worst enemies". I find this to be a laugh since I wonder how bad can they be if you've never been at war with them?

Mostly I have no question with this, since I can handle having people not like me. What bugs me is that the game doesn't seem to model one AI demanding of another that it stop trading with a third. The matrix shows you the plusses and minuses for all civs and there's not a "You refused to stop trading with our worst enemy!" to be found. I figure this is partly why there's so little war. Am I right, and is there a way to remedy this? I've mucked a little with XML a little, in order to decrease the happiness a civ gets by being the same religion, and to increase the tension caused by close borders, but to little avail.

The human player is a radically different competitor than all of the other AI competitors. The human player can be a nice guy or he/she can be a warmonger and he/she is in no way restricted by the positive or negative modifiers of the other civilizations. You can have great relations with another civlization, but still attack them. The AI can't see how your personality is. It can't see your matrix of plusses and minusses.

The AI on the other hand is completely restricted by the diplomacy modifiers and its personality. A lot of AI leaders will not attack you when the relationship rating is pleased and only a very few warmongers will attack a civilization with relationship rating friendly. If they like you, they will trade with you even though it's not in their best interest. For instance, you can get iron from most of the pleased civilizations while you're playing Rome. They trust that you are nice with your praetorians because they like you.

So while the AI leaders are restricted by the diplomacy ratings and behave accordingly, you don't have to do that. To find out what kind of leader you are, the AI civlizations will ask or demand stuff of you. If you like the civilization and want good relations, you will sometimes comply. If you want to attack that nation, then you will generally not comply.
In this way, the AI has some way to find out what kind of a leader you are. It's in no way as clear and limiting as the other AI leaders are dominated by their diplomacy modifiers, but it is something.


It's pretty easy to get good relations with most of the AI leaders. You just have to pick your friends and your enemies. In general, it's not possible to be friends with all of them. The AI cilizations are in general also not trading with everyone. They have friends and enemies. And you'll have to do the same or none of the leaders will trust you to be their friend. You can't be their friend and the friend of their enemy at the same time. (While civilizations are not at war, they don't have to be friends: In the real world, the USA and Iran are not really friends at the moment but they're not at war.)

The aggressive AI setting gives you a hidden negative diplomacy modifier of -2 (if I'm correct). So it will result in somewhat worse relations and somewhat more wars with the AI civilizations. This hidden modifier will not cause the diplomacy numbers to be lower for your civilization (it's hidden), but it will result in a lower diplomacy rating (furious, hatred, cautious, pleased, friendly) as if your rating was 2 points lower. I don't know if the Sevomod removed this modifier (some modders change this). I'm not familiar with the mod (I only know the name).
 
What sort of bonuses are there for the AI at Noble? And I thought that, for example, the difficulty level being at Diety made you at Noble and the AI at Settler, or something like that, is that correct?

The Deity thing is not correct. There is a Civ4HandicapInfo.xml that defines each level. Each level is defined basically in 3 parts - HumanPlayer Handicap, AI Handicap and Barbarian Activity/Goody Hut settings. The spoiler tags include the Noble Setting:

Spoiler Noble handicap :

Code:
<HandicapInfo>
 			<Type>HANDICAP_NOBLE</Type>
			<Description>TXT_KEY_HANDICAP_NOBLE</Description>
			<Help>TXT_KEY_HANDICAP_NOBLE_HELP</Help>
			<iFreeWinsVsBarbs>2</iFreeWinsVsBarbs>
			<iAnimalAttackProb>75</iAnimalAttackProb>
			<iStartingLocPercent>40</iStartingLocPercent>
			<iGold>0</iGold>
			<iFreeUnits>8</iFreeUnits>
			<iUnitCostPercent>50</iUnitCostPercent>
			<iResearchPercent>100</iResearchPercent>
			<iDistanceMaintenancePercent>75</iDistanceMaintenancePercent>
			<iNumCitiesMaintenancePercent>70</iNumCitiesMaintenancePercent>
			<iMaxNumCitiesMaintenance>5</iMaxNumCitiesMaintenance>
			<iCivicUpkeepPercent>80</iCivicUpkeepPercent>
			<iInflationPercent>90</iInflationPercent>
			<iHealthBonus>3</iHealthBonus>
			<iHappyBonus>5</iHappyBonus>
			<iAttitudeChange>-1</iAttitudeChange>
			<iNoTechTradeModifier>70</iNoTechTradeModifier>
			<iTechTradeKnownModifier>0</iTechTradeKnownModifier>
			<iUnownedTilesPerGameAnimal>50</iUnownedTilesPerGameAnimal>
			<iUnownedTilesPerBarbarianUnit>60</iUnownedTilesPerBarbarianUnit>
			<iUnownedWaterTilesPerBarbarianUnit>2000</iUnownedWaterTilesPerBarbarianUnit>
			<iUnownedTilesPerBarbarianCity>130</iUnownedTilesPerBarbarianCity>
			<iBarbarianCreationTurnsElapsed>35</iBarbarianCreationTurnsElapsed>
			<iBarbarianCityCreationTurnsElapsed>40</iBarbarianCityCreationTurnsElapsed>
			<iBarbarianCityCreationProb>6</iBarbarianCityCreationProb>
			<iAnimalBonus>-40</iAnimalBonus>
			<iBarbarianBonus>-10</iBarbarianBonus>
			<iAIAnimalBonus>-70</iAIAnimalBonus>
			<iAIBarbarianBonus>-40</iAIBarbarianBonus>
			<iStartingDefenseUnits>0</iStartingDefenseUnits>
			<iStartingWorkerUnits>0</iStartingWorkerUnits>
			<iStartingExploreUnits>0</iStartingExploreUnits>
			<iAIStartingUnitMultiplier>0</iAIStartingUnitMultiplier>
			<iAIStartingDefenseUnits>0</iAIStartingDefenseUnits>
			<iAIStartingWorkerUnits>0</iAIStartingWorkerUnits>
			<iAIStartingExploreUnits>0</iAIStartingExploreUnits>
			<iBarbarianDefenders>2</iBarbarianDefenders>
			<iAIDeclareWarProb>100</iAIDeclareWarProb>
			<iAIWorkRateModifier>0</iAIWorkRateModifier>
			<iAIGrowthPercent>100</iAIGrowthPercent>
			<iAITrainPercent>100</iAITrainPercent>
			<iAIWorldTrainPercent>100</iAIWorldTrainPercent>
			<iAIConstructPercent>100</iAIConstructPercent>
			<iAIWorldConstructPercent>100</iAIWorldConstructPercent>
			<iAICreatePercent>100</iAICreatePercent>
			<iAIWorldCreatePercent>100</iAIWorldCreatePercent>
			<iAICivicUpkeepPercent>100</iAICivicUpkeepPercent>
			<iAIUnitCostPercent>100</iAIUnitCostPercent>
			<iAIUnitSupplyPercent>35</iAIUnitSupplyPercent>
			<iAIUnitUpgradePercent>30</iAIUnitUpgradePercent>
			<iAIInflationPercent>70</iAIInflationPercent>
			<iAIWarWearinessPercent>70</iAIWarWearinessPercent>
			<iAIPerEraModifier>0</iAIPerEraModifier>
			<Goodies>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_HIGH_GOLD</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_HIGH_GOLD</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_HIGH_GOLD</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_LOW_GOLD</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_LOW_GOLD</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_LOW_GOLD</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_LOW_GOLD</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_MAP</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_MAP</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_WARRIOR</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_WARRIOR</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_SCOUT</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_EXPERIENCE</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_EXPERIENCE</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_HEALING</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_TECH</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_TECH</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_BARBARIANS_WEAK</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_BARBARIANS_WEAK</GoodyType>
				<GoodyType>GOODY_BARBARIANS_STRONG</GoodyType>
			</Goodies>
			<FreeTechs/>
			<AIFreeTechs/>
</HandicapInfo>


As you can see from it the AI gets the following bonuses:

70% bonus against Animals
40% bonus against Barbarians (both are the same for all Handicaps)
Unit Supply costs 35%
Unit Upgrade costs 30%
Inflation is 70%
War Weariness is 70%

All else is the same as the Human Player...
 
The human player is a radically different competitor....


Thanks for your response.

I do have a little grasp on how I as a human must be treated differently than the AI. And so I went in detail explaining the differences between the AIs relation to me and it's relation to it's AI counterparts when that's kind of secondary to my major question.. My fault, me just being too wordy, I guess.

My big question is why in this game are the AI so friendly to each other. With the matrix I can see what diplomatic events or current states have occurred to result in the current state of affairs between any two AI civs, and nowhere are there comments that state "you refused" to do a certain thing. So does the game not model one AI controlled Civ demanding tribute of another at all? Or that they cease trading, or convert to another religion? If so, that's kind of a disappointment because I feel it takes away from the feel of the game to know that I'm the only one who hears from Caesar about tribute.

Also, it then makes sense that I'm seeing few, if any AI-to-AI wars. The only thing to cause ill-will to the point that it results in war are close borders (which are often negated by same-religion factors) and differing religions. My refusal to convert to other religions or stop trading with others has gotten about half the world pretty angry with me. But if the other AI doesn't have to make those decisions - for example, if a human is trading with an AI, and another AI demands that you stop. Someone gets mad. Either you agree, and your trading partner gets upset, or you refuse, and the demanding civ gets upset. If an AI never makes demands of another AI, what is there to go to war over?

The reason I chose Aggressive AI is not only to get them more upset at me, but to get them more upset at each other, but it sounds like you're saying that it only affects their opinion of me.

Are there ways to increase the liklihood of wars between AI nations, or is this a unique situation and possibly a flaw or bug in the mod and/or the game settings?
 
My big question is why in this game are the AI so friendly to each other. With the matrix I can see what diplomatic events or current states have occurred to result in the current state of affairs between any two AI civs, and nowhere are there comments that state "you refused" to do a certain thing. So does the game not model one AI controlled Civ demanding tribute of another at all?

demands are directed at Human players exclusively.

Or that they cease trading, or convert to another religion?

They do trade "stop trading with..." and then get the respective penalties, the same is true for "declare war on..." and the "you traded with our worst enemy".
Religion is a BIG thing in inter-AI relations since it is about the only variable penalty that is more then "-1" (apart from "you declared war on us"). Also while AIs receive the same penalty for razing cities during war they will not raze so many as a human player would and will never raze a holy city so this is also a penalty that is reduced...

If so, that's kind of a disappointment because I feel it takes away from the feel of the game to know that I'm the only one who hears from Caesar about tribute.

so it is indeed a tad disappointing that the programmers chose this route to offset the advantage the human player has because he can and will attack friendly civs etc.

If an AI never makes demands of another AI, what is there to go to war over?

the DoWar decision of the AI is pretty simple - it does not take into account anything of value but only looks at respective strength (and the relations modifier that gives a NoWar probability for each attitude) and then randomly decides each turn whether to go to war or not...

The reason I chose Aggressive AI is not only to get them more upset at me, but to get them more upset at each other, but it sounds like you're saying that it only affects their opinion of me.

Aggressive AI has two effects:
-2 against the human player
and
the AI overestimates its own power by 33% when making a DoWar decision so wars with the human AND with other AIs should be more likely...

Are there ways to increase the liklihood of wars between AI nations, or is this a unique situation and possibly a flaw or bug in the mod and/or the game settings?

There always is diplomacy :D you can incite wars even if you do not participate in them (expensive) or draw civs into these wars when you fight them yourself... Also you have a big influence in religion spread since the AI is essentially dumb in this respect - you can spread religions that are not your state religion just to have some more variety :rolleyes: the AI will never do this...

Oh and have a look at the Better AI Mod it really solves a lot of the problems with inter-AI relations...
 
Thanks for your response.

I agree with the response ori gave you. I have almost nothing to add. I would also advice the betterAI mod. The present itteration of the mod is not overly aggressive. (A few itterations back I had a game with 12 war declaration against me before the 0AD year, ugh. But that was a bug.) It is still more aggressive then the original game. The mod is still in development and I think it is likely that they will make the AI more aggressive again. But you might already like the present aggressive AI setting.

The developers of this mod have improved the AI in many ways such as city placement, development of their lands, building preferences, war declaration, composition of armies, offensive and defensive behaviour. Just check it out yourself. You can find it here.

By the way, I think larger worlds have more war. More AI civilizations means quadratically more AI-AI relations. And each and every one of these relations can lead to war.

so it is indeed a tad disappointing that the programmers chose this route to offset the advantage the human player has because he can and will attack friendly civs etc.

I also would like to see a symetrical approach to both the human and AI civilizations. But it remains very hard to accomplish this. You can program the AI how to react to AI nations in a sensible way, but the same approach won't work with humans.
If another AI nation is friendly to an AI civilization, then both don't need large numbers of troops. You know this because you've also programmed the behaviour of the other AI when it's friendly. It is very unlikely that an AI civilization will declare war on a civilization when it is friendly towards that civilization.
You can safely trade iron to a friendly roman AI civilization because it is unlikely to result in war against your AI civilization. You know this because you've programmed the AI roman civilization to be unlikely to declare war when it is friendly.
An AI controlled civilization can make an open borders agreement with pleased AI civilizations as both AI controlled civilizations will benefit and the economical benefits for the other AI civilization are unlikely to be used against you.
This kind of programming works well as long as all nations are AI controlled nations. The problem is that the human player does not have a diplomacy entry. The AI civilizations don't know if we consider them +10, -5 or +2. That's a big complication when the AI has to deal with the human player.

So the programmers came up with the idea to let the AI interact with the human players and in that way form an opinion of the human player. This same interaction is not really needed between AI players because they know eachother and know how they will react. It is the human player that is the unknown factor in diplomacy.

I agree that the solution is not perfect because you as a player will at some point notice this lack of symmetry in diplomacy and will not like it. But from a programming point of view it is perfectly understandable that they chose this solution. Programming diplomacy is hard because it is a typical human phenomenon and the civ4 diplomacy is better than the diplomacy that I've found in other games. But it is not perfect and I hope to see even better diplomacy in civ5.
 
Can vassals have vassals? And if Catherine capitulates to me, what happens to her vassal Alexander?
 
Thanks for your responses, Roland :goodjob:. I have a few more questions considering those:
1) If you like to build many wonders, then you might want to reconsider that preference. In the early game, a world wonder costs about as much as a settler or two. So you have to ask yourself if you would rather have a world wonder and 3 cities or no world wonder and 5 cities. The world wonder is often not worth it.

In my present (early) game I just failed building pyramids, my one ancient wonder (in spite of having stone :sad: ), but got a lot of welcome cash with which I could raise my 20&#37; science rate (I have 5 cities). Is it sometimes worth starting to build wonders for the sole purpose of getting cash?

2) The barbarians will appear sooner and in bigger numbers. So you can't just research some stuff and expect to have decent defenders when the barbarians start attacking. You have to make sure you develop the military technologies and find some horses or copper in time. Archers can save you without these resources, but it is easier with horses or copper

I read somewhere on the strategy forum, that a player generally chose raging barbarians and then quickly built the Great Wall and thus weakened the AI. Do you think this makes sense and are the hammers spent doing so worth it?

EDIT: Oh and what is the optimum number of cities to have on a small map?
my last game I built 5, captured 5 and razed three and in the middle ages I gave up because maintenance was killing me... I had 7 commerce-cities, CoL in every city and even constant warfare couldn`t raise my science rate to more than 70%
 
I also would like to see a symetrical approach to both the human and AI civilizations. But it remains very hard to accomplish this. You can program the AI how to react to AI nations in a sensible way, but the same approach won't work with humans.
If another AI nation is friendly to an AI civilization, then both don't need large numbers of troops. You know this because you've also programmed the behaviour of the other AI when it's friendly. It is very unlikely that an AI civilization will declare war on a civilization when it is friendly towards that civilization.
You can safely trade iron to a friendly roman AI civilization because it is unlikely to result in war against your AI civilization. You know this because you've programmed the AI roman civilization to be unlikely to declare war when it is friendly.
An AI controlled civilization can make an open borders agreement with pleased AI civilizations as both AI controlled civilizations will benefit and the economical benefits for the other AI civilization are unlikely to be used against you.
This kind of programming works well as long as all nations are AI controlled nations. The problem is that the human player does not have a diplomacy entry. The AI civilizations don't know if we consider them +10, -5 or +2. That's a big complication when the AI has to deal with the human player.

So the programmers came up with the idea to let the AI interact with the human players and in that way form an opinion of the human player. This same interaction is not really needed between AI players because they know eachother and know how they will react. It is the human player that is the unknown factor in diplomacy.

I agree that the solution is not perfect because you as a player will at some point notice this lack of symmetry in diplomacy and will not like it. But from a programming point of view it is perfectly understandable that they chose this solution. Programming diplomacy is hard because it is a typical human phenomenon and the civ4 diplomacy is better than the diplomacy that I've found in other games. But it is not perfect and I hope to see even better diplomacy in civ5.

I guess I just wonder why the AI couldn't be programmed to semi-randomly (as it does now) make "arrogant demands" of it's AI counterparts, and why the AI counterparts couldn't simply decide whether to accept or refuse those demands based on the same logic with which it accepts or refuses the demands of a human player. When I demand 200 from an AI, does it take account my strength? If so, it could certainly do the same for another AI.

In fact I'd argue that this harms the AI a little bit, because as a human I can make strategic demands for resources and money from any other civilization to improve my lot. A strong AI civ, however, does not have the ability to extort from it's fellow AI

Diplomacy here is a lot better than in the past but it still lacks a bit, I'm finding.

You guys have been helpful. I'm going to try to tweak some things a bit more before I try another mod since I like this one a lot. Can anyone tell me if the following attribute(s) in the Civ4LeaderHeadInfos relate to just AI-Human relations or if AI->AI is involved as well.

<iMaxWarRand> (higher numbers here seem to indicate a greater liklihood of war. Of course, if it only occurrs once relations have soured this doesn't really mean much.

<iMaxWarNearbyPowerRatio> (and the other PowerRatio variables)

Thanks for all your help!
 
Thanks for your responses, Roland :goodjob:. I have a few more questions considering those:


In my present (early) game I just failed building pyramids, my one ancient wonder (in spite of having stone :sad: ), but got a lot of welcome cash with which I could raise my 20&#37; science rate (I have 5 cities). Is it sometimes worth starting to build wonders for the sole purpose of getting cash?

I rarely try to build the Pyramids in my games. Even with stone, they are about as expensive as 2.5 settlers or 4 workers. But if you're a small civilization, then the representation civic can be pretty powerful. If you grow larger, then the number of cities with the happiness boost is a bit too small for my liking and then I prefer a civic like hereditary rule which doesn't require the Pyramids.

Building a world wonder just for the money can be useful when you have a resource that gives you a production bonus on the wonder. When you're building the Pyramids with stone (and no other production bonus) without the goal of finishing the wonder, then you're essentially converting hammers into gold at a 1 to 2 rate with an unknown delay (you'll get the gold when someone else finishes the wonder). That can be useful if your empire is a bit overstreched and barely capable of researching something. However, often there are better ways to invest your hammers. If you can build a marketplace to improve the happiness in your cities and increase the gold output, then that is often more interesting. If you can build a courthouse in a city with a significant gold upkeep, then that can be more interesting.
It depends on the situation, but sometimes it can be interesting to partially build a wonder to get a good production into gold transfer.


I read somewhere on the strategy forum, that a player generally chose raging barbarians and then quickly built the Great Wall and thus weakened the AI. Do you think this makes sense and are the hammers spent doing so worth it?

In a situation where barbarians are going to be a problem (raging barbarians, slow game speed, open land-based map), the great wall can be a very good investment. Of course the AI will then suffer from the barbarians.

Picking a map type and certain conditions and then using those to get an advantage over the AI is stacking the deck. Nothing really wrong with that of course as no one gets hurt (the AI doesn't have feelings as far as I know ;) ). Just know that if you beat the AI at a certain level while stacking the deck in your favour, the game might be easier than a game at a lower difficulty level without stacking the deck in your favour.

For instance: picking Rome on a duel sized pangea map with balanced resources (ensuring the availability of iron) is stacking the deck. Even on deity level, this should be a winning game for a somewhat experienced player. When you then start claiming that beating the AI on deity level is easy, then of course you're lying a bit.

Of course, the line between a 'good strategy' and 'stacking the deck' is a bit vague. And of course, stacking the deck can be fun sometimes.

I guess I just wonder why the AI couldn't be programmed to semi-randomly (as it does now) make "arrogant demands" of it's AI counterparts, and why the AI counterparts couldn't simply decide whether to accept or refuse those demands based on the same logic with which it accepts or refuses the demands of a human player. When I demand 200 from an AI, does it take account my strength? If so, it could certainly do the same for another AI.

In fact I'd argue that this harms the AI a little bit, because as a human I can make strategic demands for resources and money from any other civilization to improve my lot. A strong AI civ, however, does not have the ability to extort from it's fellow AI

Diplomacy here is a lot better than in the past but it still lacks a bit, I'm finding.

I of course agree that the diplomacy could be improved and maybe Firaxis should have tried to make the AI's make demands of oneanother.

The AI needs to make these demands/requests versus the human to get some idea about the humans disposition versus their civilization. They don't need to do this versus other AI nations for this goal.
If you would let the AI make demands/requests of oneanother in the game as it is, it would probably lead to very bad inter-AI relations. They would probably hate eachother in no time. So something would have to be changed.

It would also lead to the situation where the human still has the advantage that he can see the AI diplomatic rating of his civilization while the AI can't see the real human diplomatic rating of the AI civilizations. At present this is balanced a partly by the AI demands/requests and the lower diplomatic rating that is caused by this. But it is not completely balanced. I can still be nice to someone that I'm planning to destroy. And I'm typically capable to manipulate most of the AI civilizations into a good relation.

In the end, I would also like a symmetric diplomatic situation, but it will never be completely symmetric because the AI has a programmed code. You can easily manipulate the AI because of this code. Give them something and you know that it is unlikely that you get attacked and likely that you can trade with them. You know the tricks to get a good relation and thus you'll be able to manipulate the AI into doing things. If relations are good, then you'll be able to bribe it into going to war with other civilizations.

If this game wouldn't have any diplomacy at all, then it would surely be harder for the human player. If we make diplomacy completely symmetric, then it will become easier for the human player.

What we really need for good diplomacy is for Skynet to become aware. But that might lead to other problems. :ar15: :ar15: :badcomp:

You guys have been helpful. I'm going to try to tweak some things a bit more before I try another mod since I like this one a lot. Can anyone tell me if the following attribute(s) in the Civ4LeaderHeadInfos relate to just AI-Human relations or if AI->AI is involved as well.

<iMaxWarRand> (higher numbers here seem to indicate a greater liklihood of war. Of course, if it only occurrs once relations have soured this doesn't really mean much.

<iMaxWarNearbyPowerRatio> (and the other PowerRatio variables)

Thanks for all your help!

If I'm not mistaken, iMaxWarRand is a variable that determines the maximum powerratio that allows a random war to occur. So if the variable is 200, then it means that even if someone is twice as strong, then still the AI might go to war with them. Setting this variable too high can lead to very undesirable consequences (dwarf nation declaring war against superpower). Especially since the value is increased by 33% on the aggressive AI setting.

iMaxWarNearbyPowerRatio is probably a similar powerrating for nearby wars. Somewhere there is probably a value which determines at what distance a war is considered a nearby war.

You don't want a higher powerratio to still lead to wars. You want the chance that a random war erupts to be bigger at a certain powerratio. It's a different variable that you want to change.

Also random wars don't occur as long as relations are not somewhat bad. For a select few, a friendly relation still allows random wars. For most leaders, relations have to be worse for a random war to occur. That is stored in the leaderhead file (if I'm not mistaken).

I know that the BetterAI mod has changed a number of these values. I don't think it is easy to mod this.

Will barb cities culture flip?

That can happen. You need to have more than 50% of the culture of the center tile of the barbarian city. Units surpress the flipping chance, so if the barbarian city has a large garrison of troops or if you only have only a little more than 50% of the culture of the center tile, then the flipping chance is stil 0.
 
Hi all,

Firstly, im new so be nice to me!!! I've looked everywhere for an answer to this but i cant find one so im hoping some lovely person will help me,

Im trying to expand my city, and so im trying to rack up some food, as per all previous CIV's. The problem is, my food seems to be going towards productions (such as settlers etc) and not towards the food bar to expand the city, its bizarre!!!

Any help would be great!!!

Thanks,

Barnetti
 
Hi all,

Firstly, im new so be nice to me!!! I've looked everywhere for an answer to this but i cant find one so im hoping some lovely person will help me,

Im trying to expand my city, and so im trying to rack up some food, as per all previous CIV's. The problem is, my food seems to be going towards productions (such as settlers etc) and not towards the food bar to expand the city, its bizarre!!!

Any help would be great!!!

Thanks,

Barnetti

First of all, welcome to civfanatics! :band:

The thing you're describing is a new feature of civ4. In civ1 to civ3, a settler cost a few points of population. In civ4, during construction of a worker or a settler, food is directly converted to production but the worker or settler doesn't cost population points. So as long as you're building workers or settlers, the city won't grow.
 
you my friend, are a legend.

Thank you! (You didn't quote anyone so I assume you meant me).

Are AI leaders programmed to follow certain tech paths? For example, do Monty and Alex pursue military techs more than Gandhi and Mansa? Izzy the Witch clearly goes for the religion founding techs, but is that a function of her being Izzy or merely her starting with Mysticism?
 
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