Random Rants ΠΑ: That's a paddlin'

[MaryKB]

And it's not like older generations didn't do things like read a newspaper on the subway or anything, right?

 

[rah]

But you're wrong that talking on the phone necessarily means having no situational awareness. Though I will say that I don't use headphones when I talk on the phone.

I'll agree that it's not automatic, but for many it is.
You just hear about it happening so much that it must have an effect. (they report it in the local news whenever it happens on mass transit)

And yeah headphones make it worse.
I usually walk with one hand in my pocket over my wallet and the other for balance. Harder to get taken advantage of by a bump and grab.

And yes, we did similar things, but hardly anyone read a newspaper while walking down the street, And if you had the paper stolen, no biggie. It didn't cost a grand.

But I learned early that situational awareness is reasonably important in a crowd.

 

[Lexicus]

I'll agree that it's not automatic, but for many it is.

Yeah, and I'm convinced many people lack situational awareness even if they're not on their phones.

You just hear about it happening so much that it must have an effect.

Yeah...no

 

[rah]

Yeah, and I'm convinced many people lack situational awareness even if they're not on their phones.

That's certainly true.

Yeah...no

When someone can walk up to you and grab it out of your hand before you notice, that's lack of awareness.

 

[MaryKB]

Using your phone doesn't remove your situational awareness; people can be distracted by anything, or just generally not paying attention. You seem to have moved from awareness to more about value of what's getting stolen ... yes, if you don't have anything on you then obviously you're not at risk of losing anything, but you could still have other things happen to you by criminals.

A friend of mine in France was held up at gunpoint on the street, and they took her purse .. which obviously had her cellphone. Having it "locked away" didn't stop it from being stolen, and someone could very easily take your briefcase from you (btw no one carries those any more, unless it's like a laptop case)

 

[Lexicus]

When someone can walk up to you and grab it out of your hand before you notice, that's lack of awareness.

"I hear about it on the local news all the time" is not an actual argument

 

[rah]

And the phone is the number 1 distraction in america today. That's my point.
Of course there are no absolutes.
And if I get held up at gunpoint, I'll give them my phone.
But I'm also careful about avoiding areas where it's more likely to happen. As with anything, it's not a guarantee but that doesn't mean you shouldn't try to improve your odds.

And yes, I'm old and still carry a briefcase. (not your traditional briefcase but one my wife still uses to make fun of) Join the club.
It's still practical for me so I'll live with not being stylish. It doesn't effect how much money I make.

"I hear about it on the local news all the time" is not an actual argument

IT wasn't meant to be. Just a anecdote.

My only point is that it's a distraction for a lot of people. One that you have a choice to avoid.

 

[BenitoChavez]

When someone can walk up to you and grab it out of your hand before you notice, that's lack of awareness.

People walking near you is pretty commonplace in a big city like Chicago. Being constantly on guard that every person near you is a potential mugger, watching their every movement for the slightest sign of aggression isn't any way to live.

 

[MaryKB]

Again, you're attributing your good fortune at not being a target of crime as being due to your own merit. And then you're basically saying "Be like me so bad things don't happen to you, and if you don't listen then it's your fault if you get robbed." Not only is such an attitude incredibly arrogant, but also extremely foolish.

I've never been robbed on the street, and I frequently use my phone. Sometimes I need to look up directions somewhere, or I need to search for something. Or I may need to see if that notification I just heard is from someone I'm going to meet, and now I need to rearrange my plans. From my own personal anecdotal experience, your "advice" is complete hogwash.

Victims of crime are not responsible for being victims, this is like really a basic concept, no?

I still feel this comes down to a values judgement ... you don't use phones like other people do, and so like so many other old people you simply resent what's different.

 

[rah]

People walking near you is pretty commonplace in a big city like Chicago. Being constantly on guard that every person near you is a potential mugger, watching their every movement for the slightest sign of aggression isn't any way to live.

Yes it is commonplace and that's why you pay attention. I'm not talking about FBI or anything like awareness. Just some common sense.
The lack of which is what I was ranting about. This is the ranting thread.

I don't resent anybody, just consider it foolish. And I'm happy you haven't been victimized. It is my desire not to have that happen.
You can take the advice however you want.

But if phones are a considerable distraction while driving leading to many deaths, I think it's safe to assume that they're a distraction at other times also.

 

[Lexicus]

But if phones are a considerable distraction while driving leading to many deaths, I think it's safe to assume that they're a distraction at other times also.

I'm glad you brought that up because the car demons are trying to get the concept of "distracted pedestrians" to take off, thus blaming people who are hit by cars for having been hit by cars.

I still feel this comes down to a values judgement ... you don't use phones like other people do, and so like so many other old people you simply resent what's different.

On the other hand it's hard not to laugh at people who have such tunnel-vision on their phones that they run into stuff. And I get very annoyed at people who move very slowly because they're doing stuff on their phones and block the flow of foot traffic in subway stations or on the sidewalk....they're even more annoying than tourists who stand on the left side of the escalator...

 

[MaryKB]

Not focusing on your driving and being robbed are totally unconnected phenomenon, no? To me, that sounds like saying something like "If you swallow a golf ball you might choke and die, so you should never use a golf ball for anything."

You didn't just make this about distractions, you made it specifically about cell phone usage. You can be distracted without having a mobile phone, and you can be using your phone without being distracted. But you limited this specifically about phones, and you made it clear how you feel about phones and young people. Also, old people are just as easily distracted by things - it's not like street muggings started when cell phones became common, right?

@Lexicus I do agree, but that's totally not limited to cell phones! I've seen people do silly things because they're talking to someone and not watching where they're going lol!

 

[hobbsyoyo]

I'm glad you brought that up because the car demons are trying to get the concept of "distracted pedestrians" to take off, thus blaming people who are hit by cars for having been hit by cars.

It's my understanding the US is basically the only country with the crime of jaywalking on the books - largely thanks to the auto insurance lobby who wanted to blame pedestrians for accidents and thereby shift costs off themselves.

 

[tjs282]

Being constantly on guard that every person near you is a potential mugger, watching their every movement for the slightest sign of aggression isn't any way to live.

I don't think that was Rah's implication.

Victims of crime are not responsible for being victims, this is like really a basic concept, no?

And I agree with you, criminals are responsible for their choice to commit crimes—any crimes. But muggers are like all oppressors/ bullies/ predators.

Just like lions and jackals will tend to go for the very young, the very old, or the wounded zebra, a mugger will be looking for the weakest/ most distracted-looking potential victim(s) in the 'herd', the one(s) who's likely to offer the least resistance.

So body-language can make a big difference: I'm not advocating @BenitoChavez's postulated hypervigiliance/paranoia, but walking with your head up (even while talking on your phone), looking around you (general 'you') at all, is almost certainly going to make you a (much) less appealing potential target than someone who's hunched over/ eyes down, and with one or both of their hands occupied (e.g. with texting/ gaming).

No, doing that won't 100% guarantee your (phone's) safety, but it will certainly improve it. And will also help avoid running into/under things.

I see I'm now X-posting, but I'm going to do it anyway...

 

[rah]

I'm glad you brought that up because the car demons are trying to get the concept of "distracted pedestrians" to take off, thus blaming people who are hit by cars for having been hit by cars.

Yeah, I saw that and it was like WTH.

And MK, I've agreed already a few times that it's not the only distraction or a guarantee of safety so I don't see why you're still making it about that.
And yeah, what tjs said.

 

[Ferocitus]

That's a proper way to treat a phone. Locked away and turned off Not only it's safer to walk the streets but no one bothers You unexpectedly

Well said, sir.
If someone tried to mug me for my phone, I'd hand over my Nokia 3310, and while they were bent over double laughing, I'd karate chop them on the back of the neck.

 

[Lexicus]

@Lexicus I do agree, but that's totally not limited to cell phones! I've seen people do silly things because they're talking to someone and not watching where they're going lol!

I agree completely, but I do think phones are probably the most common distraction these days. Speaking for myself I'm more likely to get in people's way just being lost in thought than I am to be absorbed in my phone.

It's my understanding the US is basically the only country with the crime of jaywalking on the books - largely thanks to the auto insurance lobby who wanted to blame pedestrians for accidents and thereby shift costs off themselves.

I jaywalk several times a day on average. It's funny because I grew up 40 minutes from NY and everyone is always like "New York City natives don't follow traffic signals when they cross the street!" I was never a NYC native but never had trouble fitting in in that respect. I take a secret, terrible pleasure in walking up to a group of people waiting at a light with no cars coming and not even breaking stride as I pass them and cross the street...

If someone tried to mug me for my phone, I'd hand over my Nokia 3310, and while they were bent over double laughing, I'd karate chop them on the back of the neck.

Just rap them smartly over the head with the Nokia, their skull will shatter like a dropped wineglass while the phone won't be damaged at all

 

[rah]

I spent decades in computer operations and really didn't like being contacted 24/7. Now I hire people to take those calls, and a turned off phone guarantees that they do take the calls.

 

[MaryKB]

I jaywalk several times a day on average. It's funny because I grew up 40 minutes from NY and everyone is always like "New York City natives don't follow traffic signals when they cross the street!" I was never a NYC native but never had trouble fitting in in that respect. I take a secret, terrible pleasure in walking up to a group of people waiting at a light with no cars coming and not even breaking stride as I pass them and cross the street...

With my obsession with following rules, I'd rather walk considerably out of my way to cross at a light/crosswalk than to just start playing frogger, lol.

 

[aimeeandbeatles]

I once saw somebody jaywalk when they were a few steps away from a crosswalk. I don't get it.