hotrod0823
Deity
I've got !
RBC2 - Mesopotamia Phoenicians
- Thread starter Charis
- Start date
hotrod0823
Deity
RBC2
3200 BC (0):
Yeah water is scarce plenty of food but no water to make it grow 
. Will let the barracks complete to have a city to build units in between settlers. NOT sure the best coarse of action reguarding Wonders is prebuilding the ONLY way to go? Is research the key? Anyway will allow the the archer to complete, thought about swapping to granary but having some units onhand is not a bad thing. It is surprising to see such a large tech LEAD this early in a quasi Deity Game!! 
.
3160 BC (1): Trye builds a barracks, I like the new symbol, starts an archer. New Contact the Hittites in the North. He has nothing and gets nothing. Egypt lays clain to silks and ivory in the south. More exploring with warriors and curraghs.
3120 BC (2): More exploring spot a blue boarder to the East. And boy imagine having Babylon lands on the Tigres river. Oh and the Hittites are settling in our direction due north on the river delta is the city of Kummanni. Need a settler to head to the dyes ASAP. Swap capital to warrior to free up city to build a settler next.
3080 BC (3): Trye builds a warrior starts a settler due in 6
turns. Contact with the final civ the Sumerians in the East. They have Cuneiform for trade now what do I have to give up soooo.... many choices. 
Well no tech on its own will get it. Lets consult the civilo. Been doing a lot of that lately. Well decide on Animal Domestication and Stone Working for Cuniform and 10 gold. Trade Cuniform to Babylon for Mysticism and 10 gold. Begin lumber project in the NE corner of Trye to try and get water to the city.
3040 BC (4): Granary gets 10 shields from lumbering, begin irrigation. Bw due in 2 turns at 50% we are soo far a head I am wondering the level.
3000 BC (5): Sidon completes an archer starts an other. Will swap archer with warrior on the choke. BW comes next turn. Pottery to the Hittites for a worker and 10 gold.
2960 BC (6): Learn Bronze working start on Astronomy. We are ahead by a lot and that is another cheap wonder tech albeit a dead end tech. Sell Wood Working to the Myceane for 118 gold.
2920 BC (7): Astronomy is due in 10 turns running -8gpt but we have 230 in the bank.
2880 BC (8): Nothing new to say.
2840 BC (9): Trye builds a settler starts an archer to use the 10 shields from the next turns chop. Then will being a Collassus. Sending the settler north. Irrigation is coming from the north.
2800 BC (10): Settler is heading north with an escort. This requires lux to go to 20%, Astronomy is due in 8 turns running -8gpt at 80%. Tyre Archer completes next turn then Trye should have a easy shot at the Wonder. Our tech lead is staggering.
Here is the save:
http://civfanatics.net/uploads5/RBC2-2800BC.zip
3200 BC (0):
Yeah water is scarce plenty of food but no water to make it grow . Will let the barracks complete to have a city to build units in between settlers. NOT sure the best coarse of action reguarding Wonders is prebuilding the ONLY way to go? Is research the key? Anyway will allow the the archer to complete, thought about swapping to granary but having some units onhand is not a bad thing. It is surprising to see such a large tech LEAD this early in a quasi Deity Game!! . 3160 BC (1): Trye builds a barracks, I like the new symbol
, starts an archer. New Contact the Hittites in the North. He has nothing and gets nothing. Egypt lays clain to silks and ivory in the south. More exploring with warriors and curraghs. 3120 BC (2): More exploring spot a blue boarder to the East. And boy imagine having Babylon lands on the Tigres river. Oh and the Hittites are settling in our direction due north on the river delta is the city of Kummanni. Need a settler to head to the dyes ASAP. Swap capital to warrior to free up city to build a settler next.
3080 BC (3): Trye builds a warrior starts a settler due in 6
turns. Contact with the final civ the Sumerians in the East. They have Cuneiform for trade now what do I have to give up soooo.... many choices. Well no tech on its own will get it. Lets consult the civilo. Been doing a lot of that lately. Well decide on Animal Domestication and Stone Working for Cuniform and 10 gold. Trade Cuniform to Babylon for Mysticism and 10 gold. Begin lumber project in the NE corner of Trye to try and get water to the city. 3040 BC (4): Granary gets 10 shields from lumbering, begin irrigation. Bw due in 2 turns at 50% we are soo far a head I am wondering the level.
3000 BC (5): Sidon completes an archer starts an other. Will swap archer with warrior on the choke. BW comes next turn. Pottery to the Hittites for a worker and 10 gold.
2960 BC (6): Learn Bronze working start on Astronomy. We are ahead by a lot and that is another cheap wonder tech albeit a dead end tech. Sell Wood Working to the Myceane for 118 gold.
2920 BC (7): Astronomy is due in 10 turns running -8gpt but we have 230 in the bank.
2880 BC (8): Nothing new to say.
2840 BC (9): Trye builds a settler starts an archer to use the 10 shields from the next turns chop. Then will being a Collassus. Sending the settler north. Irrigation is coming from the north.
2800 BC (10): Settler is heading north with an escort. This requires lux to go to 20%, Astronomy is due in 8 turns running -8gpt at 80%. Tyre Archer completes next turn then Trye should have a easy shot at the Wonder. Our tech lead is staggering
.Here is the save:
http://civfanatics.net/uploads5/RBC2-2800BC.zip
hotrod0823
Deity
Anyone else have thoughts on why we have such a large tech lead?? Are the cards stacked for this particular civ? Do you get "help" from the start due to poor land. I think the fact that we had a second tier tech to START the game made it almost a foregone conclusion that we will be the tech leaders and never look back.
Couple that with free Curragh and you have early contacts and Monopoly on Contacts makes brokering a breeze. I am begining to think that these conquests are more and more suited for online play "human vs. human". I seriously doubt that the game level means anything. I can't prove it but I gotta believe that all the scenarios start out the same reguardless of levels chosen.
I may be wrong but isn't the largest advantage the Deity AI has is the extra starting units. How does that work in a conquest game where details of units and locations are predetermined. I would be mightly surprised to findout that if we were playing as Egypt that the Phoneocians (sp) AI had 1 unit different than we started out with in this game.
I guess what I am saying is should the conquests actually all be played at Diety or dare I say Sid. I honestly think the Demigod hole is not big enough.
If I am all wet just ignor my late night ramblings but I had to put my ideas somewhere.
Hotrod
Couple that with free Curragh and you have early contacts and Monopoly on Contacts makes brokering a breeze. I am begining to think that these conquests are more and more suited for online play "human vs. human". I seriously doubt that the game level means anything. I can't prove it but I gotta believe that all the scenarios start out the same reguardless of levels chosen.
I may be wrong but isn't the largest advantage the Deity AI has is the extra starting units. How does that work in a conquest game where details of units and locations are predetermined. I would be mightly surprised to findout that if we were playing as Egypt that the Phoneocians (sp) AI had 1 unit different than we started out with in this game.
I guess what I am saying is should the conquests actually all be played at Diety or dare I say Sid. I honestly think the Demigod hole is not big enough.
If I am all wet just ignor my late night ramblings but I had to put my ideas somewhere.
Hotrod
ToddMarshall
Maniac - Stellar Wingman
The largest advantage they have is the extra settler. The 40% discount is a big advantage in the pre rails era, less so later when the AI insists on growing size 30 cities at the cost of production.
Lets not say we have it in the bag yet. The AI does get a 30% discount on the wonders.... We probably win this going away from the looks of the save, but there is just too much we don't know yet to say for SURE that that is the case. I think you may be right about this civ's advantages for this scenareo though.
hotrod0823
Deity
some contacts but not all have been made. I think that we have monopoly on 3 of the 6 contacts. There has been very little trading going on. I think we will have the Colossus all but done by the time they even get Bronze working.
I don't think it was a cheiftan game. They are building settlers and units quickly but they just didn't get the initial boost they usually get in a standard emperor/deity game (I think) because of the nature of the scenario. We are ahead in score if that tells you anything.
The other thing is the new tech tree. The AI may not put enough emphasis on the worker actions. Irrigation, mining are probably the most important techs at the start and some AI don't both or even 1 of them. Talk about stunting your growth. They just don't have them as priorities.
I don't think it was a cheiftan game. They are building settlers and units quickly but they just didn't get the initial boost they usually get in a standard emperor/deity game (I think) because of the nature of the scenario. We are ahead in score if that tells you anything.
The other thing is the new tech tree. The AI may not put enough emphasis on the worker actions. Irrigation, mining are probably the most important techs at the start and some AI don't both or even 1 of them. Talk about stunting your growth. They just don't have them as priorities.
hotrod0823
Deity
Todd: I didn't mean to imply that this is over but we are definitely on our way . This civ has a huge advantage IMO is what I am really trying to say. Your right maybe they will catch up due to the cost of the wonders. That may be the biggest LEVEL factor in this particular game.
. This civ has a huge advantage IMO is what I am really trying to say. Your right maybe they will catch up due to the cost of the wonders. That may be the biggest LEVEL factor in this particular game.
ToddMarshall
Maniac - Stellar Wingman
Well, if the AI doesn't emphasize getting mining or irrigating thats a serious problem for them. It should definately go after those and domestication early since thats the only real way they can boost their cities. THAT may be the single biggest problem they are having. Getting a late start on boosting their cities sounds suicidal 
.
And yes, I agreed that this Civ seems to have the most going for it in this scenareo. Hopefully this turns out to be more challenging than we suspect right now.
Unless I am missing something though, getting 3 wonders should pretty much put the game in the bag. I can't see us not getting 3 wonders fairly easily unless we get dogpiled (seems unlikely) or something that we haven't anticipated about this scenareo causes us problems (also seems unlikely)
. And yes, I agreed that this Civ seems to have the most going for it in this scenareo. Hopefully this turns out to be more challenging than we suspect right now.
Unless I am missing something though, getting 3 wonders should pretty much put the game in the bag. I can't see us not getting 3 wonders fairly easily unless we get dogpiled (seems unlikely) or something that we haven't anticipated about this scenareo causes us problems (also seems unlikely)
Rubberjello
Emperor
If I could weigh in here on the balancing issues in this scenario without giving away anything, I would like to.
I've played this scenario through twice, and have found at least two other civs have really "killer" starting positions (in terms of fertile land rich in resources). The Phoenician lands look shabby in comparison. Phoenicians have the position and the contacts early on as an advantage, but other civs should catch up quickly.
From what I've seen, the Civs seem pretty balanced with different strengths and weaknesses in starting positions (key point coming up here) for a multi-player game. Unfortunately (as was pointed out), the AI suffers quite a bit from what you would expect at the high difficulty levels by not having more units and not being able to irrigate and mine from the get-go.
(That didn't reveal any spoilers, did it?)
I've played this scenario through twice, and have found at least two other civs have really "killer" starting positions (in terms of fertile land rich in resources). The Phoenician lands look shabby in comparison. Phoenicians have the position and the contacts early on as an advantage, but other civs should catch up quickly.
From what I've seen, the Civs seem pretty balanced with different strengths and weaknesses in starting positions (key point coming up here) for a multi-player game. Unfortunately (as was pointed out), the AI suffers quite a bit from what you would expect at the high difficulty levels by not having more units and not being able to irrigate and mine from the get-go.
(That didn't reveal any spoilers, did it?)
OK, so I take a bit of time and try to familiarize myself a bit with the game. We have a significant tech lead, OK lands, boats galore, lotsa contacts, and only 3 cities. One settler in the north? Where's he going? To get wines and wheat, I guess.
My first major action isn't until turn 3, in 2720, when I start the Colossus in our northern river city. Killing the cascade ASAP and getting wonders is probably going to be key. So Colossus gets going immediately.
By turn 6, 2600, Sumeria has Writing. And I can turn down sci rate on Astronomy.
Probably the biggest turn was 2560, when Astronomy completed. I looked at my options, considered them carefully, and closed my eyes and picked...Masonry. Maybe aqueducts will turn out to be helpful. In a fit of pique, Babylon founds two cities quite near us, in lands that I was targetting for soon taking over. Military or just ignore? Dunno, but it won't be decided by me.
2480 sees the founding of Byblos near ivory (for Statue of Zeus, don't you know) and to get a second lux online soon, since the wines will be a while (3rd lux). Mysticism and 70 gold goes to Sumeria for Writing (Babylon has it now). Mysticism and Wood Working to Medes for 25 gold and a worker (hadn't purchases one of theirs yet and those two techs are fairly widely known).
2440 - Try to start Temple of Zeus and realize we have no stone hooked up yet. We have two in our cultural border, but neither is close to hooked up. That's OK...we're gonna need a few turns before our ivory city is ready to try building anything anyway.
2400 - Pop a goodie hut and get Horseback Riding. The nearest horses are quite a ways north, but it is a required tech.
I also note that curraghs have a transport capacity of one and want to pass this information along, as there are goodie huts on islands that WE should get. And I hadn't noted this fact before. A couple curraghs aren't too far from home and can maybe get to work on this. Founding on the islands might be wise as well...or it might not.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads5/rbc2-2400bc.zip
Suggestions for next leader, compacted:
- Use curragh to transport troop to pop huts on islands
- Connect wine and stone in the north fairly quickly
- Have fun!!!
Arathorn
My first major action isn't until turn 3, in 2720, when I start the Colossus in our northern river city. Killing the cascade ASAP and getting wonders is probably going to be key. So Colossus gets going immediately.
By turn 6, 2600, Sumeria has Writing. And I can turn down sci rate on Astronomy.
Probably the biggest turn was 2560, when Astronomy completed. I looked at my options, considered them carefully, and closed my eyes and picked...Masonry. Maybe aqueducts will turn out to be helpful. In a fit of pique, Babylon founds two cities quite near us, in lands that I was targetting for soon taking over. Military or just ignore? Dunno, but it won't be decided by me.
2480 sees the founding of Byblos near ivory (for Statue of Zeus, don't you know) and to get a second lux online soon, since the wines will be a while (3rd lux). Mysticism and 70 gold goes to Sumeria for Writing (Babylon has it now). Mysticism and Wood Working to Medes for 25 gold and a worker (hadn't purchases one of theirs yet and those two techs are fairly widely known).
2440 - Try to start Temple of Zeus and realize we have no stone hooked up yet. We have two in our cultural border, but neither is close to hooked up. That's OK...we're gonna need a few turns before our ivory city is ready to try building anything anyway.
2400 - Pop a goodie hut and get Horseback Riding. The nearest horses are quite a ways north, but it is a required tech.
I also note that curraghs have a transport capacity of one and want to pass this information along, as there are goodie huts on islands that WE should get. And I hadn't noted this fact before. A couple curraghs aren't too far from home and can maybe get to work on this. Founding on the islands might be wise as well...or it might not.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads5/rbc2-2400bc.zip
Suggestions for next leader, compacted:
- Use curragh to transport troop to pop huts on islands
- Connect wine and stone in the north fairly quickly
- Have fun!!!
Arathorn
ToddMarshall
Maniac - Stellar Wingman
Wow, I get to play between Arathorn and Charis..... Meaning I'll have great leaves and somone to fix all my mistakes (no truth to the rumor this is why I allways ask to play last in Charis' games 
)
I see I am up but as stated earlier, can't play till sometime friday.
)I see I am up but as stated earlier, can't play till sometime friday.
moves, especially in this scenario. I already noted that I should've used the transport of the curraghs to pop some huts on islands.
Doc Tsiolkovski
Deity
lurker's comment:
Re: Tech Lead: Phoenicia always has the Tech lead in the beginning, for a good reason - the SEA trait. The additional commerce from the city squares makes the difference (just mod them to a different trait, and you'll see what an impact this has). I even managed to get 2 SGLs with them on Emperor early on.
But: This will change brutaly in the second era ....
Re: Wonder Victory: Though the game ends when all WoW are build, I would be very surprised if you get more than 2 or 3 on Demigod. This means, prepare for getting unit kill/ conquest VPs.
And, btw, 3 of the Wonders require a 2nd era tech - HG, MoM and the Great Lighthouse.
Re: Additional units: IIRC, the AI does not get any additional units in the Conquests, so the Worker purchase was not really p.c.
Re: Your territory - Ouch. They already poached you...
Re: Tech Lead: Phoenicia always has the Tech lead in the beginning, for a good reason - the SEA trait. The additional commerce from the city squares makes the difference (just mod them to a different trait, and you'll see what an impact this has). I even managed to get 2 SGLs with them on Emperor early on.
But: This will change brutaly in the second era ....
Re: Wonder Victory: Though the game ends when all WoW are build, I would be very surprised if you get more than 2 or 3 on Demigod. This means, prepare for getting unit kill/ conquest VPs.
And, btw, 3 of the Wonders require a 2nd era tech - HG, MoM and the Great Lighthouse.
Re: Additional units: IIRC, the AI does not get any additional units in the Conquests, so the Worker purchase was not really p.c.
Re: Your territory - Ouch. They already poached you...
hotrod0823
Deity
Have you confirmed this?? There was some question about in LK56 as to wether they hold units or not.
Hotrod
Rubberjello
Emperor
Confirmed. Standard (epic) games default the curragh to no transport capability, but in at least two of the Scenario games they have been modded to be able to transport 1 unit.
hotrod0823
Deity
Now that is something that should be in BIG BOLD letters. It may seem like a minor difference but could make a big difference. I didn't realize you could transport units in this scenario.
I got to thinking about it on about turn 8 or 9 of my turn, right-clicked the curragh to check the Civilopedia and saw that they had a transport capacity of one. I've not confirmed by loading a unit, but I did stop the silly exploration of sea squares to send them towards home base to get units. It seems incredibly likely that they can transport a single unit.
Yes, it should be much more obvious than it is. But we can still take advantage of it, I think/hope. It is a huge difference from the regular game, but I guess we players are supposed to be taking triple time to check all units (horsemen are 3/2/2, I think) and assume NOTHING.
Arathorn
Yes, it should be much more obvious than it is. But we can still take advantage of it, I think/hope. It is a huge difference from the regular game, but I guess we players are supposed to be taking triple time to check all units (horsemen are 3/2/2, I think) and assume NOTHING.
Arathorn
Sullla
Patrician Roman Dictator
Curraghs have a transport capacity of 1 in this scenario and in some other ones (like Middle Ages). They do NOT have transport capacity in the standard game. If you think that's strange, Medieval Infantry (MDI) have amphibious assault in Age of Discovery. 
ToddMarshall
Maniac - Stellar Wingman
OK, the first thing i do is take a casual stroll through the Civlopedia. I look at every unit and every building, and every wonder to try to make sure I understand what this scenareo is all about. The really BIG item other than transport by curraghs that stands out is The Statue of Zeus = Sun Tsu's, not the "main game" Zeus. It also stands out that those "great" 3-3-1 spears arent really so hot as the normal spear is a 2-3-1 unit.
Observations:
Pop those huts on the islands as previously mentioned. If we still get them, maybe the delay won't be so bad. We might get an expensive tech out of one of them.
Our lands truly suck. Most cities will be stuck at a really small size
We have no horses, and don't have the prospect of getting any as far as I can see. The nearest horses is a really long way north. Thats NOT good as mounted units look to me to be the way to go for sure in this scenareo.
We do have the tech lead but I don't find it as commanding as I thought from reading the thread. Three required techs is ceartianlly nothing to sneeze at on a high difficulty, but it isnt a stranglehold on the tree either.
Siddon is building a settler..... Where is there thats good to settle?? Probably we will want to claim those gems to the south before anyone else grabs them. I'd go for the horses but I dont't see a realistic chance we get them first. Maybe the close island is actually the next best spot. It's 7 tiles from the capital, same as Berytus.... Zoom to Berrytus, move a worker to the forrest and hope it gets 2 of 3 sheilds and.... nope, it wastes 2 of 3 sheilds. NOT good. Future government swaps will probably reverse this but maybe not everywhere thats 7 tiles away from the capital with the new corruption system OK, that's it, AKKAD HAS TO GO. We NEED to raze that site to free up room for 2 of our own cities keep up long term IMHO.
We'll just move our stack over there and...... umm.. we have no stack.. I'm so used to inherriting a huge army sitting arround in SG's it's a bit of a culture shock not to have one. Hmmm. We seriously need to reverse this problem soon.
Inherrited turn - MM Tyre from Plains to forest. Its in the 3-3-4 food cycle. This will finish the TG a turn earlier.
Interturn - nothing
[1] - We disperse a barb camp and take 25 gold. Continue exploring the wilderness with our warriors. Five scouting units seem a bit much now that we have all contact, especially with warriors being a 2/1/1 unit (and therefore having a decent chance vs a 3 defense spear and a great chance vs other warriors and archers, so I turn 2 of them arround and send them back with the intent of scoping Babylon out as well as possible on their way back. MM siddon to get the settler in 1 turn instead of 2. The odd food wont help us anyway. Lux to 10% for 1 turn to keep Siddon happy.
Diplo check: Babylon has a worker available. We haven't bought one of theirs yet. Its probably overpaying, but I ship them HBR @ 4th for it. Mycenae now has Sailing :eeek: They are sure to start making contacts soon and probably will steal that one hut. I note that the Hitites still don't know Cerremonial burrial, which is a first row tech, so i ship it to them @ last for their 50 gold.
IT - Nothing
[2] - Tyre TG -> Settler
Sidon Settler -> TG
Diplo Check - Mycenae now has HBR and contact with Hittites
Hittites now have HBR too.
Egypt, the last civ not to know HBR or have any contacts now has The Wheel. We ship them HBR for it. What a steal.
IT - zzzzz
[3] Byblos - Warrior -> Warrior
Diplo Check: Mycenae and the Hittites now know The Wheel
Pop a hut in the West Egyptian desert and we learn chariotry. This is a completely useless dead end tech to everyone but the Hitites and the Egyptians. Maybe we can get something of value for it, but I doubit it. Disperse a Barb camp near the Sumarians and take 25 gold.
Diplo Check: Hittites have only 25 gold, and Egypt is broke so no deal on Chariotry, then I notice something interesting.....
Why will Mycenae pay for a worthless, useless dead end tech? This makes ZERO sense. It's like the AI paying for a full price for Free Artistry after Shakes is built (which it doesn't do). I can't see any reason NOT to sell it for all they have. Deal done.
IT - Nothing.
[4] Berytus Worker -> Worker (vetoable. maybe a burrial mound would be better but... I really like lots of workers)
Diplo: Medes now has Sailing
Pop a hut over on the edge of the world behind the hitites and we get... Polytheisim! YUM! Are we sure we aren't playing on regent? Two huts/two techs seems too good to be true.
IT- zzzzz
[5] Tyre - Settler -> TG
Diplo Check - Eastern half of the world all know Diplomacy, Babs have also picked up Sailing. Try to traid sailing @4th for Diplomacyh at 4th and its not even close to an even swap.It takes about 80 gold on top of Sailing.They WOULD give it and all their 25 gold for the wheel, but as no one in the eastern area knows the wheel yet I don't want to do that deal. I pass for now.
Pop the hut on close isle and we get: A conscript HORSEMAN?!. Nice! If we can keep this unit alive and promote it that will be sweet.
Note that Wonder city is size 5 now and needs annother happy face. Bah. I should have sent the TG over there last turn. Lux to 10% for one turn to keep it happy.
IT - zzzzz
[6] TG arrives at Colossus City, lux back to 0%. ZZZZZ
Found Arvad on the coast SE of Byblos.
Time to call my gf.
When I return, I load up the game, click next turn we learn Masonry and...
IT- Z_Z-(zzz) .... -_- .... o_0 .... ((O_O))
(Note: Shouldn't scientific leaders be OFF in this scenareo?)
Still nothing on the diplo front.
[7] Research started on CoL at 100%. It is due in 8.
Stone still 1 turn away So I leave the leader sitting.
Leader Fortified in Tyre. No stone yet anyway.
Diplo check reveals Sumaria has a worker available. I ship then Sailing and 4g for it. Every other civ Except egypt knows this tech by now. Medes now knows Cuneiform. Sumeria was the LAST civ we hadn't got a worker from, so worker buys are now off the table (is there a point when we can buy more? maybe 100 turns into the scenareo?)
IT- Stone is hooked up
[8] ZZZZZ
Diplo check... Crapola. The east/west contact barrier has been broken. Hitites and Medeans now have contact with everyone except Egypt. The Myceneans still lack contact with Babylon and Sumer but you know that can't last long. Medeans shows up with the Wheel, Hittites with Chariotry, and :eeek: the Myceneans with Mining.
Ship the Medeans Mining, Chariotry (worth like 30g to them but useless) and 44g for Diplomacy. Not sure if this was good or bad. Diplomacy seems to be a "government tech" like nationalisim so the AI overvalues it. With the Myceneans having both these techs I figured they would make this deal with them soon if I didn't. Sell Sumer contact with Mycenae for their 32 gold. Again, I figured they would have it soon from either the Hitites or the the Medeans.
I hold off on using the leader. In fact, Ill let Charis use it after some team discussion because I don't see a 2 turn delay on rushing a wonder as anything to worry about.
IT- zipo
[9] zzzzzz
Unload a warrior over on the far island and we learn construction........ the prng is tryng its best to remove all challenge from this scenareo?!?.........
IT - zilch
[10] Tyre - TG -> Temple of Artemes
Sidon TG -> Settler
Acco founded down by the gems mountian.
I know what I think we should do, but you guys tell me. I'd swap the Colossus build to the Statue of Zeus, Rush the Temple of Artemes in the capital, then swap the Capital to the Colossus. We could build a stream of TG's out of Sidon and . If we get all 3 wonders we can probably cruise home with a military campaign vs somone.
Notes. Workers are concentrating on roading up to our gems city and our wines city at the moment. Once we have these (and the Temple of Artemes?) Hooked up we should be in good shape for happiness for a while. We are "average" militarily vs our 2 neighbors (Babylon and Egypt), though we have several warriors rather "out of position" because they are exploring. Probably time to bring the boys back home in case something nasty happens. Remember, we can now negotiate MPP's if somone declares on us. It is also time to start thinking which government we want to switch to. Both have 2-4-8 unit support. Oligarchy offers lower waste and corruption, but 2mp, war wearyness and pop rush. Monarchy offers the same corruption we have now, but 3mp and cash rush. Our econ blows so bad right now I dono if cash rush is good for the forseeable future. I would probably tend to favor Oligarchy but perhaps I'm missing something.
The Save
Observations:
Pop those huts on the islands as previously mentioned. If we still get them, maybe the delay won't be so bad. We might get an expensive tech out of one of them.
Our lands truly suck. Most cities will be stuck at a really small size
We have no horses, and don't have the prospect of getting any as far as I can see. The nearest horses is a really long way north. Thats NOT good as mounted units look to me to be the way to go for sure in this scenareo.
We do have the tech lead but I don't find it as commanding as I thought from reading the thread. Three required techs is ceartianlly nothing to sneeze at on a high difficulty, but it isnt a stranglehold on the tree either.
Siddon is building a settler..... Where is there thats good to settle?? Probably we will want to claim those gems to the south before anyone else grabs them. I'd go for the horses but I dont't see a realistic chance we get them first.
Maybe the close island is actually the next best spot. It's 7 tiles from the capital, same as Berytus.... Zoom to Berrytus, move a worker to the forrest and hope it gets 2 of 3 sheilds and.... nope, it wastes 2 of 3 sheilds. NOT good. Future government swaps will probably reverse this but maybe not everywhere thats 7 tiles away from the capital with the new corruption system OK, that's it, AKKAD HAS TO GO. We NEED to raze that site to free up room for 2 of our own cities keep up long term IMHO.We'll just move our stack over there and...... umm.. we have no stack.
. I'm so used to inherriting a huge army sitting arround in SG's it's a bit of a culture shock not to have one. Hmmm. We seriously need to reverse this problem soon.Inherrited turn - MM Tyre from Plains to forest. Its in the 3-3-4 food cycle. This will finish the TG a turn earlier.
Interturn - nothing
[1] - We disperse a barb camp and take 25 gold. Continue exploring the wilderness with our warriors. Five scouting units seem a bit much now that we have all contact, especially with warriors being a 2/1/1 unit (and therefore having a decent chance vs a 3 defense spear and a great chance vs other warriors and archers, so I turn 2 of them arround and send them back with the intent of scoping Babylon out as well as possible on their way back. MM siddon to get the settler in 1 turn instead of 2. The odd food wont help us anyway. Lux to 10% for 1 turn to keep Siddon happy.
Diplo check: Babylon has a worker available. We haven't bought one of theirs yet. Its probably overpaying, but I ship them HBR @ 4th for it. Mycenae now has Sailing :eeek: They are sure to start making contacts soon and probably will steal that one hut. I note that the Hitites still don't know Cerremonial burrial, which is a first row tech, so i ship it to them @ last for their 50 gold.
IT - Nothing
[2] - Tyre TG -> Settler
Sidon Settler -> TG
Diplo Check - Mycenae now has HBR and contact with Hittites
Hittites now have HBR too.
Egypt, the last civ not to know HBR or have any contacts now has The Wheel. We ship them HBR for it
. What a steal.IT - zzzzz
[3] Byblos - Warrior -> Warrior
Diplo Check: Mycenae and the Hittites now know The Wheel
Pop a hut in the West Egyptian desert and we learn chariotry. This is a completely useless dead end tech to everyone but the Hitites and the Egyptians. Maybe we can get something of value for it, but I doubit it. Disperse a Barb camp near the Sumarians and take 25 gold.
Diplo Check: Hittites have only 25 gold, and Egypt is broke so no deal on Chariotry, then I notice something interesting.....
Why will Mycenae pay for a worthless, useless dead end tech? This makes ZERO sense. It's like the AI paying for a full price for Free Artistry after Shakes is built (which it doesn't do). I can't see any reason NOT to sell it for all they have. Deal done.
IT - Nothing.
[4] Berytus Worker -> Worker (vetoable. maybe a burrial mound would be better but... I really like lots of workers)
Diplo: Medes now has Sailing
Pop a hut over on the edge of the world behind the hitites and we get... Polytheisim! YUM! Are we sure we aren't playing on regent? Two huts/two techs seems too good to be true.
IT- zzzzz
[5] Tyre - Settler -> TG
Diplo Check - Eastern half of the world all know Diplomacy, Babs have also picked up Sailing. Try to traid sailing @4th for Diplomacyh at 4th and its not even close to an even swap.It takes about 80 gold on top of Sailing.They WOULD give it and all their 25 gold for the wheel, but as no one in the eastern area knows the wheel yet I don't want to do that deal. I pass for now.
Pop the hut on close isle and we get: A conscript HORSEMAN?!. Nice! If we can keep this unit alive and promote it that will be sweet.
Note that Wonder city is size 5 now and needs annother happy face. Bah. I should have sent the TG over there last turn
. Lux to 10% for one turn to keep it happy.IT - zzzzz
[6] TG arrives at Colossus City, lux back to 0%. ZZZZZ
Found Arvad on the coast SE of Byblos.
Time to call my gf.
When I return, I load up the game, click next turn we learn Masonry and...
IT- Z_Z-(zzz) .... -_- .... o_0 .... ((O_O))
(Note: Shouldn't scientific leaders be OFF in this scenareo?)
Still nothing on the diplo front.
[7] Research started on CoL at 100%. It is due in 8.
Stone still 1 turn away So I leave the leader sitting.
Leader Fortified in Tyre. No stone yet anyway.
Diplo check reveals Sumaria has a worker available. I ship then Sailing and 4g for it. Every other civ Except egypt knows this tech by now. Medes now knows Cuneiform. Sumeria was the LAST civ we hadn't got a worker from, so worker buys are now off the table (is there a point when we can buy more? maybe 100 turns into the scenareo?)
IT- Stone is hooked up
[8] ZZZZZ
Diplo check... Crapola. The east/west contact barrier has been broken. Hitites and Medeans now have contact with everyone except Egypt. The Myceneans still lack contact with Babylon and Sumer but you know that can't last long. Medeans shows up with the Wheel, Hittites with Chariotry, and :eeek: the Myceneans with Mining.
Ship the Medeans Mining, Chariotry (worth like 30g to them but useless) and 44g for Diplomacy. Not sure if this was good or bad. Diplomacy seems to be a "government tech" like nationalisim so the AI overvalues it. With the Myceneans having both these techs I figured they would make this deal with them soon if I didn't. Sell Sumer contact with Mycenae for their 32 gold. Again, I figured they would have it soon from either the Hitites or the the Medeans.
I hold off on using the leader. In fact, Ill let Charis use it after some team discussion because I don't see a 2 turn delay on rushing a wonder as anything to worry about.
IT- zipo
[9] zzzzzz
Unload a warrior over on the far island and we learn construction........ the prng is tryng its best to remove all challenge from this scenareo?!?.........
IT - zilch
[10] Tyre - TG -> Temple of Artemes
Sidon TG -> Settler
Acco founded down by the gems mountian.
I know what I think we should do, but you guys tell me. I'd swap the Colossus build to the Statue of Zeus, Rush the Temple of Artemes in the capital, then swap the Capital to the Colossus. We could build a stream of TG's out of Sidon and . If we get all 3 wonders we can probably cruise home with a military campaign vs somone.
Notes. Workers are concentrating on roading up to our gems city and our wines city at the moment. Once we have these (and the Temple of Artemes?) Hooked up we should be in good shape for happiness for a while. We are "average" militarily vs our 2 neighbors (Babylon and Egypt), though we have several warriors rather "out of position" because they are exploring. Probably time to bring the boys back home in case something nasty happens. Remember, we can now negotiate MPP's if somone declares on us. It is also time to start thinking which government we want to switch to. Both have 2-4-8 unit support. Oligarchy offers lower waste and corruption, but 2mp, war wearyness and pop rush. Monarchy offers the same corruption we have now, but 3mp and cash rush. Our econ blows so bad right now I dono if cash rush is good for the forseeable future. I would probably tend to favor Oligarchy but perhaps I'm missing something.
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