RBD13 SG - Cretan Army Variant

[Schnarrd]

I take paper notes too to remind myself of specific events like broker deals, city names, and such. The main events in my turns I recall from memory. Depending on how creative I feel (and how detailed of notes I take - I don't always remember which turns certain events happened on), I may write my turn summary in the form of a straight turn-by-turn or in the form of a narrative. No matter what form my turn summaries come in, I usually try to get at least one joke in there somewhere, however.

Charis: Actually, I just realized that I've been guilty of the "capitol" weed too! I think the RBD forums are corrupting my mind with pungent weed. :crazyeyes

 

[Arathorn]

I will, too, step up to the confessional and admit to my sins. Paper notes of varying detail, depending on how much of a hurry I'm in/how late it is/how interesting the game (or turns are).

I usually play in the evening/night and write my turn summary the next morning (my Net connection from home is slow and flaky -- a bad combo). That gives me the commute time in the morning to figure out how I'm going to "frame" my story.

I definitely lean toward the analytic side of the spectrum -- telling what happened and why I did what I did. Not sure how interesting of reading it is... Heck, I'm not even sure how informative it is. It's been so long since I've written anything "public" other than academic papers, I wasn't sure I remembered how.

Screen shots are also important, and I find myself forgetting to take them and then wishing I had one/two when I'm writing up my report. Oh well.

Arathorn

 

[Schnarrd]

Is the Bull Rider too strong? Borderline yes. It's actually not inappropriate compared to the Chinese Rider in terms of strength, shields and distribution (the latter is 4.3.3). The difference is in when they come. Rider has longbow offense and pike defense, which is equiv to best offense and best def of the ear, plus lightning speed. Identical with Bull Rider, same def as spear, same off as swordsmen.

Well, that's part of the reason I like the Chinese so much. Actually, though, there's one more difference between the Bull Rider and Chinese Rider: The Chinese Rider has a similar unit, the knight, while the Bull Rider has none. The closest unit that comes close to emulating the Bull Rider in the ancient era is the swordsman. So in effect, we have mobile swordsman that can retreat and that can move practically anywhere within a couple turns. Also, you know how the game kind of falls apart for the AI in the industrial age with the combo of rails + cavalry + artillery? Well, what we've got is ancient era cavalry that no other civ has the option of building. Is that too strong? I guess I'd have to agree with you ina borderline yes, but with some reservations. I think a 3.2.2 unit would have been sufficient, since pretty much the only thing the AI's can use to fight our bulls are swordsmen, which only have one movement point, so our bulls would just retreat. However, no culture is a huge handicap, so I wouldn't want to go into this game without some sort of compensation (well, actually I might have been willing to play with a civ like the Aztecs or Iroquois). I guess we'll just have to play and see whether the bull rider is too buff or not.

 

[Warstrike]

This is the last will and testament of Warstrike the almost competent.

Know ye all, then, the events of my reign up to this date, when I have obviously expired from that cold I got when I forgot to come out of the rain.

[0] As I survey the kingdom, one question comes to mind - How should I try to settle the silks?

[1] Our glorious Bull rider blew away a barbarian camp in a double charge. Glorious! Vai makes a settler, who is sent West to find a hole by the silks. They then start a barracks. If we want to keep our pattern of settling up, there are a few Russian cities that have to go. Our NE scout warrior finds a barbarian camp.

[2] The Romans start the pyramids, which is fine with me. the Iroquois beat the warrior to the camp, losing one of their warriors in the process. I micromanage production and squeeze a few more trade out of some of our cities, by losing unnecessary shields.

[3] Foul odors completes its barracks and starts training Riders. Stalis makes a settler, and sends him west also, to continue our grid, although its intended spot is rather close to the exposed Russian city. Liz comes and tries to use her feminine whiles on me(shudder). She wants an alliance vs Egypt for a ROP. I try hard not to laugh in her face. Checking to see if there are any other accomodations to be made, I find she has Math,Philosophy,
Code of Law, and Mapmaking, is technologically advanced (is that statement in relation to us or the world?), and will trade Philosophy, 5g, and contact with America for 20 turns of incense. I decline.

[4] Russia does us a big favor and razes Oxford. This makes possible 2 cities around the silks without really crowding. Our settler finds a nice spot near the silks and founds Wormtown. This was my best attempt here, any advice on different places I should have put it can be sent to me via our sole priest, who is mostly busy burying us ceremonially. Wormtown starts a spear. Hellespont builds a settler and starts a spear. The settler prepares to plunge into te jungle to find this colored stuff his wife tells him would be nice to go with the silks.

[5] Malia builds a settler, starts a rider. There is MMOS (settlers), to the E and W.

[6] This was when my nickname Warstrike the Competent started to be revised. China shows up at our door, asking for our TM and 39 gold. I told him to go away. He said he would, but he
was going to come back with a bunch of troops and stomp all over our "unimpressive" cities. In the East, a barb shows up by the leading edge of the 2 settlers trying to set up. The
defending warrior attacks and dies. The settlers flee screaming towards Hellespont. A warrior from the town N of the Capital is sent to the capital, to free up its spear next turn.

[7] The Iroquois ally with China. Our scout in the NE is attacked and survives. He then beats on a barbarian horse.

[8] I moved stuff. Fortified the 2 hp warrior on a mountain next to the barb camp.

[9] The NE scout dies to a horsie. Settler about ready to settle, then I think I can move him one farther, just like by the capital . My Bull rider in the area finds the closest Chinese border, another Rider is brought S. The other 2 available Riders are scrambling E to clear the Jungle for settlement. There are now 3 settlers just E of Hellespont, and a spear coming. Chasing barbarian appears. Bull rider minces him.

[10] In the final years of my reign, Hellespont makes a spear and starts a spear. I discover I sent the Western settler 1 step too far, and U-turn. (BTW red is so much easier to see the imaginary border). Our 2 bull riders are poised to charge China. I realize that this would set off a GA. Riders withdraw.

Now that you know the story of my reign, dear successor, I hereby bequeath unto you:

4 settlers, 1 ready to settle down and 3 trying to penetrate east.
The Pyramids, due in one turn, in which I request to be entombed.
A shadow war, which we aren't ready for and you need to figure out what to do about.

options: 1) Try to make peace asap without shooting.

2) fight as necessary with normal units, defensively, until we get to Monarchy in 14 turns, then revolt and KillKillKill, getting our GA.
3) charge in with all available units (not many, but tough), waste a GA and do as much damage as possible. 3 of our Riders can hit the border pretty fast, we're leapfrogging a road, and more Riders are being produced.

A really bad tech tree position, with no way to speed Monarchy unless we can trade up to it. (I don't think anyone has it yet, but I can't remember if the offered techs max out at 4.)

This will and testament produced on this, the Seventh day of some month that will be called March, 550 bc.

Warstrike the Almost Competent

P.S. I suppose that since we haven't learned Code of Law yet, you may have trouble getting
any competitors for the throne to believe that this means anything. Good Luck!

 

[xrang the II]

i've got the game. charis, im playing the saxon menace so ill have this ^ later 2morrow ill do my BEST!

 

[Charis]

Read the description and was confused, so i looked at the save file.

China and Iroquois??? They're literally half-way around the world!

Some thoughts...

i) ignore the threat and try hard to get out of despotism quickly
For how far they have to travel, 14 turns is almost nothing.
ii) buy Rome ally vs Iroquois for straight 420 gold (i don't think we want to give ANYONE our maps yet), and give England Incense and 100 gold for ally vs China. Let our "cultural" friends fight our battle (muhahahaha!!!)
iii) Give England Incense and 50ish gold for BOTH code of laws and philosophy, see if they also have Republic (right away or soon)
iv) go at 'em with our Riders and crush them

I think (i) will work just fine, although (ii) has a perverse quality about it. (iv) would be an awful choice. In addition to ruining our GA, Iro and China are SO far away we could never ever hold or hope to expand to, new holdings at all.

So my guess would be, do NOT engage the enemy with the riders
We really want to have an FP site picked out and founded, and out of despotism. After that, Rumble!!

Speaking of Forbidden Palace spots... hmmm... Wormtown isn't hideous, ok-ish, but not super. Pungetoss and Gortyna too close. Oh wow!! Look at York! That's perfect!! Let's found it in York
As others said, as our ONLY other culture/wonder city, we do want to get cranking on the FP asap. After round one done (soon!) we'll take a FP poll

Warstrike, looking at things I would say you did rather well in your turn, no problem...

Xrang, things might get tricky, but if you build up, settle like a madman "in the lanes" (see Sirian's post) and avoid killing anything but a barbarian with a Bull Rider, you will have done great

Charis

 

[Warstrike]

Actually, the Chinese border isn't that far away(although that might be 1 city), just a little to the west of Wormtown's successor. I got a bull rider from Wormtown to the light purple border in 1 turn. So we might see some Chinese units, and may want to shuttle a spear to each of those cities just in case (Worm has 2 warriors, the settler is escorted with 1 and I had planned to run interference with Bulls, which is out.

My vote on the FP was the big tract of land to our east somewhere, but maybe that is close enough to the palace that we should make one in an existing or soon to exist city win the West, the better to take care of that big chunk of land that will reasonably soon be ours :slay:

 

[xrang the II]

After years of 'incompetent' rulers and lesser kings Rangus Khan I arose as the most powerful among them. This is his story-

Turn 0, 550 BC
An Iroquois Mounted Warrior attacks and kills our Warrior by Centralia. Supreme Lord, we have completed the Pyradmids in Knossos.
We begin working on a Barracks which will take only 2 turns. Vai has produced Baracks, now working on Bull Rider. The Romans, Egyptians, Iroquais,
Russians, and Chinese are buildng the Oracle. Two Workers continue in making the road from Stalis to Wormtown. I think that this would be a good time to call
up Rome and England like Charis said. I can trade 410 g for a military alliance against the Iroquois. I bite. Rome
delared war on the Iroquois! Lizzie will take a military alliance for incense and 100 g...ok. England declared war on
the Chinese! Yes! World War I! Back to reality...We settle the other silks with the town Smutville (btw, y r we making all
of the city names have something to do with being dirty or something?). Smutville starts working on Spearman and will grow in 10 turns.
The Warrior fortifies in Smutville. I fortify the Bull Rider next to Smutville right where he is (is it just me or the weed
because the 'bull' looks like an elephant...it's probably the weed). I move the Bull Rider next to the English border in the
south. MMOW. I fortify the Bull Rider in Hellespont. I'm not sure how to settle the southern dyes... I think we're going
to settle those horses as well so I start to move that way.

Turn 1, 530 BC
Wow! A Russian Horseman comes on over to out territory. I'll fix that. The people love me! An extra floor is added to the Palace.
I won't bother the Russians because Catherine looks too warlike right now. We'll just see what they do... MMOW. We settle Doxologia
in the forest. The newlyfounded city begins on Spearman. I fortify a Spearman in Doxologia. MMOW. Oh no! A chinese Warrior is spotted
near our Bull Rider! What do I do?! What if they attack? I'll risk it!

Turn 2, 510 BC
No worries, good times the Warriors went right past me! Bull Rider defeats a Barbarian in the south.
Knossos build Barracks, now Swordsman. I think we need an army of Swordsmen not Bull Riders if we're going to use them.
I move that Bull Rider out of harm's way... Littos builds Spearman, begins another one. MMOW.

This is getting interesting, too interesting. I'll stop now because i think a professional should take care of this...I'll
be sure to 'grab the game in the future'.... Charis, i also had to play saxon so i was cut short, sorry. Good Luck, all!

(no weed was used during this turn)

 

[xrang the II]

Here's the .zip file-

 

[Charis]

The Minoan council got together in the year 510 BC to lookover the status of
their nation and to review its history... to better see where it is going!

Founded in 4000 BC, the nation quickly grew to three staunch core cities under
the helm of Minoan King Sirian. The concent of a regular grid with "lanes" was
seen to have a keen appeal to the people. Two more cities are founded and the
great Pyramids project where started by "Bull" Charis. These settlers were
followed by a great explorer, Arathorn, who discovered new lands and luxuries.
Our Warlord King, Jaffa, saw our Cretan civilization grow from coast to coast,
and he discovered the secrets of Iron. The next leader, Meldor, was remembered
for his outstanding acumen in trading, surging us ahead in technology. It was
also during his reign that the glory of our nation, the Bull Rider, arrived!!!
The next Minoan King was a true wildcard, a pig farmer by the name of Schmutzig!
He built up our initial army of bulls and tried to rally the people for
greater expansion. Warstrike, next in succession, seems named for his mighty
crushing of the barbarian threat. He also made the history changing decision
to stand up for Crete! He told Mao to shove his threats where the Bull don't
shine! Mao did not like the Taurine excrement in which his parchment
was returned and declared war, allying with the evil Iroquois.
On the transition year from Warstrike to Xrang, the magnificent and industrious
Pyramid project was completed!! What a great boon to settling this will be!
Rather than soil the young bulls horns on these two enemies, Xrangs brief,
brief turn produces one result: ally with Rome vs Iroquois and England vs
China! It's World War I and only 510 BC! (Somehow England is also at war with
Egypt and Russia. ALL known civs are at war, and there is one hiding in the dark.

Members of the Minoan council, we're now at a crossroads. With 12 cities, we
are now able to start the Forbidden Palace! This city, and this palace, will
have a tremendous impact for many years to come. Yet we really must pick a
spot and start on it soon. The council asks for input on thoughts for the
forbidden palace, and they will soon fall to a more fluid system of succession
where leaders come in and out quicker and are able to more rapidly respond
to new threats. So before then... Forbidden Palace... where?

Native? Gortyna, Stallis, Wormtown are three possible choices among current
cities. Wormtown has silk, lot of forest, a wheat and grass mine.
Stallis has iron hills, wheat and forest. Gortyna has cattle, hills, forest,
and is likely too close to our present capital. Distances are: 8, 12, 16.
Distance 12 you're strongly feeling corruption effects. By 16 or more you're
at or near being a one-shield town, the drop off is really quick! So at 16+
(or maybe even 14+), you can no longer really build it but may need a leader
to hurry it.

Unexplored
- To the east, 13-16 squares are two spots of interest. One with a lot
of hills, the other with wheat and TWO cattle. We have a settler about 12
squares away.

Foreign?
- York! It's on a river and a hill and has flood plains and hills. Dist 9.
The English are over-extended in war, and if we set our sites on York,
nothing could stop us. We would build up an army until end of 20 turn alliance.
- Russia? Riga is 10, Hastings is 14 squares away.
(In both cases I mean 'on the spot' of... raze first for either one)

In the attached screenshot, Gortyna, Stallis, Wormtown are Cyan, Red, Blue.
York is green, Riza is yellow. On the East side, I like the LtGreen spot area.

Thoughts too on wonders? Next eligible ones are Great Wall, Hanging Gardens,
SunTzu, Leo.

We need your input!
Charis

 

[Sirian]

I believe all of those locations are closer than I'd like to see for a large map with a conquest theme. The west is too much in contention, while the east is largely wide open, with Rome sticking its neck out over there as much as we would be. IMO, we have not explored enough yet to make a good decision. If we can trade for maps, that would be our next top priority.

- Sirian

 

[meldor]

Most of those locations are too close to the coast!

I have to agree the Sirian that we need the Russian, English and Roman territory maps at least to be able to make a good choice. Maybe one of us could take a few turns and unlock these mysteries before we commit to a set course. With no culture except these two cities, it may be a make or break choice. A little extra caution would be called for here.

OTOH, it does seem that our GA is going to be thurst upon us, and too much delay could hurt as well. One risky gambit would be to bet on getting a leader or two from war and use one to found it at a later chosen spot, but not too much later. A leader may be needed any way just to get it done in time.

 

[Warstrike]

1) The unrevealed name is the Americans I think, because IIRC Liz offered it to me in return for our incense.

2) I still vote for the eastern lands for the FP, because I think we can settle some pretty decent cities there.

3)I forget, and am too lazy to look back to the rules, but are we allowed to build marketplaces/banks? Or is it only military buildings?

4) I still think we can avoid our GA and get to Monarchy at least, if we defend the west with some good spears while building riders and building up a force behind our front lines. Maybe (I forget if we have iron) some swordsmen to counterattack, if you think we are going to get run over in the next 15 or so turns.

 

[Sirian]

After a brief period of apathy in the capital, and everybody playing hot potato with the crown ("I'm not gonna try it, YOU try it." "I'm not gonna try it!" "I know! Let's get Mikey!") a young Bull Rider, uh, takes this game by the horns.



Remember, the rule is must post results within 8 hours after posting Got It. Can also post "On Deck" to claim first dibs on the save after the current Got It player has posted his turn. Can play less than ten if you run out of time, also.

I should be able to manage a turn this morning, if I, er, leave some other tasks to pile up for later in the day.

Got It.


- Sirian

 

[Sirian]

Here's a settlement plan for our eastern front.

Remember, we'll be razing all enemy cities, so this plan is made without consideration to where the AI has built stuff. This is where we want our cities!

 

[Sirian]

Here's a dotmap for our heartland, the desert and hilly region north of our capital.

Please note, this area is especially tricky, and ANY deviation from this plan will force the entire dotmap to have to be reworked, or else gaps will form in the middle of our lands.

 

[Charis]

Glad you jumped in there, especially with the dot maps. (This variant is a dot-map-makers dream or nightmare, depending how you look at it )

One question- the dark blue dot above Foul Odors... couldn't that be moved one north, gaining 3 more coastal squares and losing nothing, leaving no gap. Other than that, yes, any move of even a square needs a remapping.

Another question, more in general. What is the method to "unfound" a city? Either in earlier versions or easier difficulties I thought I read you could rush-build a settler at a certain size and disband the city. Does that (still) work? If so how?

Razing all foes, settling will be all-game event, we'll no doubt have some cities just churning settlers one after the other. But at this point, wow, that's a *lot* we have to do, while yet involved in a two-enemy war, trying to manage GA appearance, thinking about FP, and with big infrastructure needs. Wee!

I'm still a little concerned with how late the FP might come on line, but nod, "we need more info and time" is probably the right answer at this point.

Charis

 

[Sirian]

IT: full map brokerage nets us Mapmaking plus all the world maps plus a little gold. The bad news? Iro's are too close to the eastern lands to be safe to go start an FP city. Also... frankly, there really isn't a good candidate spot over there for now. My assessment on the FP: it's going to have to wait, and we will probably have to rush it ala RBD6. 12 turns to Monarchy? Ugh. I pull most of our vet spears and send them westward, and set Smutville and the other silk town to building walls.

Early turns: running interference with our bulls vs the Chinese warriors, who refuse to attack our glorious UU. Some swords moving up behind them, though, have to be carefully avoid. I did buy some time this way. Um... some of our rivals have Monarchy now. When the Oracle was finished, China cascaded to Great Wall, the rest to Hanging Gardens or Lighthouse. Our silks come online.

Middle turns: Our lone sword and our spears behind our new walls fend off the Chinese, mostly warriors. They manage to pillage one road, that's about it. In the east, I've settled some new cities. A MASSIVE barbarian outbreak happened, and in our eastermost town at the time, every single male was slaughtered and every female raped. I happened to see it coming, and so I traded away our treasury and some minor gpt for Construction on the turn before the horde charged into the town, and I also told our spearman to flee! The barbarians essentially got nothing of importance except causing the loss of 7 shields toward a worker, and inflicting deep emotional scars on the poor people of that city. Oh yeah, and Egypt finished the Hanging Gardens!

Late turns: We got Monarchy and I revolted. More Chinese arriving, still mostly warriors, we fend them off. During anarchy, we were losing a massive amount of GPT due to all the tech and map deals I had made, and BARELY had enough to cover it even with running FIVE taxmen out of Knossos! This was almost a major weed inhalation on my part, but sometimes it's better to be lucky than good. (We drew a modest 5 turn anarchy, 7 or 8 would have busted us).

Overtime: Rather than hand off in anarchy, I played on. A Chinese warrior snuck past my blockade and crept on a town with only a warrior defending. I had to send a bull rider along our roads at top speed to get there to defend the city, and when the Chinese attacked (on our last turn of anarchy), our Golden Age began! (One turn of GA wasted, guess I'll call that a "good" result, since I worked my tail off to delay any such encounter with the Chinese, and it did take them 15 turns to manage it finally).

The whole known world declared war on Iro's and England.

Oh yeah, and China finished the Great Wall.

Now with our Golden Age: we could build troops and try to beat down Russia (forget China, they have double defenses now). Or we could try to beat Rome back off our eastern border. OR... we can build courthouses, so that our civ has SOME PRAYER of a future once the GA runs out. I thought the latter course was best, so our inner cities were set to Marketplace and others to courthouse. Some new cities are still building workers.

Peace could be had with China any time we want it now, our alliance has expired and I put enough hurtin on their military (we took no losses, though came close a few times). Or... we could stay at war and fish for leaders. I leave that up to future kings.

The next 20 turns will be make or break for our long term growth curve. Charis, might be a good idea if you took ten of them, somewhere in there. (Next up or On Deck).

Unfortunately... everyone is on the Great Library, we can't go after that one, and I'm pretty sure someone will get Feudalism before it's built, meaning a massive cascade. SunTzu would be our top priority! If we do get a leader, I'd be tempted to say to save him for SunTzu at Knossos. The other alternative is to build an army and go for the early Heroic Epic to try to get more sooner. Using the first leader on an FP is OUT, since we don't yet have anything even remotely approaching a worthwhile (much less secure) location.

Some of our medium cities are doing the Food Shuffle with swapping tiles, keep an eye on that. We also now are in Monarchy, so please irrigate at least one or two grassland tiles near most cities to speed population growth, thank you.

Good luck to the next Minoan King.


- Sirian

 

[Sirian]

Charis: the dark blue dot is the only location that grabs that fish. EDIT: Then again, the location you suggested MIGHT be much better (and screw the fish) if there were a partner city across the strait. I didn't think that far ahead, though. Will leave it up in the air, either option may work.

I also left a Collesseum on build in Knossos. I figure we need ONE, in the capital, as an arena for showing off our glorious Bull Riders in front of the King.

- Sirian

 

[Charis]

Got it.

I also left a Collesseum on build in Knossos. I figure we need ONE, in the capital, as an arena for showing off our glorious Bull Riders in front of the King.

luv it

Kudos to all in recent turns who stayed their hands and held back the might rather that is the bull, and led us into this magnificent Golden Age. We shall show ourselves to be civilized by doing many wonderful things, both on the battlefield and in the courtroom and city.

This phrase does come to mind though...

"Loose bull in a China shop"

Walls or not, those clowns are not getting off easy. If the world is at war with England, too, I'm going to get my piece of the pie (York!!). World war is a good thing for slowing their economy while ours is up in GA. I hate to see a GA not get a wonder though... too bad no placeholder, would love to be working on SunTzu a little early and get Feudalism soon. (It won't happen that quick though, and even if it did, Feudalism is the start of the end of Bull dominance)

Charis