Revising the lore of each civic

Charity is underwhelming. I think it should give +health and -crime in addition to +happiness, but also cost a lot more. That way it'll be more of a choice.
 
Charity is underwhelming. I think it should give +health and -crime in addition to +happiness, but also cost a lot more. That way it'll be more of a choice.

Suggest that in this thread, for this one only applies to the text side of things.

If there are no complaints then I can push that into the SVN once the time comes to apply the revised lore.
 
Education

Ignorance

Old: Allows blissful wallowing

New: Whatever knowledge or wisdom someone gained during their lives is lost once they die.

Oral Tradition

Old: Your nation passes knowledge to the next generation through telling stories.

New: Knowledge is transmitted through the use of stories and songs.

Written Tradition

Old: Your nation passes knowledge to the next generation through written stories.

New: Records of previous facts are kept in writing, of which the few who are literate are able to read.

Martial (was Military Tradition)

Old: Your nation passes knowledge to the next generation through military tradations.

New: Children are trained under a rigorous program by veteran warriors made to produce strong and capable fighters.

Religious (was Religious Training)

Old: Your nation passes knowledge to the next generation through relgious dogma.

New: Various oral and written beliefs, doctrines, rituals and customs are memorized by the populace who devotedly transmit them to the next generation.

Apprenticeship

Old: One bound by indenture to serve another for a prescribed period with a view to learning an art or trade. Add's 25% to the Great People's growth rate, allows unlimited engineers

New: People are educated from an early age the ways of practicing a specific craft by their parents or teachers.

Corporate (was Corporate Education)

Old: Your nation passes knowledge to the next generation through commercialism and consumerism.

New: Employers provide new hires a business-oriented education, where some classes are related to the specificities of being a productive worker.

Compulsory (was Compulsory Education)

Old: Your nation passes knowledge to the next generation through repetition and memorization.

New: All children are required to have a proper education, and several schools are built in order to achieve that demand.

Propaganda

Old: Your nation passes knowledge to the next generation through propaganda.

New: The government uses education as a way to influence the people towards specific political causes.

Online (was E-Education)

Old: Your nation passes knowledge to the next generation through the internet.

New: Young people learn remotely, through various web courses, in the comfort of their homes.

Fast (was Rapid Education)

Old: Allows your people to download knowledge directly into their minds.

New: Brain implants allow people to directly view and memorize information from a variety of different databases on request, with the downside of having to be in range of a viable internet connection for it to work.

Instant (was Instant Education)

Old: All collective knowledge is shared directly into minds of the nation.

New: The sum of human knowledge is saved inside advanced cybernetics dedicated to data storage, whose information can be accessed at any time.

Omniscience (was Universal Knowledge)

Old: Know everything.

New: Individuals have complete knowledge about the whole universe, past and present.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: tmv
Much better. Especially the description of Ignorance (shows better the actual effects of this civic), Written Tradition (shows the limitations of this civic), Apprenticeship and Corporate (more neutral description) is strongly improved. The old description of Compulsary was even wrong, the text was about rote learning.
 
Language

Nonverbal (was No Language)

Old: Your nation has speaks in grunts and gestures.

New: Communication is made through the use of nonverbal methods like body language.

Local (was Native Language)

Old: Your nation has its own unique language.

New: Speaking with someone outside of one's community is near impossible, as different places have mutually unintelligible tongues.

Pidgin (was Trade Language)

Old: Your nation has developed a simplified language when communicating with other nations.

New: By coming up with a simplified and mutually understood made-up language, people are now able to talk with someone from outside their region.

Written (was Interpreters)

Old: Your nation uses Interpreters when communcating with other nations.

New: Language can now be translated into writing which makes information sharing easier, as one no longer needs to be in the presence of another to exchange ideas and thoughts.

Codified (was Language Education)

Old: Language education is the teaching and learning of a foreign or second language. Language education is a branch of applied linguistics.

New: An effort was made to standardize all writing systems inside the nation into a logical format so as to make them easier to learn and harder for languages to differentiate over time.

International (was World Language)

Old: One global language that everyone speaks.

New: Language education in schools coupled with an ever growing global interconnectivity between nations have allowed for a lingua franca to emerge which almost everyone understands.

Translated (was Universal Translator)

Old: Your nation uses a Universal Translator to communcate with any language.

New: A device allows for almost real-time communications with someone who speaks another language.

Telepathic (was Telepathy)

Old: Communicating directly from mind to mind.

New: Cybernetics allow for thoughts to be wirelessly transmitted into the minds of others.

Xenosemiotic (was Xenosemiotics)

Old: Interstellar communication via semiotics

New: It is now possible to instantly convey complex ideas, emotions and experiences to any sentient lifeform simply through touch.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: tmv
Old: We do not speak the same language.

I think you changed wrong entry - it was grunts and gestures or something like that
 
Pidgin is a linguistic phenomenon.
Trade language is a social institution.
'Pidgin' is not a proper word for a civic option.

I hesitated to stick my foot back in this thread, because of how deep my disapproval now runs with a lot of this language. I think you've mutated a number of the civics away from their actual concept, either by a name swap to a false equivalence, or the by-line change introducing errant details. I don't think xenosemiotic has anything to do with touch. I think military tradition is different from martial education. I think instant education is not necessarily wrought through a machine server without a wifi password.

Coming up with a quality test to apply to civic contributions going forward seems harder than anything I know how to do, and easier (probably) is to try providing my own civic text. But neither one is something I can say "And I approve of this idea of mine" after producing it, with the effort I can lend at this time. So I just have to say I do not vote confidence in what's in this thread.

However, it is 100% true that these changes are better than the vacuity that now exists on the civics page. Any words at all are better than the Power category just saying "Power!" three times and categories mixing modifiers with encyclopedia citations.
 
@HorseshoeHermit thank you for writing your opinion about this.

All changes are made after hours of consideration and research, which begin from reading the pedia sections of each civic, the technology that unlocks each civic and the technology proper in order to have some context on what this civic is trying to represent.

For quite a lot of civics I had to considerably stray from their original meaning as they no longer corresponded to what they were saying anymore, many civics are still remnants from when C2C was an almost direct port of Rise of Mankind, and a decade of changes have happened since then.

So in that regard, I'm sorry you don't fully support the changes in question, but I appreciate for believing this is, at least, something better than what currently exists.

I like to think that nothing is forever and these civics (and descriptions) can be changed at any time. Personally I always found them odd in my many years of playing C2C so I finally got the motivation to do something about it, and at the very least I will try leaving something that is better than what was before. There's also the fact that English is not my mother tongue and many text would be much more well written if done by a native,
Pidgin is a linguistic phenomenon.
Trade language is a social institution.
'Pidgin' is not a proper word for a civic option.
I tried going for linguistic phenomenons since the civic was called Language. What C2C had represented was something akin to "understanding of foreigners", which is more related to translation abilities than anything else.

For that purpose I replaced the current system into something more similar to reality, where in the beginning there were a lot of dissipated languages that, with time and effort, either got extinct, merged or stood the test of time and became codified with government intervention.
I don't think xenosemiotic has anything to do with touch. I think military tradition is different from martial education. I think instant education is not necessarily wrought through a machine server without a wifi password.
Regarding Xenosemiotic, I was inspired by sci-fi literature, specifically on the Protheans and their method of communication.

For Martial Education, I was going for the real world equivalent of the Spartan education, the Agoge.

As for instant education, again, inspired by science fiction, but tried to give it a different flavor based on the technology and era in question.

EDIT: It's true that some civics are simple upgrades from the last available choice (language, for example), but I tried my best to make sure most civics would convey the fact that they are options a nation could have at anytime (like anarchism, irreligion, no currency, etc. for role-playing purposes).
 
Last edited:
You have changed the meaning of almost all the Language civics into something totally different to the intent. It is supposed to be about how two people from different areas communicate with each other face to face. Writing should not be mentioned anywhere.

The Language Civic (and the Garbage one at least) exists because there is no other way than Civics to apply a relationship boost/malus between nations.
 
@Dancing Hoskuld @HorseshoeHermit thoughts on the revised language civic names and descriptions?

Language

No Language

Old: Your nation has speaks in grunts and gestures.

New: Communication is made through the use of nonverbal methods like body language.

Native Language

Old: Your nation has its own unique language.

New: Each nation has an unique language.

Trade Language

Old: Your nation has developed a simplified language when communicating with other nations.

New: By coming up with a simplified and mutually understood language made to facilitate trade, people are now able to talk with someone from outside their region.

Interpreters

Old: Your nation uses Interpreters when communcating with other nations.

New: Individuals versed in two or more languages are able to act as translators for nations who don't speak the same language.

Codified (was Language Education)

Old: Language education is the teaching and learning of a foreign or second language. Language education is a branch of applied linguistics.

New: An effort was made to standardize the language inside the nation into a more logical format that is easier to learn.

World Language

Old: One global language that everyone speaks.

New: Language education in schools coupled with an ever growing global interconnectivity between nations have allowed for a lingua franca to emerge which almost everyone understands.

Universal Translator

Old: Your nation uses a Universal Translator to communcate with any language.

New: A device allows for almost real-time communications with someone who speaks another language.

Telepathic (was Telepathy)

Old: Communicating directly from mind to mind.

New: Cybernetics allow for thoughts to be wirelessly transmitted into the minds of others.

Xenosemiotic (was Xenosemiotics)

Old: Interstellar communication via semiotics

New: It is now possible to instantly convey complex ideas, emotions and experiences to any sentient lifeform.
 
Garbage

Everywhere (was Garbage Anywhere)

Old: Toss garbage on the ground.

New: Either from a lack of knowledge or by feelings of apathy, garbage is not removed and instead piles up everywhere.

Burned (was Burn Garbage)

Old: Burn trash into ashes.

New: Waste is incinerated through the use of fire.

Thrown to Sea (was Waste to Sea)

Old: Toss garbage into the sea.

New: Trash is dumped into the sea, polluting it in an attempt to avoid polluting the air with smoke. Other seafaring nations are not pleased with this decision.

Landfills

Old: Toss garbage into the sea.

New: Junk is collected and placed inside dedicated areas meant to store it.

Exported (was Waste Exportation)

Old: Send trash to other nations.

New: Other nations "agree" to take our waste.

Imported (was Waste Importation)

Old: Get trash from other nations.

New: Accepting trash from other places as a way to get an additional revenue source.

Waste to Energy

Old: Send trash to be converted into energy.

New: Factories burn garbage and convert it into usable energy.

Recycled (was Recycling)

Old: Recycle, Reduce, Reuse

New: Waste is converted into new materials and objects.

Off-Planet Dumping

Old: Send trash to outer-space.

New: Trash is sent to space where it is stored in specially designated places, or simply thrown into the sun.

Atomized (was Atomize Trash)

Old: Atomize Trash

New: Waste is broken down into very fine particles.

Dematerialized (was Dematerialization)

Old: Dematerialize Trash

New: Trash is sent into another dimension.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: tmv
This is good. But with

Exported (was Waste Exportation)

Old: Send trash to other nations.

New: Other nations agree to take our waste.
it should be made clear that this may not be entirely voluntary on the other nations' part - otherwise there would be little reason for the diplomatic malus. Perhaps putting "agree" in quotes might be enough for that. :)
 
Immigration

Borderless (was No Borders)

Old: Your nation has no offical borders.

New: There are no official borders and people come and go as they please.

Closed Borders

Old: Your nation is closed to all immigrants.

New: People aren't allowed to immigrate to our nation.

Open Borders

Old: Your nation is open to all immigrants.

New: Even though borders exist, we allow people to immigrate to our country.

Skilled Workers

Old: Your nation is closed to all immigrants except for Skilled Workers.

New: Our civilization only accepts immigrants that are knowledgeable or that demonstrate skill in a particular craft.

Secured Borders

Old: Your nation checks all immigrants before they enter your borders.

New: Access to our country is carefully monitored in order to prevent unwanted people from coming in and, if applicable, to verify if goods are properly tariffed.

Virtual Citizenship (was Digital Citizenship)

Old: Citizenship not tied to physical location

New: People from across the world are now able to become citizens and work for our nation without ever needing to be inside our physical territory.

Interstellar (was Interstellar Migration)

Old: Allow ET to immigrate

New: As we meet more and more alien species, the immigration of extraterrestrial lifeforms into our planets is something that is becoming increasingly commonplace.

Post-borders (was Post-Borders)

Old: Transcend physical borders

New: People are no longer restricted to physical forms and so borders no longer have a reason to exist.
 
  • Like
Reactions: tmv
And here's the final civic group revision. :)

During the two or so weeks this lore revision was being worked on I received some complaints about it, so I thought it would be for the best to wait an additional 2 weeks while corrections are made and to decide whether or not if this will be included in the main mod.

EDIT: I've also attached the modified files as a modmod if you want to see how it looks in-game.


Agriculture


No Agriculture

Old: Your nation has no agricultural system.

New: There is no agriculture in this nation and people supplement themselves by foraging.

Smallholding (was Subsistence Agriculture)

Old: Your nation has uses subsistence for their agricultural system.

New: Farms support a single family with a mixture of cash crops and subsistence farming.

Agricultural Guilds

Old: Your nation has uses guilds for their agricultural system.

New: The nation's agricultural production is dominated by associations of farm-owning individuals.

Corporate Owned (was Corporate Agriculture)

Old: Your nation has uses corporations for their agricultural system.

New: Corporations own all of the country's farmlands.

Private Owned (was Privatized Agriculture)

Old: Your nation has uses privatization for their agricultural system.

New: Groups and individuals are able to buy and sell plots of land dedicated to agriculture.

Incentivized (was Subsidized Agriculture)

Old: Your nation has uses subsidization for their agricultural system.

New: The government supplements the income of private farmers and agribusinesses in order to influence the cost and supply of commodities, so that vital but unprofitable crops can still be maintained in circulation.

State Owned (was State-Run Agriculture)

Old: Your nation has uses state-run for their agricultural system.

New: All of the nation's farms are controlled by the government.

Organic Farming (was Green Agriculture)

Old: Your nation has uses green for their agricultural system.

New: By using naturally occurring pesticides and fertilizers farms are able to pollute less and give healthier products, though this comes with the cost of decreasing their output.

Lab-grown Food (was Synthetic Agriculture)

Old: Grow algae for food

New: Mass-produced synthetic food replaces the need for land-based agriculture.

Nutrient Replication (was Food Replication)

Old: Tea, Earl Grey, Hot

New: Food can now be immediately assembled out of pre-existing matter.
 

Attachments

  • Civics Lore.zip
    694.8 KB · Views: 169
Last edited:
Both groups are certainly improved by this.

There are some strange things, although that was already the case with the former lore, like the fact that the Berlin Wall was tied to Closed Borders, which is supposed to mean closed to immigrants. Sorry, but that has nothing to do with the Berlin Wall, which was supposed to keep Emigrants from leaving the country.

I understand that there are no different civics for treating immigrants vs. emigrants (although neither did the GDR stop anyone from immigrating - they were quite glad to get additional manpower, plus the propaganda bonus, nor is anyone in the USA AFAIK forcefully kept from leaving the country - as long as these people are neither imprisoned nor entrusted with certain secrets, I suppose). From what I can tell, the civics are more about immigrants - perhaps the "best solution" would be to rename the Berlin Wall, although I can foresee a tiny bit of resistance against including a certain other wall, after a contemporary US politician who I'm not going to name was "forcefully evicted" from the mod. :)

Sorry for my rambling.
 
I can't give this the attention it needs. I am on holiday in an internet free zone. My only access is via the local library! I am not planning on being back for a couple of weeks more. Note: I am retired, so technically I am always on holiday, but I am visiting my mum which counts as a big change so therefore a holiday.
 
Top Bottom