RFC Europe playtesting feedback thread

[Swarbs]

Separated the barb spawns in the french area, now there are less barbs between 500-600, only has the previous spawn rate after that

Great, thanks

Sorry for being a pain about them, I just find it frustrating when I feel like a civ is in a situation where you just can't win no matter what strategy you try.

Has that version been committed yet, my SVN is still saying it's at 1081.

 

[AbsintheRed]

Great, thanks

Sorry for being a pain about them, I just find it frustrating when I feel like a civ is in a situation where you just can't win no matter what strategy you try.

Has that version been committed yet, my SVN is still saying it's at 1081.

No problem at all, constructive ciritism/feedback is always welcomed
1082 should be available now, commited about 5-10 minutes ago

 

[Swarbs]

No problem at all, constructive ciritism/feedback is always welcomed
1082 should be up now

Good stuff.

The only reason I'm so bothered about it is I love playing France and managing the economic challenges of building and maintaining such a big empire in the early game. Monarch games are always a bit disappointing, as your big empire means you rapidly catch up to the AI in tech after 840AD, so I want the Emperor level challenge similar to other civs like Venice and Genoa

Thanks!

 

[Chep]

you could also try the Kievan Food Challenge, if you're looking for something more demanding

I'll go with Cordoba again (Emp, 1082)
And one of these days I'll have to finish a game with Poland. Perfect "timeframe" for the civ, but somehow I always lose interest somewhere along...
Also the "own 12 cities in foreign provinces far away" seems a bit weird..

 

[ezzlar]

I am also playing a game as China in RFC. I was at 100% tax and was doing only +2 gold each turn. I barely managed to build markets and research calendar for all those nice plantations. Now I am doing good again but it was a close call!

Comparing to RFCE where I can often do close to 100% science with huge armies. Any adjustments in maintenance soon?

 

[gilgames]

As i said, its a test game, and the idea was there, the two tower town, to fend off, barbs, which worked well, but this way uhv is not possible....

ps: the picture was about, germas' huge army there

 

[Chep]

Cordoba (Emperor, SVN 1082):

So far I have played untill the year 1000 AD. The barbs near Tangiers were sometimes really threatening, the ones in Iberia were tough but okay.
I built my first Berber Cavallry 3-4 turns after the Spanish appeared. Made peace quickly with them and haven't fought them since. (due to lack of troops)
Cordoba (13) won vs Alexandria (12) - this can be really hard if you can't buy as many happyres as I could.
So far, great game, quite challenging.
My only problem: Independence. Barcelona just declared its independence, I reconquered it and all buildings and the culture were gone. It is quite an important city for me, but now it has been reduced to "useless" for the next 50 turns (during which it will probably redeclare independence -.-)
Stability really is a problem, I'm always around 0 +/-2 And apart from Barcelona I only have my starting cities. So when I'll go for Spain it will be really, really low. And If I always lose all buildings in my cities after them declaring independence, well .

edit: Since your cities mostly have really poor production/are tiny, this further adds to the problem that your "cities"-stability value decreases with such a independence-reconquering-event.

 

[Swarbs]

France's barbs are just about perfect now at Emperor level. Challenging enough to force you to pay attention and divert troops to protecting your resources right the way through to 800AD, but not so challenging that you feel like you can't stop them.

With optimal strategy and a bit of luck I got the UHV with two turns remaining. Am now quite a long way back in tech, with heavy maintenance costs, so the rest of the game is going to be a challenge as well.

Does the new SVN have independent Caen spawning at all?

EDIT: Also is Holland in Germany's settler map at all? I started a Dutch game and Germany had Groningen and Uttingen both in my flip zone and right near Amsterdam. Not only would that make it really difficult to get the merchant goal, but Germany also DOWed on me on the flip, along with their Austrian vassals, then capitulated Sweden the next turn. Cue three massive stacks heading my way as all countries' armies diverted to attack me

 

[AbsintheRed]

Cordoba (Emperor, SVN 1082):

My only problem: Independence. Barcelona just declared its independence, I reconquered it and all buildings and the culture were gone. It is quite an important city for me, but now it has been reduced to "useless" for the next 50 turns (during which it will probably redeclare independence -.-)
Stability really is a problem, I'm always around 0 +/-2 And apart from Barcelona I only have my starting cities. So when I'll go for Spain it will be really, really low. And If I always lose all buildings in my cities after them declaring independence, well .

You shouldn't use your culture, "only" your culture producing buildings.
The same when you lose a city in normal conquest

France's barbs are just about perfect now at Emperor level. Challenging enough to force you to pay attention and divert troops to protecting your resources right the way through to 800AD, but not so challenging that you feel like you can't stop them.

With optimal strategy and a bit of luck I got the UHV with two turns remaining. Am now quite a long way back in tech, with heavy maintenance costs, so the rest of the game is going to be a challenge as well.

Sounds great!

Does the new SVN have independent Caen spawning at all?

No, that's not there yet

EDIT: Also is Holland in Germany's settler map at all? I started a Dutch game and Germany had Groningen and Uttingen both in my flip zone and right near Amsterdam. Not only would that make it really difficult to get the merchant goal, but Germany also DOWed on me on the flip, along with their Austrian vassals, then capitulated Sweden the next turn. Cue three massive stacks heading my way as all countries' armies diverted to attack me

Yeah, I will have to look at that
The Dutch spawn is far from perfect
It really is dependent on your luck, what was the city placement of the AI, and how strong is AI Germany

 

[Chep]

You shouldn't use your culture, "only" your culture producing buildings.
The same when you lose a city in normal conquest

use? do you mean lose? because at that time I still hadn't researched Literature to produce culture.
But the main problem was losing the Noria, the House of Wisdom and the Market (+ 1-2 citizens) + half of my blacksmith

but apart from that the game is quite fun and demanding.

It is now 1150, I conquered Pamplona and the stupid Spanish city they founded North-East of Toledo -.-
Portugal appeared (at peace, weren't we usually at war? or only when the human has Portugal?).
I'm researching Patronage (25 turns + 150% -.-) as to have some more time to build the wonders (although Chivalry might be the better choice...but risky)
I think this will be the first time I fulfill the Cordobans UHVs in the correct order
But I'm still afraid of Isabella taking over a Crusade, still, keeps me on my toes and the game even more interesting.

Apart from the loss of buildings, which is really, really annoying Cordoba seems balanced and fun at Emperor level. Also France didn't collapse this time but became the usual strong competitor.

Would it be possible to give Cordoba a Noira on city conquest? Or in general in cities founded/conquered after say 900 or 950?

edit: yeah, the Dutch seem to have some problems, so far I only had 1 out of 5 starts where Germany/France/Spain/Burgundy didn't steamroll me during the first 2 dozen turns. I strongly suggest adding the "deserter"-mechanic to the late civs such as the Ottomans and the Dutch, so that any attacking army during your first 50 years loses troops to you even when played by a human.

 

[gilgames]

Chep, before you go after Isi, change to catholcism, and back after done with portugal too, OR defense crudase will tear you apart.... be wise leader! you can prduce lots os units while islam, then roll over the rest of "brothers in faith" DD, good luck

 

[Swarbs]

Yeah, I will have to look at that
The Dutch spawn is far from perfect
It really is dependent on your luck, what was the city placement of the AI, and how strong is AI Germany

This is true. By the time the Dutch spawn there are often quite big vassal blocks in Europe, so a DOW on spawn can be very messy. That said, I'm playing a game now where I spawned at war with Burgundy and their German vassals, managed to beat their original attack with the Grenadiers, and now have my colonies and am just maxing out gold to be richer than the Pope (who has over 7,500!).

The stability of the civs is looking massively better this time around as well - the Arabs are still alive and stretch from Libya to Anatolia, Byzantium only just died in 1688, Lithuania killed Moscow and Kiev, and Hungary killed Venice. Although the only independent civs are England, Hungary, Arabia, Lithuania, Poland, Sweden and Portugal, everyone else are vassals! So good job with the barbs keeping all civs alive.

 

[Swarbs]

How's the final Genoese UHV calculated? The most commerce from trade routes plus the gold you get from selling resources? If so, is it best to found as many cities as possible? And cancel all trade deals before 1640 and change them for gold?

Also, is there any way to deal with all the extra gold the civs with colonies can get from their resources?

 

[DC123456789]

Well, maintenance costs for colonies are being introduced soon, so that kind of solves your second problem/question. As for Genoa, I'm not entirely sure, but I didn't find that a particularly hard goal, just play mercantile and kill Venice if they're a significant competitor.

 

[Swarbs]

Well, maintenance costs for colonies are being introduced soon, so that kind of solves your second problem/question. As for Genoa, I'm not entirely sure, but I didn't find that a particularly hard goal, just play mercantile and kill Venice if they're a significant competitor.

Elizabeth is my main competitor. not sure my stability could take a trek across France just to kill England!!

 

[Chep]

pay France/Spain/Norse to attack them (in techs, possibly). Or go and raze London, if your stability allows it. (or conquer it and gift it to France/Norse...anyone who will take it^^)

I haven't really played Genoa so far, never had much fun playing them. Prefer Venice/Portugal when playing the "small" civs.

 

[AbsintheRed]

use? do you mean lose? because at that time I still hadn't researched Literature to produce culture.
But the main problem was losing the Noria, the House of Wisdom and the Market (+ 1-2 citizens) + half of my blacksmith

Oh, yeah, I meant to write lose

but apart from that the game is quite fun and demanding.

Apart from the loss of buildings, which is really, really annoying Cordoba seems balanced and fun at Emperor level. Also France didn't collapse this time but became the usual strong competitor.

Great to hear!

Portugal appeared (at peace, weren't we usually at war? or only when the human has Portugal?).

There is a chance for initial wars on civ spawns
IIRC it's 80% or 90% for Portugal to start with war against the Cordobans

Would it be possible to give Cordoba a Noira on city conquest? Or in general in cities founded/conquered after say 900 or 950?

I'm not sure if Cordoba needs a buff like this

The stability of the civs is looking massively better this time around as well - the Arabs are still alive and stretch from Libya to Anatolia, Byzantium only just died in 1688, Lithuania killed Moscow and Kiev, and Hungary killed Venice. Although the only independent civs are England, Hungary, Arabia, Lithuania, Poland, Sweden and Portugal, everyone else are vassals! So good job with the barbs keeping all civs alive.

Awesome news!

 

[Chep]

Having no buildings in a city after losing it to independence or something like that is really annoying. Especially with Barcelona. While yes, Cordoba doesn't need a buff, it just softens the annoying rebellions. So far I was really lucky and haven't lost another city but you really have to focus on stability and pray for a quiet Barcelona.

still, the game stays interesting.

@gilgames: I thought about it, but I'm afraid of the instability due to the change, once I have 2 GPs I _might_ do it, but I think I'll try staying Muslim for this game. (Besides I don't think Spain is that rich and the defensive crusades are manageable.)

 

[AbsintheRed]

Having no buildings in a city after losing it to independence or something like that is really annoying. Especially with Barcelona. While yes, Cordoba doesn't need a buff, it just softens the annoying rebellions. So far I was really lucky and haven't lost another city but you really have to focus on stability and pray for a quiet Barcelona.

But Barcelona declared it's independence because of low stability
Isn't the point of an RFCE game is to focus on your stability, and avoid losing cities because of that?
If there isn't any real penalty for losing a city this way (you still have all your buildings if you reconquer it), then one of the main aspects of the mod were gone.

Also, not all your building will be gone, some of them may remain if the city is more developed.
Some of the buildings will be ruined by the end of the siege, some will not.
As I said, it's the same as it would be with normal city conquest.

 

[Chep]

yeah, but they revolt even when you have 50+ stability -.-

But hey, I just find it annoying if I have 10 stability, go after Spain/Portugal, conquer 1 city, drop to ~4 due to swing and expansion and then they declare independence, and now I'm at -4 with a swing of -10 -.-
I mean I already try to take only 1 city at a time but apparently being "solid" is not enough...