DC123456789
Deity
What exactly do the Lombards represent, anyway, since the Kingdom of the Lombards was destroyed about 25 years before the start?
RFC Germania
- Thread starter The Flame8
- Start date
trexeric
(or backwards 'cirexert')
- Joined
- Mar 15, 2011
- Messages
- 2,565
Well, as for Danish UHV's:
1) should involve Vikings somehow...
2) Control Scandinavia in 1520
3) I don't really know, but perhaps some combination of your proposed UHV's?
And for Swedish UP, I liked my Baltic Sea suggestion but it should be renamed to "The Power of Pickled Herring". Although if you wanted more of a focus on the Swedish Empir ethan a boost to military would be better.
1) should involve Vikings somehow...
2) Control Scandinavia in 1520
3) I don't really know, but perhaps some combination of your proposed UHV's?
And for Swedish UP, I liked my Baltic Sea suggestion but it should be renamed to "The Power of Pickled Herring". Although if you wanted more of a focus on the Swedish Empir ethan a boost to military would be better.
The Flame8
Prince
They represent a vassal state of Lombardy after France conquered them.
It's just to be a political entity and represent another opposition in the south to German rule.
I should probably explain that in the post.
Also, does anyone think Venezia should be added? I personally don't, but it was mentioned earlier. And if they're any more German states you want added or changed post now.
It's just to be a political entity and represent another opposition in the south to German rule.
I should probably explain that in the post.
Also, does anyone think Venezia should be added? I personally don't, but it was mentioned earlier. And if they're any more German states you want added or changed post now.
The Flame8
Prince
Agreed, but should it be a civ?
The Flame8
Prince
Ok, I'll add them. Any German state ideas? Or do we have enough?
The Flame8
Prince
I agree. It looks like the map will be filled with plenty of civs.
I added Venice. They probably should spawn earlier, but I don't really want them to.
I added Venice. They probably should spawn earlier, but I don't really want them to.
constantinople
not Istanbul
Here's the map so far, I'll continue on it tomorrow.
Scandinavia is fairly large, Norway may be added. And we may need to add Scandinavian civs. I think we should add the Duchy of Lorraine as filler in France, it was in the HRE anyway.
Scandinavia is fairly large, Norway may be added. And we may need to add Scandinavian civs. I think we should add the Duchy of Lorraine as filler in France, it was in the HRE anyway.
The Flame8
Prince
Looking good! Map size seems to be working out well!
Does it look like everything will fit well to you?
Duchy of Lorraine? I'll look into it!
Do you think Lorraine should be playable or a minor civ to compete with?
Does it look like everything will fit well to you?
Duchy of Lorraine? I'll look into it!
Do you think Lorraine should be playable or a minor civ to compete with?
2phunkey4u
West-Eastern Divan
I think in this context one can do better than start Prussia in 1220 AD. That was a bit of a controversy in RFCE, see here: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=485988.
One can be more specific here. The state established about 1220 AD was the Teutonic Order State and ruled over Poles and various Baltic tribes for a bit more than 300 years. The state of Prussia gradually came about afterwards, initially as a suzerain of Poland. There is no convincing continuity from the Teutonic Order.
I think it's reasonable for RFC Germania to keep the TOS and Prussia separated. Start TOS in 1220 AD, UHVs related to the Northern crusades. And then spawn Brandenburg-Prussia 1600ish and let them take over. That would have been to complicated in RFCE but should be done here, I think.
One can be more specific here. The state established about 1220 AD was the Teutonic Order State and ruled over Poles and various Baltic tribes for a bit more than 300 years. The state of Prussia gradually came about afterwards, initially as a suzerain of Poland. There is no convincing continuity from the Teutonic Order.
I think it's reasonable for RFC Germania to keep the TOS and Prussia separated. Start TOS in 1220 AD, UHVs related to the Northern crusades. And then spawn Brandenburg-Prussia 1600ish and let them take over. That would have been to complicated in RFCE but should be done here, I think.
Wessel V1
Emperor
Nice map, really well done! As for the starting date, what would be the benefit of starting in 800 AD over starting in 843 AD? In the first turns (I would change the timeline by the way to whole years per turn, it's less confusing) the Frank AI wouldn't be able to do much and gets split after 843 anyway. It's a matter of taste but I wouldn't start with too many cities preplaced, that's why 843 with France, Burgundy and Germany starting right away would be a preferable option in my view, all flipping a few cities.
The Flame8
Prince
Interesting...
There really is no advantage to it besides 800 was just a normal starting date. I'll see what changes I can make. I see the split. I think it should be Burgundy and France there. Lombardy will also not be a vassal of France then because of the split. I'll change both that and turn stuff.
On Prussia. Prussia could be called the Teutonic Order until a certain time in the Dynamic names for example. Adding another civ doesn't seem necessary to me.
There really is no advantage to it besides 800 was just a normal starting date. I'll see what changes I can make. I see the split. I think it should be Burgundy and France there. Lombardy will also not be a vassal of France then because of the split. I'll change both that and turn stuff.
On Prussia. Prussia could be called the Teutonic Order until a certain time in the Dynamic names for example. Adding another civ doesn't seem necessary to me.
The Flame8
Prince
Edited turns and such.
843-1873
First 30 turns are 3 years (90 years)
The final 470 turns are 2 years (940 years)
Simple, any objections?
And what shall we do about this Prussia issue. There could be independent states earlier, but I don't feel the Teutonic Knights are required.
1525 AD - Duchy of Prussia United
I believe this should be the start date with independents there before that
843-1873
First 30 turns are 3 years (90 years)
The final 470 turns are 2 years (940 years)
Simple, any objections?
And what shall we do about this Prussia issue. There could be independent states earlier, but I don't feel the Teutonic Knights are required.
1525 AD - Duchy of Prussia United
I believe this should be the start date with independents there before that
DC123456789
Deity
I think Denmark, Bohemia, and the Netherlands could spawn earlier- Denmark was united by about 965, and Bohemia became a kingdom in 1212. The Netherlands should spawn in 1581, when they revolted, as what is considered their golden age began before they were officially recognized. I also think the map could be extended south a little bit to include Provence and a bit more of Italy.
2phunkey4u
West-Eastern Divan
Since you intend to include the Baltics in the map it would be great to make something happen about the Northern Crusades there. And I think I'd like to see a little more than a minor Teutonic/indy civ battle against barb Lithuanians. That's why I suggest a proper representation of the Teutonic Order State this time. But maybe it's because I just liked the Teutonic scenario of M2TW.
An idea:
Spawn 1220 AD in either Königsberg or Marienburg or Thorn.
Leaders: Hermann von Salza and Albert of Brandenburg-Anbach
UP: Power of the Order - owned cities get Teutonic Order corp and Catholicism
UU: Sword Brethren (or just the Knight from the corp)
UHV1 - The Northern Crusades: spread Catholicism to the entire Baltics until X
UHV2 - German Dominance of the Hanse: Have the highest trade income and sink 20 Danish, Swedish or Pirate ships in the Baltic sea by X
UHV3 - Under Polish and Prussian pressure: Conquer or vassalize Poland by X (or never lose a city until 1525)
An idea:
Spawn 1220 AD in either Königsberg or Marienburg or Thorn.
Leaders: Hermann von Salza and Albert of Brandenburg-Anbach
UP: Power of the Order - owned cities get Teutonic Order corp and Catholicism
UU: Sword Brethren (or just the Knight from the corp)
UHV1 - The Northern Crusades: spread Catholicism to the entire Baltics until X
UHV2 - German Dominance of the Hanse: Have the highest trade income and sink 20 Danish, Swedish or Pirate ships in the Baltic sea by X
UHV3 - Under Polish and Prussian pressure: Conquer or vassalize Poland by X (or never lose a city until 1525)
constantinople
not Istanbul
I think the Teutonics deserve their own civilization too. You can always code it so the Teutons are more likely to collapse after 1525.
DC123456789
Deity
I'm assuming Frisia represents Holland as well?
If so, then the Netherlands should probably not spawn if Frisia is still alive.
If so, then the Netherlands should probably not spawn if Frisia is still alive.
trexeric
(or backwards 'cirexert')
- Joined
- Mar 15, 2011
- Messages
- 2,565
I personally, think the Teutonic Order would be an OK civilization by itself.
Going off of contantinople's extremely well done map, I think that the first Swedish UHV should change from controlling area based to trade based... Maybe something like have 10 open border agreements by 1250. So the UHV would look like this:
1) Have 10 open borders agreements by 1250
2) Raze 5 Catholic cities while being Protestant by 1648
3) Control Scandinavia, Estonia, Latvia, and every city on the Baltic Sea in 1721
Going off of contantinople's extremely well done map, I think that the first Swedish UHV should change from controlling area based to trade based... Maybe something like have 10 open border agreements by 1250. So the UHV would look like this:
1) Have 10 open borders agreements by 1250
2) Raze 5 Catholic cities while being Protestant by 1648
3) Control Scandinavia, Estonia, Latvia, and every city on the Baltic Sea in 1721
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