[R&F] Rise and Fall General Discussion Thread

[agonistes]

Well the day before, the picture was an Italian scudo.

'Scudo?" Isn't that a guy in a speedo on a moped?

 

[Kimiimaro]

Nothing special on English Wikipedia today. Featured article is some Australian bird and featured picture is Brompton Oratory, a church in London.

Oh, and thirty-six days!

 

[WillowBrook]

Nothing special on English Wikipedia today. Featured article is some Australian bird and featured picture is Brompton Oratory, a church in London.

Oh, and thirty-six days!

Well, the Firaxis mole in Wikipedia (or is it a Wikipedia mole in Firaxis?) can't be too obvious, or they'd be found out. Gotta stick with vanilla picks some days.

 

[CPWimmer]

Thoughts on possible Zulu inclusion?

Zulu - unlikely, but might be in R&F. I think this is a future DLC or XP2 with high chance given Shaka's "mascot" status.

I think their chance of being in the final four has dwindled to near nothing:

1. Ottoman
2. Inca
3. Carthage (this is where there is a slim chance Zulu falls but it's less than 10%)
4. Someone from Europe

 

[Duuk]

The real discussion can happen once Firaxis confirms either way post-RF DLC. Right now, we have a gaping hole in our guesses based on if they go with the now "traditional" 2 xpacs AND if they follow Civ5 by having no DLC post Xpac1.

We don't have enough evidence or history to really know for sure what the plan is.

If they're going to have post xpac DLC, there is plenty of fertile ground to sow.

 

[Leyrann]

I think their chance of being in the final four has dwindled to near nothing:

1. Ottoman
2. Inca
3. Carthage (this is where there is a slim chance Zulu falls but it's less than 10%)
4. Someone from Europe

What about Mali though? They'd fit spot 3 as well.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

'Scudo?" Isn't that a guy in a speedo on a moped?

A type of coin used in various Italian cities in the Renaissance.

 

[Phoenix1595]

All I know is that if Tamar of Georgia takes the Inca's spot in R&F, she better be the most amazing leader ever in the entire franchise...

 

[Wingednosering]

All I know is that if Tamar of Georgia takes the Inca's spot in R&F, she better be the most amazing leader ever in the entire franchise...

I don't see a chance of that. The Inca spot has no real competition. Georgia is competing with Canada (unlikely), Italy/Italian CS or another dark horse we aren't even mentioning.

 

[Guatenadian]

Part of me hopes we'll get the Muisca instead of the Inca, even though that would probably cause a large upset due to the importance of the Inca.

 

[Duuk]

I don't see a chance of that. The Inca spot has no real competition. Georgia is competing with Canada (unlikely), Italy/Italian CS or another dark horse we aren't even mentioning.

Basically this.

We're all pretty confident on Inca, we're mostly confident on Ottomans.

Georgia and Italy are the wildcards, but the only way they get replaced would be Carthage/Mali/some other retread, which would make Cree the only "new" civ in an entire xpac. I don't see that happening, so I'm pretty confident of both Italy and Georgia.

 

[WillowBrook]

To quantify our expectations for the last four civs, see this poll:
https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/poll-which-are-the-last-4-r-f-civs.626277/
And please participate if you haven't yet!

 

[Disgustipated]

Inca and Mali for sure. Those two regions have to be represented before Carthage or any of those type of civilizations. I still think the odds of Ottomans are high. Although they may opt for Ethiopia to cover East Africa instead of West Africa. Sub Saharan Africa pick and South America pick are pretty much guaranteed. And I expect another Middle Eastern Civ (Ottomans) as well.

 

[Duuk]

Inca and Mali for sure. Those two regions have to be represented before Carthage or any of those type of civilizations. I still think the odds of Ottomans are high. Although they may opt for Ethiopia to cover East Africa instead of West Africa. Sub Saharan Africa pick and South America pick are pretty much guaranteed.

I'm just betting against Africa because 2 of the DLCs included African civs, so from a "big picture" overview they probably won't go back to that well yet.

Again though, it depends on if they plan post-RF DLC. Because if they DO, Mali, Zulu, Ethiopia, and Carthage as a 4-pack "African Empires" pack would be a killer seller. If they're not, then do all 4 wait for xpac2?

 

[DWilson]

I'm just betting against Africa because 2 of the DLCs included African civs, so from a "big picture" overview they probably won't go back to that well yet.

Again though, it depends on if they plan post-RF DLC. Because if they DO, Mali, Zulu, Ethiopia, and Carthage as a 4-pack "African Empires" pack would be a killer seller. If they're not, then do all 4 wait for xpac2?

Nubia and?

 

[Duuk]

Apologies, I for some reason included Kongo as a DLC civ. Rather than edit my post, I'll just own the egg on my face

 

[Kimiimaro]

Well... I wonder if Carthage can be counted as a fully African Civ. Sure, it was located in Africa, but on the other hand, it was founded by Phoenicians. Phoenicians were from Phoenicia, and that lies in the Middle East...

 

[evanaurora]

I'm just betting against Africa because 2 of the DLCs included African civs, so from a "big picture" overview they probably won't go back to that well yet.

Again though, it depends on if they plan post-RF DLC. Because if they DO, Mali, Zulu, Ethiopia, and Carthage as a 4-pack "African Empires" pack would be a killer seller. If they're not, then do all 4 wait for xpac2?

Two??? Nubia and... which am I forgetting?? (by the way, just to contrast, we've had in DLC: two European civs, a European scenario, one postcolonial civ in the Pacific representing European settlers, two SE Asia civs, and one Middle Eastern civ. And the base game was already entirely Europe-heavy.)

Anyway I think this line of logic may have been present in the decision making process-- but it's still horrifying. two-- TWO African civs. (Egypt only half-counts as a Hellenistic version of itself.) If Carthage is the "African" civ, it'll be yet another outside holding. If nothing from Africa is included at all, because gosh darn it Nubia was plenty of attention to that entire continent.... that's just. Appalling.

Ugh, I'm already getting worked up about this, and it's so premature!! Especially because whatever's in the pack is in the pack. But honestly....

 

[Thormodr]

Well... I wonder if Carthage can be counted as a fully African Civ. Sure, it was located in Africa, but on the other hand, it was founded by Phoenicians. Phoenicians were from Phoenicia, and that lies in the Middle East...

Ethnically, no. However, Carthage, at least allegedly, was founded in 814 BC. So, they were in Africa for a very long time. 668 years to be exact until the destruction of the city of Carthage in 146 BC.

So, I’d say they qualify as an African Civ.

Would like to see the Zulu, a West African Civ and Ethiopia, as well. That’d be 7 for the continent. (Egypt, Nubia, Kongo, Carthage, Zulu, West African Civ and Ethiopia)

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

Well... I wonder if Carthage can be counted as a fully African Civ. Sure, it was located in Africa, but on the other hand, it was founded by Phoenicians. Phoenicians were from Phoenicia, and that lies in the Middle East...

I like to consider them Mediterranean since they were more about the sea than the land.