RR13 - Hearts and Minds

Ha, great how everyone changes opinion on A-spot all the time! :p With the steadfastness of lymond and the weight of rolo's opinion I'll go by the original A then (between wheat and cow).

@V, If I'm not mistaken, it's only important that the target city has the religion, it needn't be the state religion of the target civilization as a whole.
 
IIRC it was target city - why you want to stay in OR, or have some monasteries of YOUR state religion.
 
With barely more to do than pressing enter got "carried away" and played a whopping 16 turns, while the average so far only had been 13. Oh well. :mischief:

On the interturn our woody 2 scout in the woods with his innate 100% defense against animals barely survives a wolf. He's left at 0.1. The turn after another wolf is in sight so he has to move and stumbles upon a hut and pops a warrior. Uh-oh... Take the rules literally ("units can't leave our territory") so since he is out already think it's fine to use him for scouting. Fortunately a few turns after he's eaten by a bear, so we need not worry about him anymore. :rolleyes: Our scout meanwhile heals until at 0.9 he's next to a barb archer so continues to run. Well, all in all not much scouting done.

Meanwhile we meet these folks:

RR13_1_Civ4ScreenShot0357.jpg


RR13_1_Civ4ScreenShot0358.jpg


As planned our settler is whipped the turn after the interturn and he founds Bombay on A. Worker meanwhile is busy with pasturing Delhi's cow and on the way back chops an extra forest for Delhi (a forest that had 1 chop in it already when worker moved towards the cow in an attempt to make max use of the worker as the cow was 3 tiles away from the initial forest he chopped). This chop actually finishes a giant structure and gives good chop-overflow for 2nd worker.

RR13_1_Civ4ScreenShot0360.jpg


1st worker after that pastures Bombay's cow. Thought that a higher priority than first chopping the monument. As it was, I just whipped the monument in Bombay as I hand it over. Bombay has decent overflow which could go to whatever. Queued a scout, but even an extra worker can be done in 5 turns now, despite being at size 1. The 2nd worker came out of Delhi and chops a forest now for a settler I queued. The garrison from Delhi just left the city in NW direction, assuming we want to settle B next, or near B. The capital is obviously safe from barbs now anyway.

Here's an overview picture. I think I still don't like the map climate being tropical. :mischief:
RR13_1_Civ4ScreenShot0363.jpg


Note the presence of horses which make both B anc C attractive. It's not my aim to discuss every single spot but I'm thinking B could move 1N, with as main reason to be able to put a city between A and B at some point for pressuring Cahokia. We wanted more smaller cities this time anyway, right? ;) B 1N on the PH can't be bad anyway, imo. The "Y" spot also gained some points thanks to the wheat.

From the tech front, we did AH, wheel and meditation. Queued PH with the idea of Oracle, obviously. Note that if we want marble online before we start Oracle we still can squeeze in other stuff before, like for instance pottery, as Bombay's borders still need 10 turns to pop.
 

Attachments

Man, that's some pretty good land up North. Lotsa cottages.

We might fire up SH after the scout in Bombay for some fail gold.
 
r_rolo1 -
Thy_Spellcraft -
nocho -
lymond - just played
LKendter - playing NOW
vranasm on deck,
 
Warrior moved to "B" and found borders. "B" IMO is no longer a viable site. Our earlier cities need to be our strong core cities, and fighting culture for the cow kills that.

I plan to go for "C" instead once the settler is ready unless I have strong opposition.
 
I had B pegged for 1S of there. We would leave rather huge swaths of land unused. Still, why not. Now we have another city to culture press against. There's enough there for City B to be Viable. But it should go 1S of that marker.
 
I'm happy with B on the current marker, for the reasons I gave in the report (allows for a city between A and B). And I think we should settle there now, if anything to block off SB. No use settling C first if SB takes a spot around B thereafter. It being so close to a city of SB is actually an advantage, IMO. Just get a monument there asap and possibly a library next.

What's your tech path, LK? PH-pottery-writing? TBH I would appreciate some form of plan before playing and not just continuing barely 2 hours after the previous set has been reported. That at least also gives some time for the rest to contemplate and comment. I know it's kinda straightforward here, but still. Regardless of SB's presence, it's clear we could've discussed the actual site of B for instance. And be on the same page regarding techs.
 
I was suspicious we would run into problems with "B". The AI normally settles toward you, so I wanted to get up to that point ASAP and be ready to discuss it with the team.

From Nocho comment sounds like I should have mentioned my worries in playing post - sorry. I took one look at the game, and playing three 3 ASAP would let us know if "B" has problems, and I was praying I would find bronze by playing three more turns.

I thought we already had agreed to move "B" one north from original spot to allow for culture push city later. Not sure where my confusion game from. I plan to stick with current "B" unless we wind up in a dispute. We need to allow for filler cultural push cities IMO.

Based on feedback, I will continue game with settling "B" as marked. City IMO is still crap with losing key tiles, but a very valid point of blocking city changed my mind.

Tech is currently on last turn of priesthood. 3 more turns of exploring still have failed to reveal bronze. I was really hoping 3 more turns would make the tech plan easier.

Since "B" can start on cottages, I will go with pottery next. After that the path isn't clear. It is a tossup between writing for libraries, and iron working. Even city "B" needs to clear jungle.
"C" or "C2" (1 east) also needs iron working for the rice.


Plan is continuing playing tonight (8+ hours from now) through pottery and hand it over.
 
I'd say pottery-writing so we can Oracle CoL. Have worker(s) near Bombay to hook marble up asap once the borders pop.
 
I would still prefer B ( or 1 S of B --- might be better in the short term ), even if to push SB to the other side. C needs IW and jungle chop for it's food resource and it has some serious plains resource infestation ( not that it is a bad thing though ... just needs more food :D )

Anyway on techs ... Pottery-> writing looks good, even if we fail Oracle... but we will need IW sooner than later, I guess :D
 
Getting muddied again on "B". Not sure if leader wants current "B", or 1 south of "B".
 
I'm quite 50/50 on those 2 options, but B is probably better. Anyway I trust your judgement on this ( being yourself a far more seasoned civ player than I :D )
 
hey guys, I am doing too much civ things at once, so i will switch into lurker mode here if you don't mind.

with SGOTM behind corner and some other things it's too much civ to have control above all.
 
1800 BC
During the Pre-check, I find nothing to do.
Not a big fan of three turns on SH, but I see nothing else practical. We may need the gold to keep up 100% research.

1720 BC
We pop a hut, and get fishing.

1640 BC
We are trying for Oracle rather late, so I switch Bombay to it now. We will need to time it with the completion of writing.

1560 BC
We have found the Zulu.

1480 BC
Vijay is formed on the new "B" spot, and we had NO choice as Mound City got built 3 squares of new "B". Our old spot became illegal.
(IT) The Zulu offer us open borders, and I accept. I can't believe they researched writing before us.

1440 BC
(IT) Add Zara to the list of known civs.

1160 BC
Oracle is due in *one* turn, so it should be locked.

Iron working is being researched, as we can't do much without being able to chop jungle.

This warrior is intentionally not moved, as he needs to stay ahead of the settler toward either "D" or "Y". You can see more of our bad luck in this picture. I lean toward D1 to put ASAP pressure on the barb city. We may capture it early, or at least choke another civ that tries and grab it.


r_rolo1 - Up
Thy_Spellcraft - on deck
nocho -
lymond -
LKendter - just played


Was the game meant to be at normal speed?
I thought we played the game at epic last time, but I could be wrong.
This could really screw us as we have less turns to get flips and we are stuck with more land due to low sea levels.
 
This is a fresh overview of the map.
 
Was the game meant to be at normal speed?
I thought we played the game at epic last time, but I could be wrong.
This could really screw us as we have less turns to get flips and we are stuck with more land due to low sea levels.

Lurker’s Comment:

I think it was played Normal as well, because the last one had 500 turns to “Conquer” everyone.
 
DUH - attached.


D2 in the above map is better land use. Question is barb city first, or stronger city (D2). They are both on the map, as I didn't have that strong of a feeling toward D1.
 
Ok, I can't see the save now ( reinstalling OS in civ comp ), but that barb city is a major PITA issue, because we will not take it and we can't protect it from greedy AI. It reminds me of the role we had with Ramesses in RR6 :(

Anyway, Got it, but I'll definitely not play before tomorrow.
 
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