Saladin No cottages Immortal

[uberfish]

Indeed Mutineer seems to have pulled a bunch of elephants out of thin air, but we're probably on a pretty tight timer to attack Qin before he gets feudalism so:


375 AD (0) - Qin's city in our back yard is defended by one archer, and we have two fog busting chariots nearby... I move them into position, then



400 AD (1) - Declare war and invade. Promoted first chariot to flanking. It dies anyway, but 2nd chariot takes city and it is auto-razed.


425 AD (2) - Fred has defected to Judaism, let's see if we can't make him useful anyway:



Revolt into bureaucracy and theology, researching paper for trade value as we now have both its prereqs.

I do a double take, I thought I just razed this city last turn:



Qin's settler group had popped into a spot I couldn't get at and decided to refound the city nearby. It isn't a threat, so I ignore it for now.


450 AD (3) - Qin sends a couple of troops out from Gaul in a galley, apparently going after our weakly defended core. I decide to use our galley to block his path, and counter at Gaul with a couple of elephants:




475 AD (4) - More trading. Sell Drama to Toku for 240 gold, and Construction to Isa for 300 gold to fund the war effort. Fred then offers Feud for CS + 380 gold, I take that.

On the northern front 2 elephants beat the archer defenders of Gaul, taking the city. Qin's galley declines to fight ours and sails the other way.

Suddenly Qin has a CKN in Guangzhou... 2 Elephants attack the city and for some reason the axe and archer there defend instead. With just a CKN left in the city I use an axe to kill the spear on Qin's iron and hopefully stop any more CKN showing up.


500 AD (5) - In response to me taking out Gaul, Qin brings his galley back and drops the axe and sword back next to the city. My elephants are badly wounded and are forced to retreat, abandoning the city.

Guangzhou still only has the one CKN that Qin built last turn remaining, an elephant promotes and takes it out.

Trade philo to Cyrus for metal casting, 40 gold, and good trade relations. He is now friendly.


520 AD (6) - Back in the northwest Qin retakes the undefended Gaul, but for some reason it gets auto-razed (WTH? This makes no sense.) Fred will probably take the spot now, annoyingly.

While waiting for some reinforcements to come up for Beijing I take the opportunity to destroy more cottages:

Asoka builds great library. Good thing India always goes for universal suffrage.


540 AD (7) - Unfortunately I don't have time to destroy ALL the cottages. Would really rather capture Beijing before Qin gets feudalism or CS so, push on towards Beijing.


580 AD (9) - Toku declares war on Cyrus. Again. Paper in. Set research tentatively to education, but I forgot to set science to 0%


600 AD (10) - Our forces are gathering near Beijing, slight damage has been taken from suicide catapults in the last couple of turns. I notice I moved all the defenders out of Guangzhou by mistake, shuffle a chariot from Medina which is now in turn empty.



I started an infrastructure round because I think we have enough troops to beat China, might be worth going back to Org Rel for a few turns and try to build Colossus or maybe Angkor Wat.

Paper is a monopoly. It might not be a bad idea to go for machinery before education, as if we end up taking over all of China we'll probably want to at least land-grab Germany for the cities adjacent to the Chinese border for culture reasons. This might turn into a domination game yet

 

[ThERat]

interesting turns...got it, in case I can find a save from uber

 

[Mutineer]

Hmm... what whith this game and saves?
I put wrong save,
uberfish now forgot saves twice!

Can we produce a GS for education somewhere? Like in our capital?
Even if we get GM - still we can runa nd cash him in.

 

[uberfish]

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads12/Mutineer_NC3_AD-0600.Civ4SavedGame

 

[uberfish]

Yeah, we need to stop whipping so much (I did some too) and start running specialists again, Medina is currently -4 happy from whipping. How do you whip out an elephant anyway, are we feeding people to the elephants or something... ? I think we're probably in a situation where we just take whatever GP we get and don't worry too much about purity since we can use all types.

Fred has not done much this war (except divert a couple of Qin's units to harrass him) I think we are going to need to take his cities and get those sugar and gems resources under our control afterwards. Oh well, SGs are more fun when there's lots of fighting.

 

[ThERat]

save

Pre-Turn
choose machinery as suggested as this opens maces and xbows, we need them
then realize that Qin has that, we could extrot it, thus change to education

1. 620AD
at Bejing cross the river to increase odds

2. 640AD
attack on Beijing
crossing the river was a great idea, take out Beijing with no losses (one cat retreated)

we also have a new lux

3. 660AD

wow, that b%$^ Izzy declares war on us and steals a worker in the north and takes out ivory
take out 2 Spanish intruders and march on to Xian

4. 680AD
move on to Xian

5. 700AD
as expected the Spanish come back
Asoka offers a lux trade I say yes for now, we need happiness as we run 20% lux
Asoka also declares war on Toku, that's nice

6. 720AD
amazing but Xian is still defended by 1 spear only
take Xian, due to the fact that Qin attacked a phant and took it out with 2 units, Nanjing now down to 1 cat defense
but Damscus is threatened by 3 units from Spain

7. 740AD
we lose a warrior in Damascus but win against phant and sword
poor Qin now empties Shanghai to save Nanjing

lose a 95% axe against Qin archer, march on to Shanghai and Nanjing
we get a GS use him to speed up education, now down to 2 turns

8.760AD
Spanish troops trickling in, defeat another chariot
attack Nanjing and take out new archer there
bomb Shanghai and attack, they have 1 cat and archer left
game crashes...

9. 780AD
take out Nanjing and get 2 much needed workers
oh no, discover that Qin has LB's now, apparently upgraded the wounded LB in Shanghai, but the cat has gone??

time for peace, get WM, some gold and machinery for it
pillage the land

10. 800AD
pillage land before it gets encroached by Germany
our production is pretty pathetic, but we have now cities

liberalism due in 12 at big deficit
we still even have paper as monopoly, suggest to only start trading it, once someone knows it
this headstart on liberalism should be good enough

our new land

 

[Qwack]

I cant say im surprised about isabella. What a *****. . Got it, but looking at those screenshots, it looks like we have made some good progress.

 

[Mutineer]

Looks good.

I do not think we can figth Germans right now. They are to powerfull, with Maces. May be best cource of action will be to Build some infrastructure when researching Liberalism, Take Nationalism as a free tech, research gunpowder and go at bismark with mixture of whiped Maces, cats/drafted muskets?

 

[uberfish]

looked at save, good work TheRat.

Anyway, we now have Beijing to work with as production city so things are looking a lot better for future action. Should build heroic epic there. For economy, since we have all this coast I think we should try and build Colossus (7 turns @ Mecca) and delay astronomy for as long as possible. Too bad we aren't playing as Elizabeth.

other things

Great Lighthouse is insane

Beijing needs to take control of the overlapped cows from Guangzhou

I think Fred has to die once we rebuild an army again. Border tensions, he's going to put Shanghai into revolt AND he's letting Isa pass through to harrass us. Mutineer's plan of bulking up our forces with draft muskets sounds like a good one, as one thing we do have is food surplus. Our key economic techs are biology (gunpowder->chemistry en route) and constitution (nationalism prereq) so it is a perfect fit with our development too.

 

[Mutineer]

hmm... it seems Qwack avol. He open his own SG but did not move on it for 2 doys to. Our roster allready small, I give him a little bit more time.

 

[Qwack]

sorry, I was busy yesterday. I will play in couple hours.

 

[Qwack]

Ok turns completed.

Overall, Isabella really being annoying and hurting our rebuild phase. She brings some 7 unit SoD.. I lost 1 catupult and 1 elephant taking it out. Also killed stray swordsman. Big news of the turnset were diplomatic moves though.

First, cyrus comes and demands theology. I give it to him, than I trade him feudalism to stop trading with Isabella.



Asoka comes asking us to declare war on tokugawa. I check the diplomatic situation and decide to declare. This was because tokugawa doesnt have any way of getting to our borders anyways, his border is closed with both frederick and cyrus. And for now its just free +1 modifier with Asoka. Maybe we can get asoka involved in a war with frederick later on..

Isabella's galley gets some lucky wins. I didnt see the first one but she killed 2 of our galleys, the second battle was 27% odds... sigh.

Next, Qin comes telling us to cancel our deals with Frederick. I decide to decline this one, because right now the open borders are helping with trade routes and stuff.

In other news, I started colussus in Mecca, which is due in 4 turns. Barracks was almost completed in bejing but I stopped it to build couple galleys to take out isabellas galley. I agree with uberfish we should build heroic epic there ASAP. Rushed theatre in Shanghai, we have like 7 units there right now so chance of flipping is low. And once we get some culture in there from theatre I think its going to go down.

I will post the save a bit later because civfanatics is really lagging for me right now.

 

[Qwack]

Ok here is the save:

 

[Mutineer]

OK, Turn 0
Revolted to orgonised religion.
Whipe colosys for 4 population.
It is 1000AD, AI could build it any time.
Whiped some other building.
Sci drop to 20% (we are -1 at 20%)

We lost practically all our trade income. Everyone in mercantenilism.
Turn 0-10 mostly was producing building and some hindy missionaries.

Did some whipping. When colosys come fired most of specialists in favor of production, grow and whipping.
Keep specialists in one city near full, got GS. Used it to build academy in capital. It prodcing resonable beakers, so it was effective.
Traded Liberalism to Frederic for Engeneering and 470GC to sybsidise run to gunpowder and Engeneering is needed tech. Federic starting to run away. We need to take him.
We can make some traded with Quin, not sure we should. Optics and hourse back riding are not very helpfull, thought Riding needed for our UU, even it is not very good. Guilds will be helpfull, but Asoka does not wont to trade with as and Frederic is the only advanced civ we can trade with.

 

[Qwack]

Well its pretty funny, but our research is going to stink until all the other AI's research economics and switch to free market. heh. I agree we should attack fred as soon as possible.

[Edit] Checked the save. We are +5 with asoka if we adopt no state religion, and +10 with cyrus. Both of them are +3 with Frederick. I think it is quite possible we can bribe them into war with fred after declaring ourselves. What I dont get is where did the "You helped us in wartime" modifier with Asoka go....

 

[uberfish]

I have this, will work towards peace with Isa and war with Fred.

 

[uberfish]

We still don't have shrine. Going to whip Guangzhou for 3 buildings (library, temple, temple) in an effort to correct this. That city has stonehenge so a bonus prophet source.


1120 AD (2) - Asoka circumnavigates


1140 AD (4) - Gunpowder -> Chemistry. Revolt to nationalism for now to draft a few, chemistry due in forever (18), our economy stinks. Despite the fact that Asoka has reopened borders.


1160 AD (6) - Guangzhou has hired 2 priests and should outrace Mecca to the next GP


1180 AD (8) - sell Liberalism to Asoka for 270 gold and to attack Toku, to slow them both down


1190 AD (9) - I could revolt back to bureaucracy for 5 turns but that would force us to run culture tax, so it probably isn't worth it. We need representation very badly to sort our research out, probably best to go there after chemistry.

Whip a couple of buildings to take advantage of OR then switch to theocracy. Hire 2 scientist @ Najran

Cancel our fish for wine deal with Asoka, and sell him fish for 7gpt instead. Cyrus has 3gpt so I sell him some beef.


1200 AD (10) - we still hold Gunpowder monopoly, our new troops have arrived at Shanghai/Xian. Fred will declare war on Toku for gunpowder, but probably not a wise move.

I left troops unmoved at the German borders so next player can go immediately if we decide to declare war now. 4 mace, 5 musket, 4 ele, and 7 cat are available and this army is costing us 27 gpt maintenance. We should be able to overrun Frankfurt quickly. Chemistry is now due in 10 turns for the second wave.

The situation at the borders and proposed attack plan:



The save. We can invade this turn, all units marked on map are ready to move.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads12/Mutineer_NC3_AD-1200.Civ4SavedGame

 

[Mutineer]

I look on save and I think we should attack now. Shanhai has enogth culture to claim a few lucturies strigth away. Watch for fred Knigths. From religious spying one can see cats stack near cyrus.

 

[ThERat]

war? me? again?

Ok, will try my best and take this guy on, mind you this is immortal, so might be not too easy, but I will try...

 

[Mutineer]

If nessesary it could be a good idea to shot down science for Cultural % and more draft. It migth even been nessesary.