Sanguivorant's IM A NOOB Walkthrough

[Sanguivorant]

Update:

Spoiler :

Met two more AI's, Mansa Musa and Joe (Yes, Joe). They have religions. It appears that I might have to adopt Buddhism.

Spoiler :

I settled the city of Hastings, though it is dangerously close to the Persians. I am constructing a monument there for a border pop. One border pop and I have the whole top to my-self. Of course, I had to lower my tech rate a bit, because it's far away. I sent a worker there to gather the near-by cows.

Spoiler :

I constructed the great wall quickly with that forest tip (Thanks, Kaytie, that is genius), so I no longer have to deal with barbarians. My people aren't happy in London, so I should probably connect one Ivory by road.

Spoiler :

Here is a map of my immediate surroundings (Excluding the exploring in the north.

The persians have two cities that are sort of sandwiching Hastings, and I'm afraid if he could take it culturally. Nonetheless, I'm researching Iron so I will be able to take care of the jungle soon, and the location is filled with good resources.

York border popped, and I got a work boat in the fish, so that's good. I'm building a Library in Nottingham so I do not fall too behind with teching, and I'm thinking of placing farms in Nottingham.

 

[Ghpstage]

I'm building a Library in Nottingham so I do not fall too behind with teching

This isn't a good reason, it hasn't really been thought through has it? A Library in Nottingham right now will only gain you an extra 0.35 per turn, and the city doesn't have food to feed scientists so its simply not worth it. Its going to perform much better as a production city.
York on the other hand could easily feed 2 scientists with its pigs and fish, build one there instead!

And I should perhaps cancel the open borders agreement with Darius just in case.

Even with Open Borders, AIs in BTS won't walk through your borders to settle the other side, theres no real threat.

London didn't really need a Granary yet, it won't be growing while building the workers and settlers you need, and Nottingham could help by building more warrriors as garrisons (London needs one in particular!) and for spawnbusting. Its so close to finishing you may as well finish it off now though.

On spawnbusting, barb units cannot spawn on tiles you can see, nor on tiles within 2 tiles of a unit (a 5*5 square surrounding units). Making use of this would have been better than building the GWall as you would only need around 5-7 units to completely spawnbust the land as it lies now, and you already have 2 warriors and a scout!
GLH would have been a better wonder with all that coast and some islands to settle.

 

[vandermerwe]

Met two more AI's, Mansa Musa and Joe (Yes, Joe). They have religions. It appears that I might have to adopt Buddhism.

By Joe I thought you meant Stalin... But no, you don't have to adopt Buddhism, even if it spreads to you (which it doesn't seem to have yet). Of the two you've just met, Mansa Musa is normally more interested in tech trading than attacking you. Joao (who's Hindu, not Buddhist ofc) is much more likely to start looking for trouble.
In the meantime, Persia is the only civ which borders you, and the only one likely to for a while. If Darius adopts Buddhism and becomes a military threat, then yes, maybe. Otherwise take your pick.

I settled the city of Hastings, though it is dangerously close to the Persians. I am constructing a monument there for a border pop. One border pop and I have the whole top to my-self. Of course, I had to lower my tech rate a bit, because it's far away. I sent a worker there to gather the near-by cows.

Don't worry about losing gold per turn for a while if you've enough in reserve. Certainly don't lower your tech rate just to keep the gold piling up. That accumulated gold may be useful at some point, but new techs are more useful sooner. You're just about breaking even at the moment with 180 in the bank... can't really see that you needed to lower your tech rate at all tbh.

I constructed the great wall quickly with that forest tip (Thanks, Kaytie, that is genius), so I no longer have to deal with barbarians. My people aren't happy in London, so I should probably connect one Ivory by road.

Absolutely. The happy cap on Noble is 5 population IIRC - comes around quickly if you're used to Warlord. Not much point in unconnected happy resources, or any other sort of resources: the worker turns you invest in the camp or whatever are pretty much wasted unless you add a road. That said, you could make London happy (for now) just by putting a warrior in it.

The persians have two cities that are sort of sandwiching Hastings, and I'm afraid if he could take it culturally. Nonetheless, I'm researching Iron so I will be able to take care of the jungle soon, and the location is filled with good resources.

I wouldn't worry. One of Darius's cities doesn't look like it's popped either, and Darius is neither Creative nor does he have a religion yet, so they shouldn't be putting that much culture pressure on for a while. You should be fine once you get the city connected and all that jungle out of the way. A shame about the mountains in the BFC and the one coast tile you won't be able to work properly, but the strategic location is otherwise spot on.

 

[Sanguivorant]

Okay, so right now I need a plan of action.

Here is my proposed actions:

-Build library in York
-Build settler or worker in London (I prefer settler)
If I build a settler, the area between Hastings and London looks attractive, though I might need some insight on this.
-Not sure about Nottingham, but I'm thinking of training something.
-Build either granary or perhaps library in Hastings for extra culture.

-With Iron working, focusing on taking out the jungle in hastings, and mostly connecting my cities.


Two things are worrying me right now:

Although iron is unconfirmed as of yet, I still have no strategic resource other than ivory. I think I should start making some sort of army soon.
My score is rather low, especially compared to John at 200. Should I judge their performance on score?

The next update, I'll probably screen the tech tree progress, since it is probably hard to follow through by memory.

If anyone has suggestions for any action, or improvements, please say. That's why I'm here.

 

[lymond]

Sang - here are a few thoughts

First, you are not doing too bad here

1) Not sure how you got all that gold, but once you have enough or more to finish a tech then run 100% science. You can finish IW this turn

2) If possible, try to get roads to cities asap unless they have natural trade route connections like York due to coast/culture connection. That is commerce that you miss out on. Note that if you connect a road to the adjacent tile before settling a city then the trade route is instant that turn. It's just a balance of the worker turns available and the need to get that city down immediately.

3) Focus on better worker management. You have 2 workers next to Nott, which is a slow growing city. Hastings will need a lot of love with IW and needs a road. Tag team those two workers and start a road at the Rice tile towards Hastings, then the 2 can help mine gems and chop jungle from the sugar for food.

4) Nott should grow to size two and build a worker, which can later fixup that city, but it is not urgent. No library in Nott for now

5) York, with improved pigs will be a good place to run scientists. I would start a Library there and with the worker from there, have it pasture the pigs and chop and mine the hills to get out Lib faster. at 4 or 5 pop in York run two scientists.

6) You want a Lib in your cap two and run 2 scientist there, but first you need MP. It's fine for a while to leave the cap unguarded as it build settlers and stalls growth, but don't leave it without MP for to long. You are missing out on a happiness point and therefore working an improved tile.

7) I would go Sailing next for multiple reasons. It will give you foreign trade routes with Persia which is a nice commerce boost. You can get up Lighthouses for more food. Also, you can get a settler up to the island which will boost trade route income too.

Your warriors to the west are a bit unnecessary at this point with the GW. However, you really should have scouted out fully the area to the east. Send one north to reveal coast and the other south near bananas/rice to reveal that coast. You don't want to miss out on seafood. Then pull them back for MP duty or have them just fogbust future city sites out west.

My next two cities would be fish/rice to the west and one on the island. Once you get currency, you can look to fill out all your land, as that will secure your economic needs.

Tech path Sailing>Alpha> (look to backfill some techs as neede)>Maths (possible trade)>Currency (most important tech in the game)

You have a worker coming out of York which makes 4 I think. This is 2 short at present. As mentioned, get one start in Nott as size 2 and maybe continue building some out of Nott.

 

[lymond]

-Build library in York

Yes, as mentioned above. Good place to start running scientists

-Build settler or worker in London (I prefer settler)

I agree. London can still produce settlers while secondary cities take on workers like NOtt

If I build a settler, the area between Hastings and London looks attractive, though I might need some insight on this.

Actually, it does not look attractive in the slightest. This might be an area you fill in later, possible as a cottage city, but it is unnecessary for a long time. Get spots that will benefit you now like the ones I mentioned above.

-Not sure about Nottingham, but I'm thinking of training something.

Workers...you don't need army at present and you don't have strats yet anyway.

-Build either granary or perhaps library in Hastings for extra culture.

With gems and low food, I would go Library first in Hastings..then gran.

My score is rather low, especially compared to John at 200. Should I judge their performance on score?

It's very common for new players to focus on score in the early game. It is totally not necessary. The AIs will always natural have higher scores in the early game especially as you move up levels. It is totally meaningless. You will catchup and surpass them later, but don't concern yourself with it now.

 

[Sanguivorant]

I got that money from tribal huts earlier on. They gave me a good amount of cash.

Update:

Spoiler :

To my luck, researching IW revealed an iron resource between Hastings and London. I should probably place my next settler here.

Spoiler :

Other than that, not much new. Nott and Hastings border popped, which means that Darius has no real access to the north without my open borders agreement. I settled the Fish/rice area and got Canterbury. I'm making a warrior, but I just realized I should really be making a work boat. I should also border pop to get that fish, so maybe I should make a monument instead, and build a work boat in York.

I have at least four workers now, and I am a turn away from connecting Hastings to my capital.

I've built a library in York, but I can only fit in one scientist without starving. I'm confident that I just need to place the pasture and I will be able to have two scientists there.

Spoiler :

This is my tech progress as of date.

For the next 15 turns, I really want to focus on road-building and building improvements on resource for my workers, and perhaps cranking out a settler to get that iron resource.

I have open borders with Darius, so I believe that is a +1 for diplomacy. I hope he does not declare war on me, because I do not look like I am in a position for defending.

 

[Toxicc]

That iron site is not a priority right now as there is no food in that area unless you share the sugar with Hastings, but even then you'll have to wait until Calendar. Darius shouldn't be a threat as he's relatively peaceful and he won't plot war at pleased diplomatic relations.

Why aren't you running your research slider at 100%? That gold isn't doing you any good just sitting there, and you can't upgrade any troops or speed-purchase any infrastructure right now, so why not spend it on research?

Also, you should be garrisoning all of your cities with warriors; that's a unnecessary +1 unhappiness you're giving yourself in all of your undefended cities. After Alphabet you should either go to Currency or tech to Priesthood so you can trade for Monarchy (or just self-tech it seeing as you're on Noble.)

 

[lymond]

I got that money from tribal huts earlier on. They gave me a good amount of cash.

Most of us don't play with huts and events, so that throws us of off sometimes


Yeah, the iron changes the prospects for a city down there contrary to my earlier comment. It seems like your reading some of the stuff we advise, but I'm not sure. You do some things but not others. Still, you are in fine shape.

Comments:

1) Worker management: Always ask yourself if you need a road or improvement. What does your Empire and that city benefit from it? Think short and long term.

Cases in point:

a) That worker is building a plains cottage next to Nott. This is a huge mistake. Nott will never be able to work that. Nott is a low food/high production city - nothing more. It will get farms all over later. Right now, it should be a worker pump for you. Cancel the Library indefinitely and start on more workers there. The worker currently building that completely worthless cottage should move quickly to other cities that require desperate need of improvement.

b) Worker south of York is apparently building a road to Fish/Rice city. Ask yourself if that is necessary. You already have trade routes in that city. The road does nothing for you. Later on you can road up your empire. Right now the most important thing is improvements. Get that rice up and you can whip a monument in that city much sooner, so you can then get that fish online faster. Always think about what is going to get your empire up and running faster - useless roads and cottages don't do that.

Again, you only need roads to cities that otherwise would not have a trade route connection without it.

3) Only reason you can't run 2 scientists in York is that you still don't have a unit in the city. Same with London. Don't let that happen. You are losing production and research as a result.

I have no clue why you sent one of your warriors down to Hastings when you have no MP in London or York, although it appears the other warrior is heading to York.

 

[lymond]

That iron site is not a priority right now a

All your comments above were absolutely spot on, but I don't agree with this. I'd early said to ignore that area prior to him getting IW and showing iron. This is is only strat in view, so it does not hurt to get it settled. The iron alone makes it productive. He can build workers there for the time being. It's close proximity to London as well makes it less of a burden. Later, the spice and chain irrigation will make it an okay production city. For now, it is a strat resource city.

 

[Toxicc]

The iron alone makes it productive. He can build workers there for the time being. It's close proximity to London as well makes it less of a burden. Later, the spice and chain irrigation will make it an okay production city. For now, it is a strat resource city.

I hadn't thought of that actually, and you are right especially since the iron is food-neutral.

 

[Sanguivorant]

So my plan of action:

-Keep research slider to 100% until critical.
-Garrison all cities with Warriors.
-Stop building road to Canter and improve rice instead.
-Cancel library in Nott and queue 3-5 workers.
-Cancel cottage worker at Nott, and send him to either Cant or Hastings for forest clearing.
-Run 2 scientists in York.
-Settle city on Iron resource
-London should probably work on settlers immediately.
-Construct Monument in Canter, and Work boat in York after Galley is finished.
-Finish alphabet, and I prefer to tech currency for the market.


Also, we haven't really mentioned civics or espionage. I have not revolted to slavery. Should I revolt?

Update:

Spoiler :

I really was not paying attention to foreign activity, but Judaism has spread to my lands. Judging by what I know, either Mansa Musa or John have also teched Judaism (But they didn't convert to it), or it came from another civ. On a standard-sized game, there are usually 6 AI. Mayans were kicked out, so there are supposed to be 5, but I only discovered 4. That means there is probably another AI somewhere, I should scout the waters more with my galley when its available.

Spoiler :

This galley contains a settler which I will place on the island with clam and sheep. I'll need to place a worker there as well.

Spoiler :

The world now. I've got the iron resource, Covent, and started building workers there, as asked. Hastings, Covent and Nott are building workers, but I don't think this is right. However, I do not know what I should build. Now that I have iron, I can start training axemen and spearmen. Maybe I should start training those?

All the Jungle in Cant's borders are gone, with the jungles in BFC to be removed soon. Should I perhaps build cottages in these areas? I don't really know. I could probably place a library in here and place scientists with the excess food.

I could either revolt to slavery and whip the lighthouse to take care of the unhappy people, or I could cut trees. I prefer option 1.

A lot of mines are in place now, but I don't know what to do with the grassland and the plains. Cottage time? What is the general rule on cutting forests? Should I be cutting forests as quick as possible or saving them?

I'm planning to plot my next settler to the far east, where the Cow and Wheats are.

 

[lymond]

Oh my! Heavens to Murgatroyd! Not on the Iron! Do you realize you just settled on one of the best early tile yields in the game. There's no reason to do this and that city does not need to be coastal. You also could have had the 2 spices for that city, which are 3F4C tiles. 1NW of the Iron was fine. (Sometimes one settles on grass iron by accident since IW is often avoided until alpha, but don't ever settle on it unless for some reason it makes for an overall better city, i.e., FOOD)

Work boat in York after Galley is finished.

I meant to comment on this earlier since you begged the question. This is a really good idea. Build WBs in cities with established production while the new cities get up to speed or build monument. Good thinking here.

I prefer to tech currency for the market.

I'd just like to state that this is not a good train of thought here. I've already mentioned that Currency is one of the most important techs in the game if not the most. However, the market is the LAST reason to be teching currency. Currency is important for trade routes, economy and building wealth. You will very rarely be building markets this early and only in very select cities. There only one city even remotely worth a market (Hastings) and even then I would not build it there for a very long time.

Also, familiarize yourself with the tech tree. Notice all the links between techs like Alpha>Currency or Maths>Currency. Each predecessor tech provides a bonus to teching the subsequent tech. If possible try to tech or trade for Maths prior to teching Currency. Maths is a pretty darn good tech anyway. For one, it boosts chops and also leads to many other good techs you need like Calendar and Civil Service.

On higher levels, Maths is often traded for since it is an "AI Priority Tech", but on Noble I would self tech it.


Back to "buildings". I recommend as you progress in a game to ask us the importance/lack thereof of certain buildings. Overbuilding is a huge problem for new players. It ties to City specialization and understand the value of buildings for certain city types. For instance, Forges and Barracks for production cities. Libraries in commerce cities or high food cities. (Markets go in high commerce cities but the hammer to value is very low this early...I rarely build them until much later in the game) As of now, you really don't have any commerce cities and have not start a cottage city, so I would not even think about Markets.

 

[lymond]

I could either revolt to slavery and whip the lighthouse to take care of the unhappy people, or I could cut trees. I prefer option 1.

I do too You should probably already be in slavery by now...I assumed you were. I use it very early. Unless whipping settlers from a high food cap, you can switch civics when setters are moving to spots.


Generally you want to cottage riverside grass tiles or floodplains, but with FIN leaders I might cottage up non-river grass tiles in a city if it can't be farmed and there is not other better improvements that city can work or specialists. Start to ask yourself what you want that city to be and don't forget that you can always chain irrigate cities once you get Civil Service to increase food.

I'll be honest here...none of your land is especially conducive to cottages, which kinda sucks when your FIN. With that in mind, you might want to get some cities working some cottages. Maybe high food grass cities with low production. Cantebury could do cottages.

Hastings is ironically a pretty decent production town later despite being your best commerce town at the moment. I would not cottage this city.


EPs - Focus them on Mansa or Darius. Usually go for the high techers as you might steal techs from them later. But honestly, on Noble that does you little good since you will start blowing the AIs away. So Darius is a good compromise since he is close and you can use EPs during war.


What happened to your scouting workboat? I figured he would have circumed the landmass by now unless a barb galley ate him.

Seriously, I would recommend finding your save before settling Coventry and redo.

 

[KaytieKat]

Hi

With gems and elles london should have a happy cap of at least 7 or 8. Let it grow to that then pump settlers.

Yes I would go slavery. whip lighthouse and then depending--is great light house already done? If its not then I would put overflow into that then chop the forrests around it. If you get it then game pretty much over you will end up out teching the other civs so bad you could be reported for ai abuse If you dont get it you should get a some fail gold which will help you tech rate while you keep expanding and you would still be in gr8 shape so not much downside in trying for it. If you get it it helps a LOT if you dont it will still keep you moving ahead.

If GLH already built then put overflow into a settler and then use forrests to chop more out while London grows. By time london hits happy cap then you can have london do a settler or 2 while while york grwos into happy cap.

Cottages only help if you actually work them. Unfortuantely no rivers is kinda suck but fortunately your financial so its not as sucky. but I still wouldnt go cattage happy just build em where you know you have food to worrk em immediately without sacrificing growth or hammers and then save rest for farms/workshops once you get the techs to chain irrigate and build the workshops.

With that in mind the 3 cleared spots by london are good--so is the flat green spots aroind york once you chop em out. And cottaging around canturbury will work too. Anywhere else would be a waste I would think since more than likely those cottages would never get worked.

As for chop or saving forrests--like a lot of things in civ the answer is it depends. The questions isnt really chop or save but what would you be chopping them for or saving them for? Doing either withou really a plan for why you are doing it is what would be bad. So ask yourself if youre gonna chop now what would it be fore and if you save em for later what would it be for then. At that point you can get better idea of which way may be better for you.

Also before I would do cow wheat way way over tot he east I would get to the gold. Gold will raise happy cap more and while it will be kinda junky for a while the happy boost will help all your other cities. So overall the empire wide benefits make it worthwhile I think. So I would put priorty on settling the island to the north and the gold before sending a settler that far which will only end up giving wheat which isnt as useful right now as the gold would be--at least not to me anyways.

Also dont just scout with boats. Theyre handy early but you do have a scout right? if he isnt alrady just set him on auto explore and least and let ehm go through darius and anyone elses empire you have open borders with. At most send him and out and keep him moving where you think the other civs are. The sooner you fined em the better you can get a sense of who hates who and who would be best to buddy up to and who not to.

For diplo reasons there is no benefit at all for going to judaiasm. You dont have pressing happy issues that cant be handled in other ways and no othere civ is running it. And the diplo hits from jao and mansa wouldnt be worth it.

Military units again to build or not build again isnt so much as which choice is best but witch reason for the choice you decide upon is best. Units cost money and if your goal is to expand as quickly as possible meaning lots of extra cities hitting your bank account then where you can save elsewhere helps. Axes are nice escorts so make them as needed to escort settlers. Also barbies have a tendacy to build cities in sucky spots. And not ontly sucky spots but in sucky spots that prevent you from settling in spots you actually want. Also while the ai is relecutant to send settlers through your borders they do have an anoying tendancy to send military through your borders to capture barb cities that spring up in your backyard which can be inconvenient. so a cpl of swords handy to take em out can be useful. Other than that none of the civs you have met are major threats so unless youre planning a war pumping out military JUST to pump out military with no plan wouldnt be the best way to go. You really have way to much land available for a war anytime soon to be more helpful than just settling peacefully for time being.

But all in all you are in good shape. Your at turn 105 you have 5 cities, a TON of land blocked off to more than double that if you so choose, and have a more than decent beakers per turn going for this stage of game and in no danger of economy crashing anytime soon so it all looks pretty good

Kaytie

 

[lymond]

I would farm London, Kat. It's really a good production city and screams for chain irrigation, like the rice. There's really no true Bureau site here, not that it won't be used. HE Bureau is an idea and then go stomp the pants off Darius.

 

[KaytieKat]

Hi

Well my thinking was with and easy available happy cap of about 9 or 10 even before monarchy or calander London could work 3 cottages on the cleared grasslands south and still work most of maybe all of its ready hammer tiles so no production sacrifices--then when CS gets availabe you can still chain irrigate the rice and then farm/workshop the plains. I know 3 non river cottages are no big whoop but with a fin leader not all too bad. At least good enuff to turn the slider up more. Farms would help with whipping although I tend to avoid whipping in cities that start gettng on towards dbl digit pop if I can help it. But then I am greedy so whenever I start thinking I can get both money and hammers out of a city I go for it .

But yeah in a cap like london I would only do it if I thought I could without giving up a lot of hammers.

Kaytie

 

[barbertje]

You have enough workers for the moment. You're cities do not grow while producing workers, soyou can't work the tiles you have improved, because your cities lack population.
For example, Londen has 7 improved tiles, but has only 5 population.
Hastings and coventry should build a granary.

Chopping jungle by itself has no advantages, unless a city is really unhealthy, and that's not the case here. You should only chop jungle if you want to improve the tile.

Coventry shouldn't have been settled on the iron, that's a really valuable tile to work.
You could have waited until calendar and then settle NW of the iron, so you can work the spices. (and one of them is in your culture already)

You can indeed whip the lighthouse, making sure you keep the scientists, and then build a settler to stabilize the population for the moment.

London could better grow while building a lighthouse.
Once you have a lighthouse and more happiness, swapping to working the coast instead of hills, to grow the city faster can be very good

You should try to get some happiness, either calendar or try to trade for meditation/poly + priesthood + monarchy.

The city governor in Londen is working the wrong tiles. by working an elephant and a grass hill mine, instead of the rice and the plains hill mine, you get 1 extra hammer AND 1 extra commerce.
very annoying.

The great lighthouse isn't built yet. It's rather late for it of course.

 

[Chuwe3y]

I shadow your game and won a Conquest. Too late for a win though, but I think on this map you can learn how to take advantage of Unique Unit : Redcoat with the power of DRAFTING.

Some thoughts from the gameplay

Spoiler :

Mansa was a tech beast even with less city to every1 else like always. Great trading partner. The only early resources were ivory and iron and it didn't look too good for an early rush especially when Darius had taken most of Mansa land and build 10+ cities.It would have been a good opportunity to attack him when Roosevelt/Darius was attacking Vikings. But I wanted to have a bit of fun with super drafting.

 

[s.bernbaum]

I agree with Lymond's comment about moving the game back to a save before you settled Coventry. 1 NW of the iron will allow you to claim the spices and borrow the rice from London (after the border pop), when you need it for growth or if London needs to stop growing temporarily due to the happy cap. Similarly, if you want to have the city on the coast, 1 north of the iron will also allow you to borrow the rice from London but put the city on the coast, at the cost of not claiming the spices for now. 2 north of the iron will allow you to borrow the rice immediately, although you won't get access to the iron until the border pop.