Scions documentation

[Tarquelne]

Re: God King vs. Aristocracy

Are spawning bonuses a concern at all late-game?

Also:
I like the idea of a boost for both Aristocracy - spawn boost makes a lot of sense - and GK - for the reason it originally got a boost: Tends to be underused. And where Aristocracy fits the people well, GK fits the rulers/religion.

How about some benefit other than a spawning rate boost for GK? Especially something that'd come to the fore mid/late game.

More population gained from captured or razed cities?
Cheaper religious units? (seems too tame)
cheaper Reborn (only mid/late game)

(If someone thinks of something I might go Aristo = spawning boost, GK = that something, or the something + smaller boost.)

I'm certainly going to lower the Aristo. boost, btw.

 

[Valkrionn]

I like the cheaper Reborn idea.. sends your maintenance through the roof, but allows you to increase your pop easier. Could explain it by saying that while the city still contained a living population, those with the Gift formed an elite Aristocracy, but now that the gift is being spread to the common man, the Aristocracy is no more and the worship of the Emperor has been taken up by those receiving his gift...


Edit: Was the Scions event for reaching the RoP removed?

 

[deadliver]

How about letting Aristo raise the spawn boost, while GK provides a chance (a la slavery) of providing reborn through combat?

 

[Tarquelne]

Edit: Was the Scions event for reaching the RoP removed?

Only unintentionally. I believe I misplaced the python portion during the Big Merge. I expect the fix'll be in the next patch.

Come to think of it, maybe the event should be. Either that or the Flavormod setting that can place the Scion starting position near the RoP. It seems like *something* should happen, but a GA always seemed like too much - too easy. Maybe add an automatic declaration of war against anyone who happens to own the tile...

 

[Valkrionn]

Only unintentionally. I believe I misplaced the python portion during the Big Merge. I expect the fix'll be in the next patch.

Come to think of it, maybe the event should be. Either that or the Flavormod setting that can place the Scion starting position near the RoP. It seems like *something* should happen, but a GA always seemed like too much - too easy. Maybe add an automatic declaration of war against anyone who happens to own the tile...

Actually, I'd rather see the flavor removed... The Scions are already high-production, they don't really need to be next to such a high hammer improvement.

 

[DuckAndCower]

Hey Tarq, congrats on getting into FF! Can't wait to see what's happened to the Scions in the 6 months or so since I last booted up Civ 4.

 

[Tarquelne]

For the next patch I've lowered Aristocracy's spawning mod to 1.4, and given GK a 1.2 mod. I'll do something more interesting/better later.

 

[DuckAndCower]

Quick question:

Any idea why I seem to be unable to build a Temple of the Gift? I'm playing as the Risen Emperor and have the Priesthood tech and all prerequisites, and also have access to Incense, though I'm not sure that's required.

I'm pretty gimped without being able to build the religious units, so a quick solution would be appreciated.

Oh, also, I seem to be unable to build a barracks (barrackses?). I wonder if this is somehow related?

 

[Tarquelne]

Any idea why I seem to be unable to build a Temple of the Gift? I'm playing as the Risen Emperor and have the Priesthood tech and all prerequisites

Do you have Code of Laws?

 

[DuckAndCower]

That'll do it. I'm pretty sure that didn't show up as a requirement in the Civilopedia, though.

Thanks much.

 

[Valkrionn]

That'll do it. I'm pretty sure that didn't show up as a requirement in the Civilopedia, though.

Thanks much.

The only techs that show up as requirements in the 'pedia are The Gift, and Code of Laws.

 

[Valkrionn]

Bankrupted my empire buying Smuggler's Ports to push myself from neutral to evil to see the event, and got a golden age... was really hoping for something more unique, like a promo for Korrina.

 

[DuckAndCower]

Sorry, I was looking at the requirements for the religious units. I do have Code of Laws, but still can't build the Temples.

The religious units show up in the cities' build menus, but are grayed out (says I need a Temple). The Temple doesn't show up anywhere in the build menu.

 

[Valkrionn]

Hmm... Only requirements for the Temple are The Gift, which you start with, Code of Laws, which you have, and the Emperor, whom you said you're playing as... No idea why you can't build them.

 

[DuckAndCower]

Yeah, not sure what it could be, either. I'll start a new game in a bit and see if that fixes it.

I double-checked, and I definitely do have The Gift, so that's not it.

Also, it's a completely fresh install of Civ 4 and everything else.

 

[Tarquelne]

was really hoping for something more unique, like a promo for Korrina.

The Event in the other direction offers more.
Something less generic would be nice, but it'll probably wait on the Broader Alignment system getting more development.

Yeah, not sure what it could be, either. I'll start a new game in a bit and see if that fixes it.

What's the 'pedia entry for the Temple otG list as prereqs/cost? Does it say that only the Scions can build it?

 

[kenken244]

I really dislike Pelemoc's war chance for using the subversion spell. It makes no sense because people immigrate to the scions all the time and i'm sure that in order to create reborn they must have someone convincing people to join the scions. I'd like it if it simply had a chance of a diplo penalty, a delay, and/or give the city some food back so it can regrow more easily.

 

[Valkrionn]

I really dislike Pelemoc's war chance for using the subversion spell. It makes no sense because people immigrate to the scions all the time and i'm sure that in order to create reborn they must have someone convincing people to join the scions. I'd like it if it simply had a chance of a diplo penalty, a delay, and/or give the city some food back so it can regrow more easily.

Looks like he's gaining a new spell next patch... Gift of Succor. Was an idea about him being able to take the sick from a city as a Reborn without causing war, but taking 15 turns to cast... No idea how the new spell will actually work, but that would be cool.

 

[Tarquelne]

Looks like he's gaining a new spell next patch... Gift of Succor.

GoS is currently 10 turns, 100 gold, no war chance, no population loss, 1 Reborn gained, target city must have 2 or greater unhealth.

"You know we cannot afford a war with the elves."
"Of course, dear lady, you've made that abundantly clear."
"And yet you persist in drawing them to us. I know you enjoy taunting their Queen, but know also you risk the Emperor's good will."
"Yet again, "Of course, dear lady." Did I not mention I have a cunning plan?"
"I find that strangely comfortless."
"Our silent friend here... his little friends move through the western forests as we speak. When they reach the plains there will be a sudden plague in the fields, in the orchards, and in the pastures..."
"Ah. I'll have a mission of aid prepared. There will be famine and sickness among the elves, and where they they walk so does death. And where death walks..."
"... so does salvation. I go not to make war on the elves, but to save them!"

Re: Subversion -
It's supposed to represent some extraordinary efforts on Pelemoc's part to get converts - not "normal" population movement at all. I'm not married to any of the stats, though. The gold and war-chance are particularly ripe for fiddling, I think. Adjust them in opposite ways and the overall balance of the spell wouldn't even have to change.

 

[Valkrionn]

GoS is currently 10 turns, 100 gold, no war chance, no population loss, 1 Reborn gained, target city must have 2 or greater unhealth.

"You know we cannot afford a war with the elves."
"Of course, dear lady, you've made that abundantly clear."
"And yet you persist in drawing them to us. I know you enjoy taunting their Queen, but know also you risk the Emperor's good will."
"Yet again, "Of course, dear lady." Did I not mention I have a cunning plan?"
"I find that strangely comfortless."
"Our silent friend here... his little friends move through the western forests as we speak. When they reach the plains there will be a sudden plague in the fields, in the orchards, and in the pastures..."
"Ah. I'll have a mission of aid prepared. There will be famine and sickness among the elves, and where they they walk so does death. And where death walks..."
"... so does salvation. I go not to make war on the elves, but to save them!"

Re: Subversion -
It's supposed to represent some extraordinary efforts on Pelemoc's part to get converts - not "normal" population movement at all. I'm not married to any of the stats, though. The gold and war-chance are particularly ripe for fiddling, I think. Adjust them in opposite ways and the overall balance of the spell wouldn't even have to change.

I love the new spell... Was almost right with my guesses too.