Trystero
Deity
I will point out that Brennus has Calendar, since he has Math, has Calendar resources, and it is not on the list of techs he can research. So perhaps we want to save a tech or two to trade for that as well?
-
Civilization 7 has been announced. For more info please check the forum here .
SGOTM 16 - U'nu'sual S'us'pec'ts
- Thread starter AlanH
- Start date
Trystero
Deity
I assume so, since when he got to Friendly (this turn) BUFFY said he would trade Math, but we refused to join the war (also this turn), so we slipped to Pleased and he was unwilling to trade.
Trystero
Deity
We begged 70 gold from Brennus on turn 90.
We are gifting him Fish and Clams (on turn 90)
We are getting 3 gpt from him for Deer
On t96 we traded him Writing and Sailing for Polytheism and Hunting
An excellent point. It would be fabulous if we could get both of these from him!
Figure out your testing Revent. But it might even be worth it to just turn off the slider, trade for maths and calendar over this turn and the next turn, then bulb Machinery, and then spend the gold on optics.
Also, it's possible Brennus will refuse to trade Calendar for the MoM.
Also, it's possible Brennus will refuse to trade Calendar for the MoM.
Gifting Aesthetics SHOULD give us +1 for our trade relations have been fair.
I played a test game where I met Willem on T0 and and on T90, gave him HBR (390 beakers) for hunting, polytheism and 90 gold (to make up for the roughly 90 beaker difference in sailing and writing). Following that, I gifted him monarchy (same beakers as Aesthetics) and got a +1. So some gold adjustment MAY be needed however since it's difficult to get everything spot on.
Brennus is less likely to build wonders so he might not build MoM. Plus, in war made, he's even more likely to build units.
Edit: We already have a +1 for fair trade..Might make it a bit harder..
Edit again: We will need a +2 to get him to friendly...looks difficult actually unless we gift him two techs. Is it worth it? I think it might be.
I played a test game where I met Willem on T0 and and on T90, gave him HBR (390 beakers) for hunting, polytheism and 90 gold (to make up for the roughly 90 beaker difference in sailing and writing). Following that, I gifted him monarchy (same beakers as Aesthetics) and got a +1. So some gold adjustment MAY be needed however since it's difficult to get everything spot on.
Brennus is less likely to build wonders so he might not build MoM. Plus, in war made, he's even more likely to build units.
Edit: We already have a +1 for fair trade..Might make it a bit harder..
Edit again: We will need a +2 to get him to friendly...looks difficult actually unless we gift him two techs. Is it worth it? I think it might be.
ChrisShaffer
Board gamer
I'm often in favor of giving the AI techs - it makes them less backward, and more likely to research techs we might want to trade for later.
Is +2 for fair trade even possible?
Is +2 for fair trade even possible?
Yes it does, but let's try to get our fair trade first.
(Just tested it, Brennus at war with Ramesses via WB diplomacy, I add a warrior via wb to meet Rams and then declare. Get the mutual military struggle).
Advantage is that it saves us a couple of turns in the game.
Hypothetically, yes.
SteelHorse
Deity
Well done getting/keeping TR open with Rams.
Can we see what brennus is researching now? If he is close to a tech, the value to him decreases.
I agree with gifting to get to friendly for subsequent Math and/or Cal trades.
When do expect our second resource gift to yield a diplo point?
Can we see what brennus is researching now? If he is close to a tech, the value to him decreases.
I agree with gifting to get to friendly for subsequent Math and/or Cal trades.
When do expect our second resource gift to yield a diplo point?
SteelHorse
Deity
Looks like there is still upside from favorite civic and religion with brennus. But not sure on the timing. There is also gifting a city, but he seem to have plenty at the moment.
4 pages of posts in 6 hours!!!!
Woot, GS. This is more important than Maths,
What turn is it, as we still have more diplo bonuses coming for civcs and religion. At this point, I would be tempted just to gift Brennus Currency, as chris pointed out, this will probably help TR income.
We already have a lot of beakers in Maths, so trading it is less important than trying to get Calendar
Woot, GS. This is more important than Maths,
What turn is it, as we still have more diplo bonuses coming for civcs and religion. At this point, I would be tempted just to gift Brennus Currency, as chris pointed out, this will probably help TR income.
We already have a lot of beakers in Maths, so trading it is less important than trying to get Calendar
Trystero
Deity
We don't have enough EP against him after stealing IW to see research (we didn't even have enough before we stole IW).
So it sounds like the plan is gift techs to Brennus to try to get him Pleased this turn and trade for Math, and then maybe Calendar. If that does not work declare on Ramesses for the mutual struggle bonus? How many turns does it take to get the joint war bonus? How many and which techs should we gift first?
I am really not in favor of declaring war on Ramesses just to save one turn of research after deciding the TR were worth not declaring war to keep. Especially since there is no guarantee he will subsequently part with Calendar. We are being a bit schizophrenic here.
Edit: x-post. I am up for gifting Currency for the TR with Brennus and hoping that gets him to trade Calendar while we research Math.
So it sounds like the plan is gift techs to Brennus to try to get him Pleased this turn and trade for Math, and then maybe Calendar. If that does not work declare on Ramesses for the mutual struggle bonus? How many turns does it take to get the joint war bonus? How many and which techs should we gift first?
I am really not in favor of declaring war on Ramesses just to save one turn of research after deciding the TR were worth not declaring war to keep. Especially since there is no guarantee he will subsequently part with Calendar. We are being a bit schizophrenic here.
Edit: x-post. I am up for gifting Currency for the TR with Brennus and hoping that gets him to trade Calendar while we research Math.
ChrisShaffer
Board gamer
I think declaring war is not worth it.
no war!!!!
and dont gift hi,m more than currency IMO.
what turn is it now?
how many beakers are already in maths?
and dont gift hi,m more than currency IMO.
what turn is it now?
how many beakers are already in maths?
I don't think declaring war should happen. The commerce from TR's is far too good to pass up.
Anyway, to get a fair trade bonus of +3, we need around 930 points in total. Since we are at a +1 already, that suggests we have between 232 and 464 points already. To get to +3, we will need to give him a minimum of at least 464 to a maximum of 698. The cost of Aesthetics is 468 beakers, so gifting that to him SHOULD get us to a +3 or perhaps even to +4...Actually, not to +4, but it should get us to +3.
Edit: If it doesn't get us to +3, gifting a couple of gold should definitely do the trick.
Anyway, to get a fair trade bonus of +3, we need around 930 points in total. Since we are at a +1 already, that suggests we have between 232 and 464 points already. To get to +3, we will need to give him a minimum of at least 464 to a maximum of 698. The cost of Aesthetics is 468 beakers, so gifting that to him SHOULD get us to a +3 or perhaps even to +4...Actually, not to +4, but it should get us to +3.
Edit: If it doesn't get us to +3, gifting a couple of gold should definitely do the trick.
Trystero
Deity
It is turn 129 and we have 237 out 390 beakers in Math
So, its been 39 turns since our last beg with Brennus.
We share a border, so we *3 beg points.
237 out 390 leaves 153 beakers to go.
We might only be a few turns from being able to beg Maths.
Firstly though, he needs to be able to trade it, so I like gifting him Currency to raise his 'fair trade' bonus. An extra +1 should do the trick, as only the -1 is preventing him being friendly.
We then need to determine how much Cash he wants for Maths. This is the painful part, as it a game of higher/lower and asking Brennus if the trade is acceptable.
Once we have the cash value of Maths, then we know how many beg points we need.
We share a border, so we *3 beg points.
237 out 390 leaves 153 beakers to go.
We might only be a few turns from being able to beg Maths.
Firstly though, he needs to be able to trade it, so I like gifting him Currency to raise his 'fair trade' bonus. An extra +1 should do the trick, as only the -1 is preventing him being friendly.
We then need to determine how much Cash he wants for Maths. This is the painful part, as it a game of higher/lower and asking Brennus if the trade is acceptable.
Once we have the cash value of Maths, then we know how many beg points we need.
