SGOTM 18 Maintenance Thread - Austin Powers - GoldMember

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SGOTM 18 - Austin Powers - GoldMember

This thread gives you and the Staff somewhere to post about non-spoiler issues relating to the game. It is a way of communicating to the rest of the players outside your team, and with the staff, about matters of general interest that affect your team or everyone. You can post about bugs, rule clarifications, problems with the roster etc., but please do not divulge information about your team's progress. Please subscribe to this thread so that you are kept up to date with new information as the game proceeds. If you need to raise specific issues concerning only your team, then please contact me or kcd_swede by PM.

The team lists are at the end of this post.

Thanks for this scenario again go to kcd_swede.
[img=right]http://gotm.civfanatics.net/civ4games/images/sgotm18civ.jpg[/img]
Transmission from Basil Exposition, British Intelligence: Austin Powers, we have received reports that Dr. Evil has thawed from suspended animation, and is working on a devious plot to destroy the world, by travelling back in time to the Ancient Era. To make matters worse, there are reports that Goldmember has esca&#8230;&#8230;<transmission breaks off>

Sssss&#8230;.kkkkrrrrkk&#8230;ssss&#8230;&#8230; Hello Austin Power-less (:mwaha:Mwahaha). As we speak, my henchman &#8220;Fat Bastard&#8221; is paying a visit to your Swinger&#8217;s Pad. I also want you to know that I have in my &#8220;impenetrable&#8221; (finger gesture for quotation marks) fortress the means of your ultimate destruction. I will bring the world to its feet at my knees <whispers heard off-screen> I will bring the world to its knees at my feet!

Once I locate those bluish-green glowing rocks that my &#8220;future self&#8221; promised were around here somewhere&#8230; then you are doomed. You will not stop me this time, because I know all your teleportation tricks&#8230; and have used them against you; this trick has enabled me to send my clone Mini-Me :pat:to steal your mojo. By now, your mojo should be in orbit around Alpha Centauri for perpetuity. :mwaha:Mwahaha!<transmission fades>

Basil (British &#8220;Intelligence&#8221;): Austin&#8230; we need you to save the world by going backwards in time to the Ancient age. From there you must develop the means to destroy Dr. Evil in his lair. Our secrets of teleporting have been compromised, so it would be highly advised to use them only with the utmost care. It would be far safer for you to find some way to drop from the skies to get in to his lair.

Austin: Did he say&#8230; so uncool!!!... I have to get my mojo back, baby!

Basil: Austin, Austin, please focus on what is important.

Austin: I am! :eek:
Basil: Calm, Austin. There are ways to get your mojo back-- you can simply build a spacecraft and fly it to Alpha Centauri. Or, you would develop an all new mojo if you garner enough support within the UN mojo-reso-lulu-lution. Or you can become a Legendary Swinger in three cities, and nobody will ever ask where that other mojo went. But&#8230; the MISSION&#8230; the most important thing is to raze Dr. Evil&#8217;s Lair to the ground, before his Preparation H can attract an hemorrh&#8230; an asteroid to destroy the world.

Austin: My Swinger&#8217;s Pad&#8230; that would not be groovy if Fat Bastard breaks my waterbed. All those etchings I use to lure the chicks could be ruined! The place is an icon of the hipsters. It&#8217;s practically Legendary. It&#8230;

Basil: Take it easy&#8230; British Intelligence will support you in espionage efforts to return your Pad into a Legendary place. Just don&#8217;t forget you have to find some way to defeat Dr. Evil.

Austin: Groovy! Will you put 20-30 spies at my disposal, then?

Basil: Don&#8217;t be ridiculous, Austin. I meant moral support ; we don&#8217;t have the resources for anything else. And ONLY your Swinger&#8217;s Pad is authorized for espionage&#8230; if you are caught using espionage to increase the mojo by more than one Great Artist bomb worth of culture in any other &#8220;legendary&#8221; city involved in a Culture Victory, your mission will be compromised (i.e. you fail this game objective).

Austin (mumbling): &#8230; destroy Dr. Evil&#8217;s Lair and get my mojo back, and get my Legendary pad back&#8230; this is not going to be easy. At least I still have that old Fembot. Groovy!

Basil: &#8230;and Austin, one more thing. The Ancients were not as &#8220;into&#8221; Liberalism as you are used to, so do please be careful how you behave.


(Space, Culture, or Diplo victory required, and Dr Evil&#8217;s Lair must be razed. Also, you must recapture your Swinger&#8217;s Pad, and make it Legendary without the use of culture bombs aka Great Works from Great Artists&#8212;you may NOT use a GArtist to create a great works to the Swinger&#8217;s Pad, because only Austin&#8217;s own etchings are allowed there. For background and clarification on this &#8220;culture through espionage&#8221; mechanism, refer to this thread and links therein: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=499578) (Please note, espionage missions in at least two of your Legendary Cities cannot include culture from espionage &#8220;spread culture missions&#8221; that is equal to or greater than what one Great Works &#8211;culture bomb Great artist&#8212;would provide).


There are 4 normal civilizations in this game, but unfortunately they all suspect their wives of cheating with you&#8230; so there are still some bad feelings there. If you win by UN diplomatic victory, you must have at least TWO other civilizations vote for you in the diplomatic victory resolution.

There are no barbarians&#8230; However, Goldmember is leading a Minor Civ, which is the same thing as barbarians, only different. Discover, learn, have fun.

Some early wonders have been distributed among the civilizations. To help you out, Soundjata has given you the Pyramids. Unfortunately for you, I, Dr Evil had other plans&#8230;the Pyramids were left in your Swinger&#8217;s Pad and Fat Bastard is about to capture it. You need to get it back before the game is over, of course. And it is FORBIDDEN to change civics BEFORE the Swinger&#8217;s Pad is captured by Fat Bastard.:nono:

The game begins with your Fembot minding house at your Swinger&#8217;s Pad, and Fat Bastard knocking on the door. Use the Fembot (MedicIII scout) as you like, she&#8217;s only a robot -- with a really nice rack. (I mean luggage-rack&#8230; what&#8230; which gutter did your mind wander to?).
&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;
Since the flimsy and implausible premise for this scenario is relying on space/time travel, I want you to know that you start with the Technology of Fusion. And since Austin would never go anywhere/anywhen without the possibility to find a smashing polyester suit, you also go with Composites. On the other hand, Dr Evil and Goldmember know a thing or two about Fission&#8230; but you and everyone else will have to figure that out for yourselves. Some other techs to some civs can be there.:mischief: You all start in the Ancient Era, however. To prevent this game taking a &#8220;perpetuity&#8221; for you teams to complete, we have given all civilizations (including you) the technologies of masonry, and pottery. Everyone else also gets sailing, but not you. You have contact with all civilizations at game start, but they each like Dr. Evil better than they like you, because he is smarter, more intelligent, more clever, more shrewd and more cool (so cool, in fact, if he were any cooler, he&#8217;d still be frozen). :mwaha:Mwahahaha!

&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;..
Victory conditions:
Must (A) Raze Dr Evil&#8217;s Lair; and (B) Own the Swinger&#8217;s Pad, and (C) make the Swinger&#8217;s Pad reach Legendary Culture without use of &#8220;culture bombs&#8221;, and (D) You MUST use Free Religion civic as soon as (or if) you learn Liberalism, and then may not switch out of Free Religion until the end of the game; and (E) you must win the game in one of the following three ways: (1) UN Diplomatic Victory with votes from two civilizations other than yourself; or (2) Culture Victory with espionage contributing less than 4000 culture in at least two of your Legendary Cities; or (3) Spaceship arrives at Alpha Centauri.

Please recall that it is still forbidden to gift/liberate cities to a civilization you are at war with except as part of a Peace Treaty. YOU may not raze the Swinger&#8217;s Pad. In the very unlikely event that the Swinger&#8217;s Pad is razed by someone else, you are permitted to found a new Swinger&#8217;s Pad on the ruins of the old.

Laurels will be awarded to the team completing the most number of objectives, and ties in that regard will be decided by how fast you can do it.

To summarize, the objectives are as follows:
1) Dr Evil&#8217;s lair is razed
2) You own the Swinger&#8217;s Pad
3) The Swinger&#8217;s Pad is Legendary without using Great Works (&#8220;culture bombs&#8221;)
4) You win the game by one of these conditions:
a. Spaceship lands at Alpha Centauri
b. UN diplomatic victory with 2 civs voting for you
c. Culture Victory where Culture Through Espionage does not exceed 4000 culture in at least two of your Legendary Cities.
5) You win the game in any fashion, including the above, but also including Conquest/Domination/Time/Religion/UN with less than 2 other civs votes/Culture VC that does not comply with above restrictions/and anything else not covered.

Yes, if you complete objective #4, then objective #5 is also completed (two for the price of one). Objective #5 is to give you incentive to play on even after you realize that you will fail Objective #4. :evil:Mwahaha!

Breaking conditions on use of Liberalism requiring Free Religion or changing civics on turn zero is grounds for disqualification, not part of the objectives.

[img=right]http://gotm.civfanatics.net/civ4games/images/sgotm18small.jpg[/img]
Game Options:
Require Complete Kills
No Vassals
No Huts
No Random Events
No Barbarians
No Technology Brokering
New Random Seed on reload

Opponents: 6 AI (4 Normal, Dr Evil, and 1 Minor Civ Goldmember)
All capitols pre-settled by evil mapmakers
Normal Speed
Immortal Difficulty
Ancient Era - all civs start in Ancient Era despite some advanced techs already known.
Map: Heavily edited, flat wrap, was based on Great Plains - barely recognizable now.
Contact at start of game with all AI
At war with Dr Evil at game start
Always at war with Goldmember as he is a Minor Civ.


Timetable

The Team Saves will be available here on August 5th.

The completion deadline will be December 19th, 2013.. Plan your game accordingly, and please avoid a last minute struggle to meet the deadline.

Links to saves and progress information are available on the SGOTM Progress Page

Notes
  • Versions
    This game will be played in Civilization IV Beyond the Sword, version 3.19, using the standard BUFFY-3.19.003 HoF mod.
    If a later BtS patch is released during this game you will NOT be able to use it to play. You will need to complete this game in BtS version 3.19 before updating your copy of BtS, or create and update a separate copy.

    Mac players can only join in if they are able to run the Windows software on their system.
  • Rules and Procedures
    Please visit the Civ4 SGOTM reference thread to check out the rules and procedures to ensure that you are adequately prepared for this game.

    All saved game files uploaded to the server are parsed through software that extracts and archives data about your save, including reload count for each turn set.
  • Spoiler information will absolutely NOT be tolerated in this thread.

Current Sign-up Lists
The table below lists the current membership of the competing teams.
50018.php
 
Please note that old SGOTM saves are no longer available by directly linking to the file on the server. Old direct links will produce an Access Forbidden error. If you want to test your BUFFY installation, I suggest you download a test save using the following link:

http://gotm.civfanatics.net/download.php?file=Fifth_Element_SG016_BC4000_01.CivBeyondSwordSave
It's the Fifth Element 4000 BC start file from SGOTM 16.

PS Don't try to use SGOTM 12 files for testing, either. That game used a non-standard version of BUFFY, so the saves shouldn't load with the standard BUFFY.
 
The starting saves for each team will be available to download on this page at midnight tonight, CST. That's a little under 12 hours from the timestamp of this post.

PLEASE remember the house rules. The most important are:

  1. Only the currently active player in the team makes irreversible changes to the game.
  2. Upload your saves to the competition server. You can do this during each turn-set, and you must do so at the end of the turn-set to hand over to the next player.
  3. Make sure you have set the BtS autosave interval to 1, so that they occur every turn.
  4. If you experience a computer crash, notify me or kcd_swede by PM, and load up the most recent save - either the last autosave, or your last manual save. If you followed rule #3 you will not have to replay more than a part turn. Repeat any moves you made since that save as accurately as you can.
  5. Don't read other team threads. or download other team saves.
  6. Be nice to each other :)

Good luck to all of you.
 
Why were the team threads to SGOTM 17 closed?

It's not a huge issue, but it makes it harder to easily copy or quote posts from the last SGOTM.
 
Because they seemed to be going on forever. If you can only copy or quote from open threads, I'll open them again. But PLEASE stop using them for ongoing discussions.

They are old. They are pushing up the daisies. They are deceased. They are dead they have gone to meet their maker. The have joined the choir invisible. They are DEAD!
 
It has been discovered that if you offer a peace deal while the game is paused, you can try different options and click "Would you accept this deal?" and find out whether a deal will work. In unpaused mode, the first acceptable deal you offer would be done. But because you are paused, this occurs without actually completing the deal.

We have to assume the game designers deliberately removed the "What would make this deal work?" option in a peace discussion to limit negotiation.

Therefore, do NOT click "Would you accept this deal?" when paused, as it represents an irreversible action that can give you more information than you would have in normal play.
 
It has been discovered that if you offer a peace deal while the game is paused, you can try different options and click "Would you accept this deal?" and find out whether a deal will work. In unpaused mode, the first acceptable deal you offer would be done. But because you are paused, this occurs without actually completing the deal.

We have to assume the game designers deliberately removed the "What would make this deal work?" option in a peace discussion to limit negotiation.

Therefore, do NOT click "Would you accept this deal?" when paused, as it represents an irreversible action that can give you more information than you would have in normal play.

Is this already regarded as an "exploit"? In other GOTM games as well?
 
It can't be "already" regarded as an exploit, as it has only just come to light as far as I know.

Saving, playing irreversible actions, then reloading and replaying is clearly outlawed in GOTMs. I think everyone agrees to play to that rule, and I don't think of it as an "exploit". It's simply a house rule to help to achieve a level playing field.

I am saying that doing the same thing while pausing the game should also be outlawed.

Does anyone disagree?
 
My opinion is that anything that goes against the 'spirit' of the no reloading rule should be disallowed. The Misfit Gypsy Nuts won't be taking advantage of this feature.

Having said that, since the ability to do this is such a new idea, I guess it's possible one or more teams have done this unintentionally (?). I don't think any team should be punished for this SGOTM, and perhaps a discussion to ban/allow could be had afterwards for future SGOTMs.
 
My question "Does anyone disagree?" was meant to be rhetorical. How can something that is forbidden when not paused become permissible when paused?

If it has been done in the past unintentionally, there's little excuse for continuing to do it now. You could all stop doing it from now on.

I don't see a need for a discussion after this SGOTM. If I am missing something, please tell me now.

I have always made my position clear on "fiddling" with the save if you are not the active player. This just makes me more certain that I dislike it.
 
Rules whose violation can _not_ possibly be detected have no place in a serious competition.

As to the new prohibition of checking peace deals when the game is paused: What possible use is checking for peace deals when one doesn't actually want a peace deal (game paused)? The game would actually need to be unpaused for the peace deal to be executed.

Peace deals are always one sided and the best deal can be executed by the active player by simply offering peace deals of monotonically increasing value to the AI until it accepts.

Thus the technique is both _not_ detectable and can't provide any useful data that would affect game play, so there's really not much point in prohibiting it.

Also, the prohibition of irreverible moves assumes they are actually executed by the game. They are not executed while paused and if the game is exited while still paused they are _not_ executed at all.

Sun Tzu Wu
 
Rules whose violation can _not_ possibly be detected have no place in a serious competition.
Right, so we abandon the No Reload rule? Let everyone play with full map pre-knowledge and as many attempts as they like?

Reloading to change an action or decision is not allowed, regardless of whether it is detectable.
As to the new prohibition of checking peace deals when the game is paused: What possible use is checking for peace deals when one doesn't actually want a peace deal (game paused)? The game would actually need to be unpaused for the peace deal to be executed.
Because multiple players want to find out what options *could* be available. Then the team discusses which one they prefer. I don't like it, but that's what happens.
Peace deals are always one sided and the best deal can be executed by the active player by simply offering peace deals of monotonically increasing value to the AI until it accepts.
Quite right. But the team may vary in their view about what "monodically increasing value" means. Is G gold worth more than T techs or C cities or L luxuries?
Thus the technique is both _not_ detectable and can't provide any useful data that would affect game play, so there's really not much point in prohibiting it.
I didn't say is is not detectable. But even if it is, your requirement would invalidate the no-reload basis of xOTMs. We've had this discussion before. And it does provide a range of options that the team could not have discussed otherwise.
Also, the prohibition of irreverible moves assumes they are actually executed by the game. They are not executed while paused and if the game is exited while still paused they are _not_ executed at all.
We thought only reversible actions could be tested while paused. This is the first exception that I am aware of.
 
We thought only reversible actions could be tested while paused. This is the first exception that I am aware of.
At the risk of fanning the flames, here is another pause related "exploit" that is presently undetectable: if you pause the game and beg or demand a gift from the AI, it is possible to learn whether this beg or demand will succeed; the player is then free to un-pause or quit and reload, as he or she pleases.

I call this an exploit for two reasons:

  1. Much like when making peace, the diplomatic screen lacks a "what would make this deal work" option when issuing a demand or beg. Asking for 1000 :gold: is inherently riskier than asking for 1 :gold: . Making these requests while the game is paused allows the player to negotiate the best freebie possible: e.g., beg 50G. It works? Reload. Beg 70G. It fails? Reload. Beg 60G. It works? We have a deal.
  2. To quote a post by oedali:

    Whenever you ask the AI for a grant, their counter for demands/grants (which is the same counter for both demands & grants) goes up by 1. If they have already granted you something in the past, they will automatically reject all consequent requests until they "forget" it and the counter goes back to zero." Every request/demand adds to the counter so it's not a good idea to ask again and again if they refuse.
    Issuing a beg or demand while the game is paused enables the player to discover whether the AI has "forgotten" the earlier request.

I haven't used this trick in SGOTM. I may, however, have used it once or twice in casual play... under particularly dire circumstances. :mischief:
 
I think using pause mode to gain additional details is not in the spirit of this game. Pause mode is meant to be there to avoid mistake happening from players viewing the live save.

I don't know why players are even questioning this ruling. Not sure why anyone would do this in casual play. It just removes the fun.
 
I call this an exploit for two reasons:

  1. Much like when making peace, the diplomatic screen lacks a "what would make this deal work" option when issuing a demand or beg. Asking for 1000 :gold: is inherently riskier than asking for 1 :gold: . Making these requests while the game is paused allows the player to negotiate the best freebie possible: e.g., beg 50G. It works? Reload. Beg 70G. It fails? Reload. Beg 60G. It works? We have a deal.
Pracitcally speaking, this is not an exploit because you can determine these values by knowing the code.
I call this an exploit for two reasons:

2. To quote a post by oedali:

Issuing a beg or demand while the game is paused enables the player to discover whether the AI has "forgotten" the earlier request.​
This is an exploit since the RNG prevents even code-divers from knowing if the AI has forgotten. It's also a non-trivial exploit because this can have serious impacts on the game. There are more significant ones that you omitted, especially for this scenario. ;)
 
Basil: Austin Powers, come in Austin Powers!

Austin: Yes, HQ, do you have any...

<ssss.....krrrrkk....ssskkkrrrrr...>

Dr. Evil: Sorry to barge in again (not really, it's just a mannerism:devil:)... but I would like to gloat about the fact that more than a quarter of the time allotted to Austin Powers to get his mojo back is gone, kaput, never to be re-gotten. Having Santa Claus give you a new mojo is so out of the question that even I cannot find an appropriate metaphor for how far out that is.


<ssss.....krrrrkk....ssskkkrrrrr...>

Basil: I just want to remind you Austin that 1 month of this 4-month game has expired. The game should be completed before December 5. THIS year, Austin.
 
Does anyone know if there is any additional action needed in order to make BUFFY work properly with the Steam version of BtS with Admin privileges?
 
Was BUG uninstalled, and the corresponding Custom Assets folder deleted?
 
Yes, but no luck.

I tried to do a shortcut, but it did not work either. Here is the error when I open the short cut:
Spoiler :
steamerror50_zps2ef2be4e.jpg


Here is the error after I try to load BUFFY out of steam:
Spoiler :
steamerrormessage_zps6fb2f494.jpg
[/URL]


The 2nd one is the one that especially doesn't make sense to me. Civ4 closes to restart with the BUFFY mod, so how is civ4 still running? Any help would be much appreciated.
 
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