SGOTM3 Rome - Team Bugsy

[grahamiam]

G-Man: We won't lose the original core productivity, we'll just gain additional production in the new core. The original core will have the benefit of the nearby FP to keep it going.

not where your suggesting. it will be at least @ distance 12 to Rome from the old location of Athens and the other cities will be greater. we will lose production while the new core comes online, not a good thing to do when at war. also, the major element in regards to flips, foreign citizens, is eliminated by the varient so no real problem there. imho, lets forget the move for now and lets focus on catching up. once we get the continent close to our control, we can then start looking at logical locations if the game seems to warrent it.

 

[Sir Bugsy]

I finished my turns late, but didn't get a chance to post the log. I'll have it up in the AM Pacific time. So what happened?

How many leaders?

a) 1 b) 2 c) 3 d) 4

How many cities destroyed?

a) 2 b) 3 c) 4 d) 5

Was Greece destroyed?

a) yes b) no

Tune in tomorrow to find out in the next exciting episode of "When in Rome"!

(BTW - Actually the name of a pretty good band)

 

[alerum68]

oh! I like playing this game!!!

1) 4!

2) 5!

3) A! If not, you're fired. J/k... maybe.

4) Don't know about our taste in music though. Give me some good ole Rage Against the Machine or Slipknot, or even some Slayer if I'm in an evil mood that Slipknot won't fill. When's SoaD's next album out you ask? (shrugs) I'm still into the new Fear Factory.

Edit: Oh yeah, for the FP I just want to point out that we'll loose our RCP ranking by moving the palace.

 

[denyd]

Oooh can I play the guessing game too:

1. 2 Leaders (1 for an army & 1 for Heroic Epic)
2. 5 Cities
3. No more Greece
4. My tastes in music tend to run more towards Hiroshima, Rippingtons & Keiko Matsui

Looks like I'm up in this one now. Got a free evening and it's first on the list.

Once Bugs has posted the log, suggestions and comments for my upcoming set are welcome.

 

[Sir Bugsy]

Quiz answers – 2 leaders, 3 cities (Delphi, Argos & Liverpool), Greece is still alive, but barely.
Alerum – We just have very different musical tastes.
Denyd – I do like Hiroshima, I like the “1000 Cranes” song the best. Alerum, that song would probably make you

110 BC – Continued. I don’t need to worry about declaring war anytime soon, we’re already at war with everyone we know.

We have a strong military compared to every one but Babylon (average).

Back to the war. Lose a legion attacking the German sword. Then kill the sword with another vet.

Kill another Bowman with a legion.
G-man checks in. I send the leader towards Viroconium.

Change Hispalis to a cat. The settler/worker factory at Veii is fixed… nice job! We have a worker selected right now and I agree with that plan. We need some improvements everywhere.
Fire a taxman in Pompeii. MM several cities for production v. growth.

IBT – We defend against an English archer. The Babs have another stack headed our way.
Veii: worker=>settler

1. 90 BC – Move the leader to Viroc. And rush the FP.

A English settler pair has wandered next to our legion/archer in the east. Kill the spear and disband the workers. I hate doing that.

Kill a Bowman with a eLegion. Kill a Russian spear with a eLegion. A Russian horse retreats from our *Legion. Use a spear to kill it.

We have a lot of cash. Since we’re in despotism, we can’t rush anything with it. Since we’re at war with everyone, we can buy anything with it. I up our science budget to 50% Philosophy due in 3 at +3gpt.

Not having to worry about diplomacy is kind of nice
IBT – We defend against a Russian horse. Units march closer.
Viroc.: FP=>Barracks
Babs start Sun-Tzu’s

2. 70 BC – Upgrade a warrior.
Kill a French warrior with a eLegion.
Move two legions onto the hill above Antium to force the Bab stack into the valley.
Start moving on Delphi.

IBT – The Babs move into the valley. Germans start Sun-Tzu’s.

3. 50 BC – Kill two Bowmen and promote two vLegions.

Found Lugdunum as our final RCP4 ring city. Start Barracks.
Attack the stack of Bowmen with Trajan’s Eagles. The regular Bowman on top takes 7hp from the army.
Attack again and a regBowman takes out a eLegion, and doesn’t lose a hp! I hate the RNG.
Kill one of the Hoplites defending Delphi and promote our legion to elite.
Kill a Greek archer with a eLegion. We should be due for another leader soon.
Science comes down to 40%. Philo due next. Lux down 10%.

IBT – No attacks, but several incursions. Monarchy is next, science to 70% with +1gpt budget, due in 15.
Rome: leg=>leg

4. 30 BC – Upgrade another Legion.

@Delphi – An eLegion loses 3hp but razes the city.
We march on Corinth and Oxford.
We lose a vLegion killing two Bowman.

IBT – A legion defeats first an English archer and a French sword, before losing to another French sword.

5. 10 BC – Upgrade another warrior.
@ Oxford we kill a spear.

I lost the last five turns in my log when my machine locked up, so here is a brief recap. The city of Argos was razed and this happy event occurred…

The leader is almost home. The Germans and the Babylonians have had an obsession about Lugdunum. On the last turn I killed off two bowmen. You’ll notice a line of Germans in the mountains. They are heading towards Lugdunum or maybe our FP city.

The city of Liverpool NW of Antium was razed. Although we eventually lost the legion who got it done, he took out two English archers and a Russian spear before falling to an English horse.

Most of the Axis powers have started working on Sun-Tzu. I wouldn’t plan on getting any wonders. I would just keep building armies with the leaders.

We have two units in position to assault Oxford next turn. I don’t know if we want to start expanding in that direction or back fill around our FP. There is some incense around where Athens was. The AI have started moving into that vacuum. The Russians and French are in the area. Oh I see the Russians have a city.

The Americans have finally started to show up. We are strong compared to every one but Babylon and we’re average with them.

There is a settler to the south. The tile one SE of the horses, which he stands on, is RCP7.

The settler factory is just about running as good as it is going to get, cycling between 4 and 6. between 3 and 5 you don’t get enough shields. We may want to settle the area north of the river in the Oxford-Liverpool area, although backfilling the Greek area is probably more important. We might want to plan out a dot map for that area. Around the FP.

We now have two cities building Legions, and Pompeii will start after its warrior is built. I have two cities building cats, Pisae and Hispalis. Please keep building cats somewhere because they will become very important in reducing the defense in cities with pikes.

Ravenna will be hooked up to our happiness network and will be able to build legions as well, although we might want to build horses there.

Lugdunum has the potential to be a worker factory once the lands are improved.

Move the leader first so that you can have more chance of getting more leaders. I would let Antium complete the HE, by the time you got the leader there, the build would only have two turns left.

City management – We need more improvements in our core. Rome can probably produce 15 spt if we get the hills mined. Pompeii and Cumae should be able to hit 10 spt. Eventually we’ll want to chop the forests over by Pisae and Hispalis to get more growth.

Here is a sitrep:

Save: http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm3/bugsy_SG003_AD0090_01.SAV

Go get ‘em Denyd!

 

[grahamiam]

good turns bugs and glad to see we're researching monarchy! that will help a lot. hopefully, with space cramped to the N, the AI's will start turning on each other.

getting Rome up to 15spt should be a high priority but getting Cumae up to 10spt may be quicker.
with the leader, I say we form another legion army. once we get 3, we will be able to build the pentigon and our army's will be truely unstoppable.
also, imho, i say we let greece rot for now, focusing instead on breaking france while wiping the area clean of unwelcome guests.

 

[Sir Bugsy]

AH, I forgot to tell you. It was in my lost log. The Babylonians have a city named Chicago. It has started.

 

[denyd]

Nice work Bugsy

Looks like Catherine has a couple of cities to be razed in our neighborhood.

Once Monarchy is here (about 7 turns), I plan on revolting immediately (I hope I don't have to pass anarchy to the next player).

The RCP 4 is complete and RCP 7 is now in process, is there any impact on having a third ring or will they be generally corrupt?

I agree with G-M about Armies and The Pentagon.

As for building horses, unless we expect to get to Chivalry soon, horses against pikes is not a good idea. I agree on cats. They'll be vital for those size 6+ cities.

 

[RowAndLive]

G-Man: We won't lose the original core productivity, we'll just gain additional production in the new core. The original core will have the benefit of the nearby FP to keep it going.

Given this, then Antium may be the best bet, to keep the original core uncorrupted.

Also, I hooked up the horses so that we could have a few rapid-reaction units for the S and E shores. Now the W too. No intent to build a horde of horses.

 

[Sir Bugsy]

I think we need to get an RCP4 and 7 around the FP city.

R&L - I think I missed something on Antium.

 

[grahamiam]

Once Monarchy is here (about 7 turns), I plan on revolting immediately (I hope I don't have to pass anarchy to the next player).

The RCP 4 is complete and RCP 7 is now in process, is there any impact on having a third ring or will they be generally corrupt?

As for building horses, unless we expect to get to Chivalry soon, horses against pikes is not a good idea. I agree on cats. They'll be vital for those size 6+ cities.

please revolt immediately. don't worry about handing off anarchy as getting to monarchy is key here.

re RCP: i usually get sloppy after the 1st or 2nd ring and have no real ill effects. i think we've done a nice job as is. We can focus on the FP rings now if desired. having a perfect 3rd ring @ distance 10 could be more trouble than it's worth. I'd rather have towns on hills with legeons inside, soaking up enemy swords.

as for horses, 2 playing zone for rear land landings would be useful. otherwise, i agree with limiting thier builds till we get more cities online creating units. right now, we need more legions and cat's.

what about greece, rot or kill?

@R&L and denyd -> let's agree to worry about palace jumping later, eh? right now, we need to focus on getting out of our foxhole.

 

[Sir Bugsy]

what about greece, rot or kill?

I think for the time being we let them rot. Let's concentrate on building cities and skirmishing on defense. We don't want to have to conquer the former Greek lands too many times. Then as we run out of land we start razing cities. When we are ready to move north, we should have some settlers handy to settle the land as we clear it out.

 

[RowAndLive]

@R&L and denyd -> let's agree to worry about palace jumping later, eh? right now, we need to focus on getting out of our foxhole.

Not a problem. I had quoted from the previous page. My personal style doesn't allow for moving the palace. I prefer to keep my original core running well.

I could go along with letting Greece ripen a little bit. Joan needs to be pillaged, and Paris is so close...

Also, IIRC, the American-Bab thing started quite a while ago.

 

[denyd]

Agree on the FP

Do I have anyone to declare against during my set?

I'll concentrate on razing the nearest cities.

Which direction should we be settling (E & NE would be my guess)?

After Monarchy, then what? Currency, code of laws or construction are what's left I think. I'm thinking code of laws at maximum to get us out of the AA ASAP.

Libraries would help alot on research, but is the build time worth the gain?

 

[Sir Bugsy]

We're at war with everyone we know.

I agree on settling east, and maybe southeast

I'd go science at max on any of the three.

 

[grahamiam]

once cumae is up to speed (10spt), then a library in rome would be a nice addition.

also, wrt research after monarchy, i'd prefer currency for the markets (warring + markets = good) but we might just be quicker to the MA if we take the cheapest tech 1st. we'll see how it looks at the end of your turns, as we'll probably just be in anarchy when you hand off.

 

[alerum68]

hehehe... you'd be suprised... my music taste are actually pretty varied... as long as it's not country, rap, or Yanni.

Looks like some good turns. The obssession with a city that has nothing in it must mean there is a resource we don't know about near it. Probably some rubber or oil.

I'll have a dotmap up for the greek lands. I think we should backfill areas we conquour before the AI has a chance. Also, we may want to stockpile 2-3 settlers to quickly start rebuilding cities after we destroy them. Sorry if I cross-posted, didn't read anything else yet.

I believe Denyd is up.

The dot map:

Red dot is RCP-7.

Blue dots are RCP-10, and all but one are on hills... very nice defense.

Purple dots aren't based on RCP at all. They're almost all place on a hill, unless it's coastal or in tundra. We may want to re-do some of the iceberg cities, making it a bit tigher since the won't grow beyond size 2, but I didn't think we'd get that far for a while anyway. Take out the east first, then we can backfill the south as our leisure.

One last thing... France should be our last target. If they keep kicking people out who are going for us, they're bound to get dragged into a war or 5. This should take some pressure off of us. We should still weaken then if they enter our lands, but that's it. I think the first thing we should do, and I know it goes against normal game play, but we should clear out all those small cities that have poped up around us... just make sure we have a settler ready to retake that location before the AI does... we're already at war... a cities every 4 turns should be plenty until we get a more solid footing... that's just MHO though, and I'm counting on you guys to find some holes in it.

 

[RowAndLive]

Also, Lagash is on the 7-ring, and Corinth is on the 10-ring.

I like libraries first, but could live with courts. Looking forward to the switch to monarchy!

 

[Sir Bugsy]

Libraries in close, courts in ring 7 and greater.

 

[denyd]

To quote one of the great thinkers of our times, Bullwinkle the Moose: "Hey, Rocky watch me pull a rabbit out of my hat"

THE SAVE

Turn 0 – 90 AD – Take a quick look around and since were at war with everyone no trades possible – Decide to upgrade the Vet Warrior in Pompeii – Fire the clown in Pompeii - hit return and duck

IBT: 5 German Swords & 3 American Swords enter the picture – Veii settler->settler

Turn 1 – 110 AD – Vet Legion loses to Reg Greek Archer (1/3) – Vet Legion (3/4) kills Reg Greek Archer – Attack on Oxford: Vet Legion (1/4) kills Reg Spear – Elite Legion (1/5) kills Reg Spear and Oxford is razed, 2 slaves disbanded – Vet Legion (2/4) kills Reg English Archer – Elite Legion (4/5) chases off Reg English Horse (1/3)

IBT: Germany comes calling and is up +5 technologies – Vet Legion (2/5) defends against Reg English Archer and promotes – Rome Legion->Legion – Pompeii Warrior->Legion – Viroconium Barracks->Archer

Turn 2 – 130 AD – Maximus reaches Pompeii and forms an Army – Settler founds Lutetia starts barracks – Vet Legion (3/5) kills Babylonian spear and promotes – other units heal

IBT: A rainbow of swordsmen appear – Ravenna warrior->warrior – Lugdunum worker->catapult

Turn 3 – 150 AD – Maximus Maulers loaded with 3 Vet Legions – just lots of other unit movement to the front

IBT: Vet Spear (3/4) defends against Reg American Sword – Elite Legion loses to Reg American Sword (1/3) – Cumae Legion-Legion – Pisae Catapult->Horseman

Turn 4 – 170 AD – Cat misses Sword – Trajan Eagles (12/14) kills French Reg Sword – Maximus Maulers (9/12) kills Vet German Sword – Vet Legion (2/4) chases English Horse (1/3) – Legion (4/4) kills Reg American Sword – Elite Legion (4/5) kills English Horse and Germanicus is born – Germanicus hurries to Antium but can’t form an army yet need 1 more city – Elite Legion (3/5) kills Reg German Sword – Elite Legion (4/5) kills Reg German Sword

IBT: English Horse (2/3) kills Elite Legion – American Archer (1/3) kills Vet Legion (3hp on a hill) – Vet Spear (3/4) defends against Reg America Archer – Rome Legion->Legion – Antium Heroic Epic->Legion

Turn 5 – 190 AD – Cat misses German sword – Cat hits English Horse – Trajans Eagles (9/14) kills Reg French sword – Elite (4/5) Legion kills Reg American Archer – Elite Legion (5/5) kills English Horse – Vet Legion (4/5) kills Reg Bowman and promotes – Maximus Maulers (7/14) kills Reg German Sword gets a promotion

IBT: Defensive cat hit – Maximus Maulers defend against a pair of German Archers – Veii Settler->Settler

Turn 6 – 210 AD – Settler founds Byzantium starts barracks – Germanicus forms Red Machine – Elite Sword (5/5) kills Reg American Sword and Claudius (GL) is born – Switch Veii to Pentagon and Claudius hurries it – Elite Legion (4/5) kills Reg American Sword – Hero of Argos (4/5) kills America Spear and disbands pair of workers – Cat hits Bab Spear - Elite Legion (4/5) kills Reg Bab Spear – Elite Legion (1/5) kills Reg Bab Spear (they were heading for the iron) - Switch Hispalis to spear (American galley nearby)

IBT: Veii builds Pentagon starts Settler – Ravenna warrior->legion – Hispalis spearman->catapult

230 AD – Turn 7 – Hero of Argos kills another American settler/spear pair – Elite Legion (1/5) kills Reg American Spear

IBT: English heading to Veii – BTW: Spot an American Pikeman - Discover Monarchy research Code of Laws – Rome Legion->Legion – Antium Legion->Legion – Cumae Legion->Legion – Pompeii Legion->Legion – Viroconium spear->spear

Turn 8 – 250 AD – Cat hits Hoplite – Cat misses Bowman – Vet Legion (4/4) kills Bowman – Elite Legion (4/5) kills Reg American Sword – Vet Legion (2/4) kills English Horse – Begin revolt to Monarchy – Draw only a 3 turn anarchy

IBT: Veii spearman defend against a pair of English Archers and get a promotion, however the third archer pillages the game

Turn 9 – 260 AD – Cat hits French Sword – Vet Legion (3/4) kills Reg French Sword – Vet Legion (4/5) kills Reg French Sword and promotes

IBT: Maximus Maulers (18/18) with catapult help defend against a Greek Archer

Turn 10 – 270 AD – Cat misses – Cat hits English Archer – Red Machine (14/19) kills Vet American Spear and razes Miami – Maximus Maulers (16/18) kills Vet German Sword – Vet Legion (3/4) kills Reg English Sword

After action report We have one more turn of Anarchy – Hero of Argos is chasing a Russian spear/settler pair – Trajan’s Eagles are at the doorstep of Nuremberg, they have a settler with them and a Legion for garrison duty following – There is an 1/5 Legion traveling with Big Red Machine, make sure to bring him home – England has a spear/settler pair heading for Oxford’s ruins
A quick diplomatic report:
Greece: Still in Ancient Age, 2 cities, lacks horses & iron
France: Middle Age, 6 cities
England: Middle Age, 8 cities, lacks iron
Babylon: Middle Age, 10 cities
Russia: Middle Age, 10 cities
Germany: Middle Age, 10 cities
America: Middle Age, 7 cities

Everyone is Republic except Greece (Despot) and all are weak to us military wise

We have 3 4-Legion armies in pretty good to excellent health, considering that at the beginning of turn 3, I was afraid I might not make it until 10 turns, were in pretty good shape. Monarchy should help our tech rate and with luck we’ll make it to the Middle Ages soon.

and a little eye candy: