All right! There has been a lot of discussion since this morning! That is my kind of SG! Yeah! In my previous 2 SG, only 2 players, including me, were actively discussing strategies but I see that most players here are. I read the article Bede mentioned and I agree it helps a lot. We have to adapt it because it assumes C3C and is not limited to 5 cities. Some thoughts: Do we really need a granary since we will build only 4 settlers? Unless there appends to be bonuses 2 tiles from the capital, it looks like we will go with the plan outside the capital (not enough sh IMHO). I suggest that the warriors scout around the capital until we find a good spot for the 20K city. Then they can go in strait lines to find contacts. Well, I do not usually go in that much detail, but MOTH forgot to count the move on turn 6, but it does not change the fact that we can build warriors on turn 5, 9, 12, 14 and a settler on turn 20 unless there is some kind of bonus we cannot see yet. In that case, I agree with Bede to build less warriors to get the settler on the same turn as the city grows to size 3. After the second BG is improved (turn 11 if I calculated correctly), then we can chop a forest, but I do not think we need it yet. IMHO, I think we should build a road toward the most likely spot for the 20K city to get it settled ASAP. Since we won't have much scouting done at that point, it is going to be a guess about the correct direction, but it is worth a shot. I completely agree with that! Since you are the only one with SGOTM experience, I guess you know what you saying and you would not say a thing like that if you were pretty sure about it. Should we celebrate already?