SGOTM8 - Tim

[TimBentley]

Yes, BG means bonus grassland. Don't feel bad if you don't understand me (sometimes I have the feeling that what I say is difficult to understand).

As for the first two questions, they were explaining how to best manage the cities to produce settlers efficiently (although pindicator's forest-chopping idea sounds better). The essential thing I was noting was the proper food excess to have.

I'll only expand on my first statement you quoted. The city when building the settler would start at size 4 with 5 food in the box, so here would be the production chart:

turn | food | pop | shields
0 | 5 | 4 | 0
1 | 0 | 5 | 6 (first turn had excess of 5 food per turn, got 6 shields counting the forest the new citizen worked)
2 | 2 | 5 | 14 (an excess of 2 food per turn, 8 shields per turn)
3 | 4 | 5 | 22
4 | 6 | 5 | 30

What school do you march for? I just got suckered back to do the alumni band at Oregon State. Well, it's free admission for a few games, so it wasn't too hard a decision

Olivet Nazarene University; it's about an hour south of Chicago.

If we can find a BG underneath one of those forests, we can get a 4-turn settler factory going at pop 5-6. In fact, I think what we could do if for three circuits run a 4 turn settler-factory at pop 4-5 and time a worker chop to pick up 10 shields. If we find a BG, we can talk about changing the factory structure. This only applies to the forests east of DC; the one south is on a plains tile.

I agree.

When the worker on the forest tile finishes roading, i would chop and then mine for a shield boost for DC. It currently isn't working the forest, so now is the best time. In fact, by stopping him now you can save an additional turn on the whole process (4 turns left to road + 4 turns to chop vs. 1 turn interrupted + 4 turns to chop + 2 turns to road).

You mean New York. I only mention this because it confused me for a minute.

A good city location might be NW of the closest dyes or E-SE of them.

 

[pindicator]

You mean New York. I only mention this because it confused me for a minute.

Ah, yes. NY is what I meant. My mouth and my brain are never connected.

 

[mr. Y]

I just like to add that I appreciate the extra explanations as well.
I have limited experience in CIV III, so while I understand the basic concepts of settler factories, I had/have difficulties figuring out how to make the calculations the easiest way. (Even though I used to study math - a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away) You explanations clear a lot of the fog.

What is this school marching band thing? An aspect of USA culture that I am not aware of? What is a marching band, is it what I think it is: people playing copper instruments (trumpet, bugle etc.) and drums marching the streets? I used to do that, too, even longer ago and in a galaxy even further away In the Netherlands, bands are not bound to a specific school though, but more to a town or city.

edit: Oh, and by the way: CIV Assist really rocks!

 

[pindicator]

mr. Y, I think you can go ahead and take it if you haven't already. We still haven't heard anything from Tboy.

Most major US colleges have marching bands. Some schools they are just compliments to the football teams. Others with more of a tradition in the sport attend competitions, especially down in the southern US. The school I went to had its program cut about ten years ago, so they are building up the program again, but the biggest thing we would ever do would be to host the state high school championships every other year. We only the self-satisfaction that we played better than the other school's team come gameday.

 

[AlanH]

Shall I remove Tboy from your roster?

 

[joethreeblah]

Ok, I think I have a plan on how to win this thing

 

[joethreeblah]

Whoops, that didn't work.

Ok, I've made a little chart graph showing what I think we need to do to bag this game.

Please see the attachment below.

 

[AlanH]

The fastest conquest wins, not the highest score

 

[joethreeblah]

The fastest conquest wins, not the highest score

I think we'd have to be conquesting pretty fast for such a change in gears.

I kind of like Joe - THE BLAH!

 

[joethreeblah]

mr. Y, I think you can go ahead and take it if you haven't already. We still haven't heard anything from Tboy.

Most major US colleges have marching bands. Some schools they are just compliments to the football teams. Others with more of a tradition in the sport attend competitions, especially down in the southern US. The school I went to had its program cut about ten years ago, so they are building up the program again, but the biggest thing we would ever do would be to host the state high school championships every other year. We only the self-satisfaction that we played better than the other school's team come gameday.

I wouldn't mind if we sped the rotation up a little bit.

I kind of like Joe - THE BLAH!

 

[TimBentley]

Shall I remove Tboy from your roster?

Well, he didn't respond to my PM I sent two days ago (and he's been on today), so I suppose you could.

 

[AlanH]

Done. Just let me know if you want to reinstate him, or to add another player.

 

[joethreeblah]

Done. Just let me know if you want to reinstate him, or to add another player.

I have a willing sub for the next go round if yall want one.

 

[mr. Y]

IBT - Greece forces us to move away our troops - DC expands revealing a hut SE

1 -1475
switch Philly form worker to barracks

IBT
Kyoto completes the oracle
warrior North survives barb attack
Greece marches with stack 2x hoplite, archer + elite warrior
Chinese found Nanking

2 -1450
change lux to 20%
start moving workers back to DC to chop

IBT
Boston finishes barracks

3 -1425
A barbcamp appears NE from lux, 2 tiles from where I wanted to settle (E SE from lux)
Our warrior stands next to it,the settler remains behind. I decide against settling 2 tiles from the camp, since we have no spear yet.
This will cost us a few turns

IBT
chop finishes in NY
northern warrior survives YABA (yet another barb attack) while at 1/5. This guy is even more indestructible than Keith Richards!

4 -1400
workers arrive at Settler factory
a warrior sets out to check out the hut

IBT
DC finishes settler
There's no way to reach the north part of the island anymore without going through Greek or Chinese territory.
We still have StrongerthanKeith up there though.

5 -1375

I decide move the new settler south, until we have better defense, what with the barbcamp and all.

IBT
nothing nada niente niks nop nichts noppes nakka

6 -1350
nothing nada niente niks nop nichts noppes nakka

IBT 1st chop DC finishes, no BG

7 -1325
DC is now size 5; since we are short of warriors I must move lux to 40%
This is not such a problem this turn, because we need only 50% science to complete CoL.
Next settler takes only 8 shields,so I decide to work 2 tiles of forest to complete it next turn and be able to reduce lux.
With the next chop coming the turn after that, we can finish a warrior right after that.
Warrior pops hut SE for 50 gc.
Atlanta founded.

IBT
DC finishes Settler.
A lot of alarmbells go off.
1) China sends an archer + spearman south they're 4 tiles from Philly now - hopefully they'll fight with the barbs.
2) A barb horse appears 2SE from Atlanta, which is defended by 1 warrior only. This is going to cost us.
tech: CoL->Philosophy

8 -1300
The new settler goes north
workers set out to work some land in Atlanta

IBT
Greece is still moving military
2nd DC chop finishes and reveal a BG

9 -1275
movement

IBT
Barb horse attacks and loses from our warrior. pfew...
DC grows to 4 and finishes spearman

10 -1250
move settler into settling position.
move the new spear south to aid in the defense of Atlanta. I expect a lot of barb attacks from there. Fortify it on the mountain SE and no barbs will get through.
move some more units.
trade with Greece: they give Iron Working + 65 gc for CoL
trade with China: They give Mysticism for CoL + 29gc.

There is 1 visible source of Iron on the island. It's in the utter north.
No iron, no horses... this is going to be fun.

pointers:
- The northest settler + warrior can settle on the spot.
- In the north we have planned 3 more towns, as you can e on the map. There is another settler on its way there. The accompanying defense unit (spearman) is a bit behind. You can solve this by moving the spear into NY, and then sending the NY warrior to acompany the settler. This saves some time.
- There is a barbcamp 1NE from the closest lux, or there was, for some Chinese units are wandering there.
- DC is almost in shape for a 4-turn SF, after 3 turns the BG is mined. DC will have finished its intermediate warrior by then and be at size 5. I think this is exactly the way we wanted it, but correct me if I'm wrong.
- It is very important to pay attention to the lux slider and the positions of out units for MP EVERY TURN. Be creative with it for we must stretch our millitary resources a bit.
- Consider poprushing the granary in NY. We need more workers...
- I think we want a colony on the lux in the mountains south. This will add these mountains to our field of vision and prevent barbcamps from popping up. He current camp needs to be mopped up first though.

In general:
- Let multiple workers improve the same tile if possible. This yields quicker results than 2 workers improving 2 seperate tiles.

pindicator up.
then Sesn, Joe the Blah, Tim

I don't mind playing with a team of 5.
But if there's someone who wants to join he's welcome as far as I'm concerned.

 

[pindicator]

Nice turns and nice dotmap. That's about what I came up with, even if they seem at odd positions in the north.

I'd imagine the Chinese troops are just hunting barbs. Unless we have an undefended city up there (which we shouldn't).

The good news is that the horses are on China's border town. With a determined attack, I'm sure we can get them.

It's either that, or LBs, Spears, & Trebs are going to be our attack force.

Edit: Got it and will play tomorrow.

 

[mr. Y]

The dotmap is in fact yours, pindicator. I only added one extra town in the north. I was more or less forced to, because of the barbs. Our settler is at that very spot now, and you can settle it in your first turn.

I only learned about the mechanics of the so-called 'Republic-slingshot' today. I trust you know all about it? If it's going to happen, it'll probably happen in one of your last turns.

 

[pindicator]

The dotmap is in fact yours, pindicator. I only added one extra town in the north.

Uh, yeah. I knew that...

 

[mr. Y]

Uh, yeah. I knew that...

oh duh, ok.
well, don't blame me I'm only Dutch.

 

[pindicator]

All of your points are very good, mr. Y. I especially like how you moved the settler as far north as possible to create a choke. Now we need to fill in the back as quickly as possible.

Let's see. We are down Poly to China and up Mysticism to Greece. It almost looks like China is the top dog of the two civs now; completely different than I would have guessed from my last turns.

The land around New York is still poorly done. It looks like the AI did the improvement, guys. Two tiles have been mined/irrigated but not roaded? That wastes a lot of worker-turns, and early on is when the worker-turns matter most.
Also, I think the forest chop has to be within the cultural borders of NY to add to the city. I'm going to cancel it and have the worker make NY a better place.

Change Boston to a Warrior; we need MPs. Atlanta gets switched to a warrior and Philly to an archer for the same reason. I dont' like building barracks in towns that have so little shield production, anyway.
Warrior from Atlanta moves north to MP a city. Science up to 70%. Hire scientists in Boston and New York; Philo is due in 7.

IBT-

China comes farther south.

1) 1225BC
Found Chicago. Production set to warrior.

IBT-

DC: Warrior->Settler

2) 1200BC
I can't imagine China attacking us this early. They must be after barbs. But Atlanta is in the way of them going after them, so we may be stuck with Chinese soldiers in our backyard for a while.

IBT-
No good! They declare!

Philly is captured and our settler inside is gone, too.

3) 1175BC
Serious trouble here. New York is switched to a barracks. Atlanta is switched back to a barracks.

Chicago is probably doomed. DC will complete it's current settler and then switch to a barracks as well.

All our spears are heading north. We need archers badly now.

IBT-
New York: Barracks->Archer

4) 1150BC
Build an embassy with Greece. Dang, we are close to an MA deal against China.
I think we better hold off til Philo comes in. Either way, we should be able to tempt Greece with that.

5) 1125BC
Nada

IBT-
DC: Settler->Barracks
Dang, just as soon as we get our settler factory going, now we need troops to storm China.

6) 1100BC
Quiet up around China. Not even Chicago sees trouble yet.

IBT-
Boston: Archer->Archer
Chops come through to rush Atlanta Barracks

7) 1075BC
Our warrior up north is watching a tremendous amount of barbs run past. Hopefully they head to China.

IBT-
Philo is ours, but no slingshot. I set research to math. I think we need some cats if we are going to pay China back.

8) 1050BC
Greece still wants an exorberant amount of gold for an Alliance. I'd consider giving them Philo for it, but they have Map Making now, so I pick that up instead.
Trade Greece Philo for Map Making + 23g (max value).

9) 1025BC
We found Seattle.

IBT-
Chicago is burned :thumbdown

Atlanta: Barracks->Archer

10) 1000BC
This has got to be the most depressing QSC I've ever submitted.

Okay, so we are definitely not out of this. Just hit a speed bump. China has taken a city, burned a city, and captured a settler (my bad, I should have played that one safer) but they have yet to show themselves over the mountains. I think now that Chicago is burned that will change.
Greece won't sign an MA against China unless we pay everything we have.

DC is currently running 10spt. I've got it on slow growth because I don't want to deal with happiness issues. It'd be nice to road the forest and road/mine the hill I have it working, but those are very low priority.
What we can also do with DC is put another settler out after the barracks comes up; this will time with growth to 7 and we can fit a city in E-2SE of DC. Not many other places to cram in cities, unless we want to go ICS.
What I would do is pump archers like crazy and when Math comes in grab some cats two. A couple spears for defense (not many, like 2 or 3) combined with a stack of archers and cats and we take China as far as we can. Sign up Greece if they ever lower their price enough.

In fact, I'd switch Seattle to a spearman. Use that as a pre-build for catapults when we get math.

AlanH said he thought this one would challenge all of our Civ skills. Looks like he wasn't kidding.

The Save

 

[joethreeblah]

We can probably take China anyway, without giving any of that territory to Greece.

I kind of like Joe - THE BLAH!