Shaitan & eyrei, the new Demo game mods!

[disorganizer]

or maybe a action log would be good. a thread only the mods can post in where for every mod-action they add a post with a copy of the request and what was done in it...?

 

[eyrei]

Originally posted by disorganizer
or maybe a action log would be good. a thread only the mods can post in where for every mod-action they add a post with a copy of the request and what was done in it...?

Hehe. But our job is to keep an eye on the citizens, not the other way around...

 

[disorganizer]

well, our hisorical merit is to also keep an eye on our mods ;-)
the problem is not keeping an eye on the citizens or the other way around, just that maybe sometime suspicion will take place as you are also both heavily involved in the game ;-)

 

[eyrei]

Originally posted by disorganizer
well, our hisorical merit is to also keep an eye on our mods ;-)
the problem is not keeping an eye on the citizens or the other way around, just that maybe sometime suspicion will take place as you are also both heavily involved in the game ;-)

If people become suspicious for whatever reason, they are free to do so. There is nothing anyone can do about that. You do have my word that I will not use my 'modly' powers to influence the game for my personal benefit.

 

[Shaitan]

You do have my word that I will not use my 'modly' powers to influence the game for my personal benefit.

You have mine as well. If it becomes aparent that the citizenry cannot function with me playing as a citizen then we can deal with it when it comes up. It hasn't been a problem in other Demo games for the mods to be involved with the game.

 

[Almightyjosh]

It's great you're a mod Shaitan, there's no-one we would trust more. Can help but notice you're being pretty trigger happy with the edit function. This is not a critisism, it's good to see! Keep up that moding!

 

[disorganizer]

Im also happy to see him as mod (btw), but im worried about maybe some other citizens will be concerned or dont post because they are afraid to counter them.

well, maybe we should put this in a citizen poll?!?
i mean, none saying "constitutional amendment", but for now only a info-poll on how comfortable people feel with a mod being
a) a player in the demogame
b) a deputy or other normal function in the demogame
c) a leader or governor in the demogame
d) the president in the demogame
e) none of the above

maybe this would fit as multiple choice poll...
like "state with which situation you would be comfortable and free to express yourself in the game, when the mod is..."

 

[Almightyjosh]

A better poll would be:
What do you think is the appropriate level of involvement in the demogame for moderators Shaitan and eyrei?
A: No involvement
B: Citizens only
C: Non-game effectual position (e.g. Mayor or census officer)
D: Depudy or Chat Rep
E: Leader of Department or Senator
F: Any position, including President

E & F would require a constitutional amendment.
I only support the running of this poll because I know the support and trust given to these two players by most people.

Interestingly, as the options are incrementally greater not mutually exclusive, for the Mods to be excluded entirely, A would have to outweigh B+C+D+E+F. If they were to be excluded from non-game positions, A+B would have to outweigh C+D+E+F.

If anyone understands what I mean by this, please let me know. I know it sound strange, but it makes sense!!

 

[Shaitan]

I understand what you're going for, Almightyjosh. Generally speaking, in a multi-choice poll you compare each option against the total number of voters.

 

[disorganizer]

but having it as multiple choice could show which area of jobs (like A-C, B-D) is more supported.

but you could also put this up as normal poll when saying "what is the maximum level of influence..."

 

[Almightyjosh]

NOOO, it's not multi-choice!! NOT MULTI-CHOICE I SAY!!!
You pick what you think is the appropriate (maximum) level, then you use the pattern I set out to determine citizen will. It is far less confusing for voters, if a little hard for us. I'm going to do a write up on how to write and analyse polls!

 

[eyrei]

If a poll is done, it should include three options, because they are the only ones available. These would be:

1. Citizens
2. Can run for Chief Justice
3. Abstain

We will not be holding leadership positions, except possibly Chief Justice, and I, at least, will not be moderating this forum if I am not allowed to participate. I guarantee you would not like the level of moderation you would get if we were expected to do nothing but moderate.

 

[Shaitan]

I agree, but I'm interested to see if there is widespread fear of mods being actively involved in the game. It certainly doesn't appear that way and I expect it would validate our involvement in the game against the minority who feel we (or at least I) should not be citizens.

 

[Eklektikos]

I would add a "just moderate without citizenship" option to that list since your unwillingness to do so, however understandable and reasonable, should not dictate the choices available. I'm pretty sure TF & DoM aren't forcing you to be moderators

EDIT - I know this pretty much reiterated shaitan's post above. I should learn to type faster

 

[Shaitan]

No, they're not forcing us to be moderators. However, we were selected in part because of our involvement in the game.

 

[eyrei]

Originally posted by Eklektikos
I would add a "just moderate without citizenship" option to that list since your unwillingness to do so, however understandable and reasonable, should not dictate the choices available. I'm pretty sure TF & DoM aren't forcing you to be moderators

EDIT - I know this pretty much reiterated shaitan's post above. I should learn to type faster

The problem is, I would have no intention of abiding by that result should it win. The only reason Duke was doing this is because he was tossed into it when Duck left and he felt some obligation. Moderating this forum will at times be a lot of work, and to expect us to do this while being unable to enjoy the fruits of that labor is absurd. For those of you who think people are afraid to debate moderators, I suggest you hang around the OT forum for awhile while we are in hiatus.

 

[Cyc]

Personally, I see no problem with these two Mods playing in the game. They are Mods, not Gods. We all know them (except maybe eyrei who disappeared for a while) and they are just players like us. Until now. Now they are players and Mods. A good amount of the citizens here can sense when they step over any lines that weren't supposed to be stepped over. I think there should be some kind of recourse for a normal citizen to take if they want to take on one of our esteemed Mods, tho.

I think it will raise the level of the game up a notch if we as a forum showed we not only played with, but welcomed our Mods. I say this knowing who the Mods are. I'm not so certain I would say this about all mods.

 

[Shaitan]

There is always someone to go to if you have a problem with a mod. In our case, you have other mods. Eyrei and I are here full time. Duke is still keeping his feet in. You can go to any of us if you feel someone is being unfair. You can also go to Thunderfall if you don't get satisfaction from one of the other mods.

 

[eyrei]

Originally posted by Cyc
Personally, I see no problem with these two Mods playing in the game. They are Mods, not Gods. We all know them (except maybe eyrei who disappeared for a while) and they are just players like us. Until now. Now they are players and Mods. A good amount of the citizens here can sense when they step over any lines that weren't supposed to be stepped over. I think there should be some kind of recourse for a normal citizen to take if they want to take on one of our esteemed Mods, tho.

I think it will raise the level of the game up a notch if we as a forum showed we not only played with, but welcomed our Mods. I say this knowing who the Mods are. I'm not so certain I would say this about all mods.

Yeah. I took a little vacation after I retired from government work. I definately needed it.

As far as recourse, that is usually handled in Site Feedback. Though, from what I have seen, a poster had better have a good reason for the complaint for it to be taken seriously. Believe me, as it should be, this forum is much more democratic than most of the others. For example, this discussion about whether or not Shaitan and I can be citizens (or participants) would not be taking place anywhere else. In general, it is good practice to PM the moderator you have an issue with, and see if you can get an explanation privately rather than making a spectacle of the issue.

We will not be closing threads unless they have completely degenerated into flame wars or a request from the appropriate official has been posted, and will not be banning anyone unless they persist in breaking forum rules. If one of us 'moderates' you in our colorful editing of your post with a warning, take the warning seriously, but do not think that we think any less of you for having to do that. Many times it will be an attempt to simply tone down a volatile thread before it becomes ugly. We are nto even placing blame. There have not been many threads like this in the history of this game, and I do not expect to have to post in red very often.

 

[Raven1er]

can i recommend someone?