Star Trek Mod for Civilization IV...Good Idea?

[Promenthus]

Are there any Python programmers out there who would like to help out with the mod? Specifically, I need drastic help with writing a map script (I do not know Python, period!) that will actually use the Star Trek Reborn terrain, rather than vanilla civ's.

 

[monkeyman90000]

just found this web site it has loads of star trek meshes really good 1's 2
/http://trekmeshes.ch/

 

[Communisto]

hows this going?? any news?

 

[Promenthus]

I wish I could say progress has been doing well. We're currently stuck on producing a working map script designed for the mod and unit animations are impossible without the SDK.

We are looking to recruit either a skilled Python programmer/map scripter or I am looking for someone to advise me or assist me in Python map scripting in real-time.

 

[Ranbir]

Yes, please someone with super python skills join!

*goes back to his corner of trekkie research*

 

[Vadus]

hi, maybe we can work together somehow. I'm also planning a space mod , (see sig. ) and currently working on a unit component builder like in SMAC

 

[Magma]

Well judging from your location comment, you're not from North America, so you still have a life =) Star Trek is an imagined universe (by Gene Roddenberry, in the 1960s) in which humanity has invented "warp drive", and is able to explore space at speeds faster than light. Star Trek spans five different series and several movies, and is extremely popular in North America and is beginning to gain popularity in Europe (if I'm not mistaken). Most of the series are pretty good because they actually relate to current issues and questions of morality and ethics, as well as technology, diplomacy, etc. Just go type up "Star Trek" on any search engine and you'll get one heck of a lot of information.

Sorry about my blatant insult.

Ah thanks, I may watch them if i get some time some other day. And it were my own fault to be so rude, not yours

 

[Promenthus]

@ Magma: Don't apologize, it's my fault for being ignorant to differences.

@ Vadus: I'd be glad to help you, but I believe the primary problem the game has with my map script idea is the fact that I am entirely eliminating the core concept of "water". The premise behind Star Trek Reborn is that there are two basic terrain types: space and deep space, both of which have the boolean <bWater> set to 0. Planets, stars, etc. are counted as terrain features. The main problem I have with Civilization 4 is how obnoxious it is...before you can make a scenario with your choosing of terrain (an easier process; the civ 3 system), you have to generate a map script that will generate a random map with it (the harder process; the civ 4 "unfriendly" system).

 

[Vadus]

@ Vadus: I'd be glad to help you, but I believe the primary problem the game has with my map script idea is the fact that I am entirely eliminating the core concept of "water". The premise behind Star Trek Reborn is that there are two basic terrain types: space and deep space, both of which have the boolean <bWater> set to 0. Planets, stars, etc. are counted as terrain features.

So bWater=0 means, that space is not water ? So all is land terrain then, and planets are "settlespots" for settlers ?

The main problem I have with Civilization 4 is how obnoxious it is...before you can make a scenario with your choosing of terrain (an easier process; the civ 3 system), you have to generate a map script that will generate a random map with it (the harder process; the civ 4 "unfriendly" system).

hm, what about building up the rules on a scenario map ?

 

[Promenthus]

Precisely, space is not counted as 'water' because I want starships to be the main units of the game (in the sense that they will be the ones conquering planets and defending them, rather than the "infantry" units we saw in the Civ 3 Star Trek mod).

You could say that space is a rough hybrid of ocean/snow; it is traversable by "land" units, can have improvements built on it, but it yields nothing on its own and cannot be settled. Planets, as terrain features (similar to having forests or jungles, but not in such tight clusters), would make a space tile colonizable and actually yield anything. The surrounding space tiles could then be "improved" with space stations, etc.

 

[Ranbir]

Yes, ships will defend. It's like they are defending from orbit. The planet improvements would then be orbital batteries, or planetary shield generators, etc.

 

[Vadus]

aha, makes sence for startrek, because they never had seen more than 5 infantry guys together on a planet

 

[Ranbir]

Something just pondered me.

What's the maximum move rate the ships will have? There did get to a point where warp speed only gradually increased, asymptoting to the Warp 10 factor.

So I figure we'd come to a point that all latest ships have a max movement speed? I think to keep a large scope, we should have it as 3-4. With a possible single upgrade that grants +1 movement. But nothing too drastic. This can help keep the galaxy having that big expansive factor, as well as making the wormholes even superest important than ever.

I figure Starbases/outposts will be like Forts, but if when SDK is released we can reinstitute Zone of Control, it would be real super.

 

[sharick]

I have an idea how you could implement the Borg but I don't know if it's possible without SDK. You can make them as a separate civilization that is not able to do it's own research but every time it kills (assimilates) other unit/planet it receives some research points possibly technology. In this way thier only chance would be to expand and wage war.

 

[Promenthus]

I personally think it's too early to be thinking about the Borg, they will be a later feature, most likely in only a specific scenario...

As for movement, it depends on the exact movement cost of deep space. Space tiles (and planets, asteroids, etc.) will cost 1 mp, and deep space will cost 3 - 5 mp, possibly more. Taking this into consideration, I'd imagine that the maximum movement for starships would be about 10 - 20. Starbases/outposts probably will not be tile improvements in the strictest sense. Because you cannot attach effects such as extended "sight" range to tile improvements, or attack/defense, I am planning on making starbases/sensor outposts, etc. immobile units that are not constructed in cities, but rather aboard "constructor" ships, if possible. That way we can have sensor outposts with ridiculous sight range and stealth detection, or starbases with heavy phasers and the "Starbase Repair" promotion so that starships "docked there" will heal more quickly, even behind enemy lines or in deep space.

 

[Ranbir]

How are we going to deal with borders and the crazy expansion from culture?

I really hope you disable border expansion from culture. It shifts political borders around like wack jack. Culture should not define political ownership.

It'd be real nice if outposts and starbases could emit the extension of borders. Like SMAC.

 

[Promenthus]

I miss SMAC too... =)

I seriously doubt that we could actually engineer that kind of cultural "assistance", even with the SDK (considering we have no true, bona-fide programmers on the team). However, to ultimately prevent over-cultural expansionism, the different cultural development levels will be mathematically regulated, so that maybe you get a ton of cultural expansions earlier on, but as you gain more and more culture, the levels of cultural expansion (such as Weak, Developing, Legendary) will be exponentially harder to achieve. I also would not mind trying to engineer a way of using treaties in diplomacy to define borders, but again, I seriously doubt we'll be able to do that with our current "staff".

 

[Ranbir]

Maybe cap off how far culture can advance. The first is to complete the planet's range of collecting resources. 2 squares, that's pretty much.

Maybe, no more than 4 spaces extension?

 

[Promenthus]

Possibly, but then you have to keep in mind that players need to have at least some control of "deep space", ESPECIALLY between their colonies in different star systems. Needless to say, it will require some creative thinking, but yes, there will be a cap, albeit not a small one =p

 

[Ranbir]

Best to actually leave most of deep space NOT in anyone's territory. This is space after all. It'd be kinda silly to have half the map under all one colour.

Star Trek was about discovery and exploration. I'd much prefer deep space explored by ships, and not become visible through cultural border expansion. This way, they'll stay in that fog of war too, as it should be. Since, you know...it's DEEP space.