Team Organization and Ethos

[2metraninja]

I know a bit about civplayers, Apolyton and WPC, as I have been playing with them for some time.

 

[YossarianLives]

Would there be interest in gathering intel on other teams rosters, to try to predict how they might approach the game? I'm not the person to do that necessarily, so not volunteering.

The only other team I know anything about is rb. I've been lurking their games for awhile, so I think I have a decent idea about some of their players' approach to the game. Lord Parkin is no stranger to cfc, so you know he is a force to be reckoned with. He dominated his first game on realms beyond, and is on his way to running away with another pitboss there. I'm actually a little surprised he is their captain, though, as he gets tons of crap from other players and lurkers of his games. He is great at mm and diplomacy. Sulla is another heavyweight, but I'm not sure how involved he will be in this game. Sevenspirits and Mackoti are two top players who have demonstrated in several games just how powerful the 'mids can be. Of course, team rb will be following demographics very closely, and we should assume they will have a very good idea of the other teams' unit composition and techs. They also seem to agree that the Great Lighthouse is overpowered, even on maps that feature few coastal or island cities. Having said all this, I doubt that they will settle on any strategy before seeing the map, learning who their neighbors are, etc. Also, they will certainly view themselves as the team to beat, and will probably assume other teams feel the same way, so I wouldn't be surprised if they go into the game expecting to get dog piled.

 

[Bowsling]

I have been lurking around on Civfr for a little while. Unfortunately, the private forums for their previous MTDG (which has been over for two years) are still protected.

 

[Sommerswerd]

Yea CDZ forum (on CDZ site) from BTS MTDG II is still locked .

 

[Aivoturso]

Let's not underestimate Team Civforum.de either. They would like to play game on Immortal - Deity level on Toroidal world wrap. I don't think they are bluffing either so in pure skill level they might be one of our strongest opponents. They also have the second largest team roster so far second only to RB (not sure if it is a strenght or weakness though).

 

[2metraninja]

Yeah, if it is German, it must be good. Do not underestimate them, despite we dont know any of them by name. I am sure we will learn many way before MTDG3 is finished.

 

[Caledorn]

Germans are usually very fond of strategy games, so we should indeed be wary of them. Most of my favorite strategy games come from German publishers, and some of them were even exclusively launched in German so I had to get a basic understanding of German to play them.. (Yes, I am that fond of good strategy games.. hehe)

Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2

 

[Aivoturso]

Germans are usually very fond of strategy games, so we should indeed be wary of them.

My thoughts exactly Germans also tend to be quite good at organizing, which is also an important asset in a demogame.

 

[Bowsling]

I would encourage people to join the CivIII ISDG - there are two CivFanatics teams vs. two Civforum teams. Gives some good insight on their playstyle.

 

[2metraninja]

What about organizing online volley of simultaneous- turns Civ4 between our members with the most probably settings to test how each thing works? Say in the weekend?

 

[Bowsling]

I'll try and draft a formal constitution later this week.

I'm thinking an extensive use of Google Documents would be a great way to keep organized - diplomatic records, turn archives, demographic spreadsheets, etc.

 

[tobiasn]

Hi guys. I'm new. I wrote an introduction. It was long. Down to business

This:

I'd like to propose a new principle to team ethos: Keep things neat.

and this:

I'm thinking an extensive use of Google Documents would be a great way to keep organized - diplomatic records, turn archives, demographic spreadsheets, etc.

are excellent ideas. Let's leverage the free tools we have at hand to be neat and organized and lean, in a way.

I have no experience at MTDGs, so correct me when I'm wrong. But we have a long haul ahead, and it's gonna be a lot of nitty gritty stuff, and a lot of tasks that need to be completed. While a forum is great for chat and discussion, it sucks big time at task delegation.

I propose that we use a dead simple todolist/issue tracker system. Asana is free (for teams up to 30 ppl), sends you email reminders, and whoever can assign tasks to whomever. Dedicate that space to just to-do/task management, and that should de-clutter the forum quite a bit.

It does however require people to actually sign up in person, shared account makes no sense. Sounds cool? I'll set it up and invite you to the team.

I'm all ears for suggestions on other tools to use, as long as they're simple, free and support task delegation.

 

[Aivoturso]

I am not so sure if extensive use of Google Docs is the way to go. I'd like all the important stuff be visible in the forum. Having stuff in two or more places makes things a bit more cumbersome. However, that bit can be crucial in keeping people engaged. Especially using a system that requires user authentication such as Google Docs or Drop Box sets an unnecessary barrier for the people who don't have an account yet.

There is nothing wrong in storing bulk of the data in different place, though. This actually gave me an idea. Civfanatics supports hot linking to images and stuff, right? Using external database we could in theory have automatically updating turn log that displays screenshots from last ten turns or so. Or we could create an automatically updating Demographics analysis chart. All that would be required from turn loggers would be saving the data to the database. The catch is that to implement this we'd need to have a web developer in our midst (at least experienced hobbyist). I confess to being program developer, but I have very limited experience on web stuff.

 

[tobiasn]

I am not so sure if extensive use of Google Docs is the way to go. I'd like all the important stuff be visible in the forum. Having stuff in two or more places makes things a bit more cumbersome. However, that bit can be crucial in keeping people engaged. Especially using a system that requires user authentication such as Google Docs or Drop Box sets an unnecessary barrier for the people who don't have an account yet.

This is true, and a very common problem in all project/team management really. I've lurked a fair bit in the old MTDG private forums, and the system with pinned dedicated threads with frequent updated first posts might serve as a good alternative to GDocs for instance.

From experience, though, we can assume the following:
- Most people have Google accounts, and thus entry level for that kinda thing is low
- When documents are collaborative, they get updated often and are more accurate.

That kind of shared "neat" info centre can be hard to accomplish in a forum, unless of course you have someone dedicated to the task that will remain active all the time.

This is partly my rationale behind suggesting Asana - it supports google accounts, it's collaborative in a real sense, as well as serving just one purpose that forums kinda suck at.

On a side note, if using 5 mins installing dropbox means 5 mins less work every turn uploading screenies, it's a no-brainer personal MM move

The catch is that to implement this we'd need to have a web developer in our midst (at least experienced hobbyist). I confess to being program developer, but I have very limited experience on web stuff.

I'm adept at this. I've worked as a webdev, ran my own dev company and now run a dev team in an interactive department. I don't code as much as I used to, but I can hack together something for us to make our lives easier.

I do however need you guys to give me input on what we need (a need-spec, basically).

 

[Sommerswerd]

Remember when you upload images from your computer instead of from a URL there is a small capacity storage box tied to your CFC account that gets used up. Once you have uploaded a few images from your computer, you cant do it anymore because of the space issues. At least that's how I remember it. If it still works that way, Drop box will count as an upload from your computer and use up your upload space quickly.

 

[Bowsling]

With Google Docs, I meant using the team google account, diplo.civfanatics@gmail.com. That way, documents are easily accessible by the other team.

Of course, we can have stuff on the forum, too. Using Google Docs just makes it much easier to find things.

 

[tobiasn]

If it still works that way, Drop box will count as an upload from your computer and use up your upload space quickly.

Well.. no. DropBox is an app that runs on your computer and your "folders" (kinda..simplistically speaking) and syncs files you put there automatically to others that share that folder, and to the web (privately or publicly).

So you bypass the cumbersome image upload at CFC, and it won't affect your ratio here cause nothing's hosted here.

A good workflow could be like this:

1: Team members A, B, C are turnplayers or in charge of screenshots. They have DropBox installed. Whenever they take screenshots, they put them in their DropBox folder, make a new sub-folder for each turn.

2: Any other team member with DropBox installed will get access to the screenshots instantaneously.

3: A secure web app that we/I hack together reads the dropbox update, and puts the screenies on web for those that don't have/don't want dropbox installed

4: Turnplayer/Minister of Screenshots updates turn log on the forum, hotlinks (with normal [IMG] tag) the most important screenies and links to external web app for the rest.

Might take a few hours to set up the web app, installing Dropbox is free, and should be free for the duration of the game as long as people don't save HD PNGs.

But: No manual image uploading required what so ever. Just save the file in the appropriate directory, and hey presto.

With Google Docs, I meant using the team google account, diplo.civfanatics@gmail.com. That way, documents are easily accessible by the other team.

If meant for sharing documents with other teams, this makes perfect sense. To use internally, people should probably use their own google accounts -- if not, change tracking gets kinda impossible.

 

[Sommerswerd]

OK I get it. I actually already have/use dropbox

 

[tobiasn]

OK I get it. I actually already have/use dropbox

Ah cool

But yeah, let me know what micro management stuff was a chore last game, and I'll see if I can set something up.

Both auto screenshots upload and demographics tracking sounds useful and fun, and should be easy enough to code.

 

[2metraninja]

I already use Google documents for keeping records in one game where we play team with Sommers. I dont think he visits it soon enough though But it is nice tool for sure. Spreadsheets can be very very helpful in organizing things. Then if needed, we can copy/paste parts in the forum or post screenshots showing important fields/data.

Dropbox is cool idea, which needs more attention and to make it actually works., I hate the way attachments are attached in forums and it is major pain to me making turn reports and showing things for discussion this way. Even Imageshak and Picvalley and other image hosting sites are not much better. If we can use Dropbox as file storage and then link pics in the forum to there, it could be just great.

Another cool tool I think we may use is Tinychat. This is free chat, where those interested in actually chatting strategy, battle plans, etc, can interact the best possible way - way better than posting/replying and waiting in a forum. Then after the discussion, the chat log can be posted in the "Strategy discussion" or whatever appropriate section of the forum it belongs to the other members to read/follow/comment. To my experience nothing can compare to chatting live and brainstorming strategies about civ. What you think?