Pvblivs
Scriptor
You could place 2 or 3 Barbarian cities in the Shkodra region giving them some ships for piracy 
The Ancient Mediterranean MOD
- Thread starter thamis
- Start date
The Bactrians could be good since that is where Zoroastrianism originated, but they city list might be difficult to do. I only know of a few cities: Bactria, Sogdia, and the one Alexander found Alexandria Eschatê. I could do some research to see if I can find some more.
Pvblivs
Scriptor
thamis said:
I have to disagree with this.
This has "just" been a dynastic change in the history of Media and Persia. They might have been different people but this one change in who dominates whome doesn't legitimate a whole new civilization.
This is the same odd discussion as with Mycaene, Sparta and Makedon. Of course you can consider those regional centers of power as single powers in a rather global scenario. Or you just accept that the outcome of this what you discuss is "Hellene", the idea of a united Greek culture fitting is one civilization. If you're consequent there's no place for Medes in TAM.
I agree that in favour of Carthage Phoenicia should be removed. There was no Phoenicia anymore when Carthage grew to importance. And Phoenicia never was so important as Carthage was.
Ingvina Freyr
wants a Steamfree option
Regarding the ongoing debate concerning maps and civs: I think the priority should be to include the civs that haven't yet been included. New maps with "old" civs are good but new maps with "new" civs are even better. More change, more options means more fun. 
Gladi
The ignored thread killer
Pvblivs said:
Bright day
Actually they are both aryan. And last great Median king Astyages was grandfather of Cyrus II the Great.
Ingvina Freyr
wants a Steamfree option
What's the opposite of hard feelings? Soft feelings?Ankenaton said:No hard feelings mate? Appreciate the effort
Actually, I don't know who made the first images, but they are good and could be used for other civs instead. Suggestions that lead to an increased (and accurate) "ancient-era-atmosphere" are always welcome, so keep'em coming.
Gladi
The ignored thread killer
thamis said:Here it is! The huge map!!! After about 20 posts simply moaning about the lack of a bigger map, it is complete! It finally features Nubia, Persia, Media, and the Britons as playable civilizations. The Goths and the Illyrians have a space here, but the civ limit is reached, unless someone can tell me how to include more than 18 civs.
I've also fixed the turn limit bug (I hope) in the other maps. I've packed them all together into the map pack that's going to come with version 1.93.
Downloat the mappack here!
Yay!
Hmm, now to find something new to moan about...
Gladi
The ignored thread killer
Gladi said:
Talk about foot in the mouth.
Playing Fertile Crescent
rolleyes, very nice map, except for two things- Too much desert in North Africa, I was under impression that there was less desert those days and nowadays there are still several cities there. second/ again few more civs would not hurt, even if they were just quickies with no UUs if it could be done. Maybe Assyrians, Sumers and Phrygians? (some Lybians would be nice but alas they did not have had many cities...maybe Numidia?)They seem to be strong also in arabian peninsula. The biggest stack i saw came from south of babylonian lands.thamis said:
About Median in the map : the asian part of the map is very large. If there is only 1 civ coming from there (Persian), they would have in one hand an incredible free space to develop, but in another hand they would be their struggle against the barbs would be very painful (it is yet, but it should be worse).
@shqype : i'm not using translation software/website, i must apologize, it was 4.00 in the morning when i posted.
Maybe a silly question to those who are so well versed in ancient history but...to which of these civ's would you attribute Attila the Hun? Were the Mongol Hordes a serious threat to Europe and Asia Minor by the end of this Mod? Part of the fun I get from TAM is not can I recreate history but a more of a "what if". Concidering the time span involved I think it's fair to represent some of those civ's that came to power late for play balance. The challange being to "make hay while the sun shines". If you play a truley ancient civ like Egypt better try to expand with your chariots while you can and then hang on for dear life. If playing Rome you better conquer the Germanic tribes with your legions before there are Goth, Visagoth and Vandal swordsman at your gates. I would like to see better UU's for the "barbarian" civs since in the end, or at least 550AD, they were the winners. Concider this my 1.5 cents input on the Mede V.S. Persian question. I don't see much debate about including the Etruscians instead of the Romans.
Gladi
The ignored thread killer
davbenbak said:
Huns. Scythians are better for purpose of this mod... though weren't there incursion of Blue Huns in the east?
And we are already representing "latter" civs, Carthage for example was founded only roughly in 841 BCE.
Pvblivs
Scriptor
Gladi said:
Like Rome a hundred years later. The Gauls migrated not before 700 BC into the Roman known Gaul but came more from a region near Greece, some scientists believe.
You see that Carthage may be young but there are more examples in TAM that are even younger.
The whole north and west of Europe is rather very modern in terms of TAM.
thamis
King of Kish
- Joined
- Jan 21, 2002
- Messages
- 1,583
davbenbak said:
Here's the tutorial on how to design maps for mods without the WorldBuilder mess:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=4237906#post4237906
Ingvina Freyr
wants a Steamfree option
Here are a two suggestions for Nubia/Kush flag decal. I guess (and hope) the Egyptologists and Nubiologists wants to have their saying in this too.
"Land of the Bow" and "Nubian Bowman"
"Land of the Bow" and "Nubian Bowman"
Seidrik_The_Gray
Seidrik The Gray
- Joined
- Jun 26, 2006
- Messages
- 1,160
I see no reason why Phoenecia and Carthage cannot coexist. It is true that Carthage arose from the end times of the Phoenecia empire, however, TAM, at least IMHO, isn't supposed to be very near to accurate, but close enough so as to give a good feeling for what the time was like.
If you wanted to be 100% accurate, then you wouldn't have Rome, you'd have Arians, and other ancient tribes in the Italian penninsula. You wouldn't have Iberians, Gauls or Germanic or Gaetians/Dacians for that matter, you'd have one civ that started in Northern Greece/South Eastern Thrace. You would have Illyria, you would have Macedonia, but, as Pvblis says, you'd also have half a dozen other tribes in the region of the Greek Isles. In Asia Minor, you wouldn't have Hittites or Kolchis or Scythians. Again, you'd have one people...call them the Steppe people or Huns if you will, and put them just NE of the Caucusses. Further South, you would have Babylon, Ashur, Sumer, and a tribe to the East that would eventually rise to power.
In the Western tip of Asia Minor, you would have the Lidians possibly, but I seem to recall an earlier regional power there???
You would have the Minoans of Crete. You would have the Phoenicians. You would have the Egyptians, Carthage, Nubians, and the pre-cursur tribe (more civilized) to the Zulu, who had an empire around the time of the Egyptians, but in SE Africa, that vanished mysteriously. I also recal a central Saharan empire, prior to the desertification of the region.
How far back do you want to go?
I would be in favor of consolidating Iberians, Guals, and Germanic into the Goths. I would also be in favor of keeping the Gaetians (who were more ancient Greek than barbaric), keeping Rome, but adding the Arians in northern Italy. I would also be in favor of consolidating the Kolchis, Hittites and Scythians into something called the Steppe People/Huns. I would also like to see the cities of Ashur, Babylon, and Sumer. and Thebes firmly constituted at turn 0 (i.e. placed on map already), and give each of these civs a warrior and a worker. These were the first civilizations (early powers) after all.
Could be nice to script in the arrival of new civs...not sure how you'd do that...
I swear I saw a mod for 36 civs...I think it was Rhys Earth mod or someone's mod of Rhys' Earth mod???
If you wanted to be 100% accurate, then you wouldn't have Rome, you'd have Arians, and other ancient tribes in the Italian penninsula. You wouldn't have Iberians, Gauls or Germanic or Gaetians/Dacians for that matter, you'd have one civ that started in Northern Greece/South Eastern Thrace. You would have Illyria, you would have Macedonia, but, as Pvblis says, you'd also have half a dozen other tribes in the region of the Greek Isles. In Asia Minor, you wouldn't have Hittites or Kolchis or Scythians. Again, you'd have one people...call them the Steppe people or Huns if you will, and put them just NE of the Caucusses. Further South, you would have Babylon, Ashur, Sumer, and a tribe to the East that would eventually rise to power.
In the Western tip of Asia Minor, you would have the Lidians possibly, but I seem to recall an earlier regional power there???
You would have the Minoans of Crete. You would have the Phoenicians. You would have the Egyptians, Carthage, Nubians, and the pre-cursur tribe (more civilized) to the Zulu, who had an empire around the time of the Egyptians, but in SE Africa, that vanished mysteriously. I also recal a central Saharan empire, prior to the desertification of the region.
How far back do you want to go?
I would be in favor of consolidating Iberians, Guals, and Germanic into the Goths. I would also be in favor of keeping the Gaetians (who were more ancient Greek than barbaric), keeping Rome, but adding the Arians in northern Italy. I would also be in favor of consolidating the Kolchis, Hittites and Scythians into something called the Steppe People/Huns. I would also like to see the cities of Ashur, Babylon, and Sumer. and Thebes firmly constituted at turn 0 (i.e. placed on map already), and give each of these civs a warrior and a worker. These were the first civilizations (early powers) after all.
Could be nice to script in the arrival of new civs...not sure how you'd do that...
I swear I saw a mod for 36 civs...I think it was Rhys Earth mod or someone's mod of Rhys' Earth mod???
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