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The Deity Challenge Lineup - Game #8 - Mongolia

Discussion in 'Civ5 - Strategy & Tips' started by DingleBirdy, Sep 25, 2014.

  1. t10000

    t10000 Chieftain

    Joined:
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    32
    Turn 143 Domination victory

    Spoiler :

    Finally managed to find the time to finish the game after nearly two weeks absence.
    I picked up the game from turn 79 where Montys Cap just fell into my hands. I quickly proceed to bring back my chariot archers and make the war with the englishmen short as I want to continue to steamroll the world with my soon researched Keshiks. However not having played the session for so long hurt my initial plans as I quickly i picked up the game again fell for the temptation of joining attilas crusade against poland. Which I only later realised lead me to split my force into two and slow me down quite significantly.

    I get my Keshiks on turn 99 and upgrade like 13 chariot archers instantly. However as Inca decide to declare war on me the same turn I have to fight through a massive hoard of units. The progress at the eastern front is at this point also haltered by the fact that he has GW and the terrain is mostly jungle and hills. Even though slow, progress is made and I also a couple of turn after my Keshiks get the extra XP policy and after that it dont take long before the logistics promotions starts coming.

    However the western front is also a bit messier than I initially thought. Poland and the huns don't seem to have wasted much troops at all and Attila also very soon makes peace with Poland. (Calling out a succesful AI-bribe here). Forcing me to settle only for a satellite city before making peace, without any path open to Lissabon as I intended to create.

    On the eastern front I slowly realise the GW is a huge defence mechanic and realise why I didnt wanted to split my forces in the first place. In order to adjust I decide to march most of my army across the dessert between Inca and the huns and attack Attila from two directions. The plan is then to bring the entire army back to Cusco as I think some extra promotions and rotation of units should be enough to take Cusco down. At this point I feel I falling a bit behind the pace of a fast domination victory (which was my goal when I saw the Mongols was the selected civ)

    However the move for the huns works out well and even though having alot of units (his rams are completly useless in defence though) he is not capable of using his units properly when being attack from two directions. Attilas Cap fall in 3 turns and more or less his entire army are wiped out in 2 more. With a more decent sized and well promoted army of keshiks I acutally have enough firepower to take on Cusco.

    However my arrogance of Greece being satisfied with their peaceful is turned against me when Alex declares war on me. I still have a few keshiks around not being part of the crusade against Atilla. Earning XP and keeping some of the incan army busy in the east part of his empire while slowly grinding down a path towards Athens. Maybe it was this little path that was not to his liking (qualified guess). At this point I have no intention of breaking the siege of Cusco nor go west with my entire army just for Athens. However instead I decide that my freshly built Keshiks can help out there instead of trying to catch up with the siege of Cusco, which is kinda far away anyway. I acutally spamming units at a rate I starting to running out of horses and decides pikemens can help out as meathsields against the greece units. All the while a few Keshiks grind him down. Nothing else than happiness building, units and a few gold building have been built since turn 99 where i got chivalry, allowing my a bit greedy play of too many simultaneously executed wars. Greece is going to be a slow grind, however a succesful slow grind as his Capital fall before my main force reach Lissabon.

    Cusco fall to the drums of Keshiks and triple Khan army. At this point quite a few of my Keshiks have both logistics and range, a few got march too. The poor CS close to this desert must be wondering what is happening with the entire Mongol army once again making the journey across. This time aiming for Poland and siege of Warsaw through the former hunnic cities. Even though Keshiks are fast quite a few turns extra are actually spent on just moving back and forth here. As Poland looks a bit scary with what seems to be newly promoted rifleman. Another few turns and a reassurance that I mean no trouble has to be made, which I have to break(in my defence I dont think he knows what is best for him). With this setup, even though a few riflemen, his army is obliterated and cities on the way to Warsaw taken just and swift. It is not before I run into the terrain just east of Warsaw that progress is slowed down. After a few turns of careful bombarding, Warsaw and remaining defenders are taking a beating but no real progress is being made.

    At this point I decide that my army is big enough to just rush in, even though putting myself into the line of fire with my Keshiks, I am allowing more of them to get shots of, and at Warsaw itself. It only then takes 2 turns for Warsaw to fall and even though it cost me my only Keshik loss of the game I realise that I being overly cautious with the size of my army. With only 2 more Polish cities and Portugal to go and still 15+ Keshiks in my main force I really have more troops than I can position into useful tiles.

    At this point of the game my slow grind at the eastern front has given me success with Greece. Even though it cost me the second military casualty of the game (a pikemen) Athens is mine. With that in mind my main force push for Lisbon in an attempt to claim a domination victory. A polish cities fall next turn to create a path forward to Lisbon. Another turn is used for setting up my units at the Portuguese border. Braga falls the same turn as the liberation attempt is initiated and with my Keshiks swarming in and a Khan constructing a citadel any support from Porto is cut off. I managed to take Lisbon the turn after to claim a turn 143 domination victory.

    In the end I'm fairly satisfied. I at least feel I got close to finish a fast paced domination game. However I feel that with less greedy play, (not splitting your army and focus on steamrolling civs one at a time) and the confidence and knowledge when to push hard (despite casualties) for the victory. I feel at least 15-20 turns, with my level of micromanagement and warfare, can be shaved of any eventual finish time.

    Spoiler :
     
  2. InaneObserver

    InaneObserver Warlord

    Joined:
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    Norway
    T247 Dom victory

    Spoiler :
    I don't usually play domination, and it shows:) The plan was to do a keshik rush as fast as possible, but a MASSIVE runaway Poland made that difficult. After he wiped out Portugal and settled about 5 new cities, I realised I had to attack sooner rather than later. DoW at around turn 140, and what followed was a ridiculous punching match that lasted over 70 turns. The only way to land a few pot shots at his cities was after wiping out the 3-6 new units that flooded in every turn.

    Another lesson learned: Don't leave Alex alone for too long. Since I was in a rush to get to Poland, I didn't take the time to wipe out Alex. He proceeded to ally a bunch of city states and (probably) convince Liz and Monty to attack. Having to defend on 5 fronts, including a totally surrounded Athens, was mucho annoying. But, all in all a fun game! Thanks Dingle.

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  3. InaneObserver

    InaneObserver Warlord

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    Nice one T10000
     
  4. Shark Diver

    Shark Diver King

    Joined:
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    896
    Location:
    San Diego (for now)
    As I mentioned, since I finally figured out how to load these challenge games, I'm going back and playing each one in reverse order.

    Through t85

    Spoiler :

    -Very nice starting location. I settled on t2 on the hill and send warrior North.

    -Researched AH to locate horsies. Warrior steps on hut and becomes a spearman and meets Monty. Normally, knowing Monty is that close would change my early game plans a bit. Instead, the first thought in my head is how many XP his early rush is going to give me.

    -Spearman then turns East, finds CS, Finds England (wow, close neighbors), steals worker, then goes home to guard said worker and hide behind hill in case Lizzy exposes another worker.

    -BO was Scout > Scout > Shrine (I saw the Salt to the South and figured Earth Momma would be nice) >Settler > Settler > Granary >Library

    -1st Scout goes South, finds Salt, steps on hut for Pottery then travels South then West.

    -2nd Scout goes North around Monty and hits goodie hut bonanza in the rocky foothills (2 religious huts so I got Earth Momma)

    -Social Policies were Tradition Opener > Legalism > Honor Opener > Warrior Code

    -Tech order was AH > Pottery (hut) > Trapping > Mining > Writing > Beeline Wheel > Beeline Chivalry.

    -Met all other civs. This appears to be a hostile land as Attila really wants me to DoW Poland with him. I oblige, make white peace, then Attila asks me to do so again.

    -I got 4th religion and took Tithe and Holy Warriors.

    -Around turn 75 I see Lizzy and Monty marshaling forces towards my borders. Oh no you twit and runt (respectively), I've seen this movie before. I've only got 2 CA's built with 2 more about 3-4 turns away, so I very cheaply bribe Alex to DoW Lizzy and Attila to DoW Monty. I think I spent a total of 5 GPT, 1 Salt, and 4 of my 12 horsies.

    Good thing, because about 8 turns later, Monty realizes that Attila can't even get to him and DoW's me. I'm ready at this point. I pop my GG and plant my spearman in the citadel and now the fun begins.

    Screen Shot 2014-10-14 at 10.33.02 AM.jpg


    Through t122

    Spoiler :

    Although Monty put up a much better fight that I expected, my CA's took out his army quite effectively. I lost ZERO units and he barely even got a shot off on the capital. Once the 2nd GG popped, my spearman in the citadel became a most effective meat shield.

    I almost took his Southernmost city with the CA counter-rush, but one turn before I was going to have his defense down to zero, he magically gained the ability to 1-shot my CA's (I was going for logistics upgrades across the board so had no shielding). I backed off and waited for Keshiks, which were 9 turns away.

    Researched chivalry, had about 570 gold, so upgraded 4 and the route was on. I've now got 3 with logistics and the other 3 will be there shortly.

    (Question: After Chivalry, I'm thinking of beelining Education and then beelining Artillery. Is this optimal or am I missing something?)

    Apparently, according to the ever-reliable intelligence, just about every civ except BFF Inca is secretly plotting against me. Sigh, I was just fighting a war of defense, why pick on me? (sarcasm intended). I'm thinking Lizzy is the obvious next target, then perhaps swing South to take out Alex, but those cute little Incas have really been nice and I do need a trading partner. Perhaps I can get Inca, who looks strong, to DoW Alex and I can mop up the West Coast first.

    CS quests? I haven't even bothered reading them. This is going to be all out war and I think I've got a decent enough infrastructure to get it done.

    NC? Well, I didn't research Philosophy until after Chivalry, so it will go around t128.

    One pet peeve: although I denied Lizzy's request for open borders 6 times, she somehow trained a settler to jump over my territory and settle on my SW flank. I was watching that settler every turn and one minute he's East of my borders, and the next turn he's West. I'm guessing this is a game glitch, and it will probably only cost me 2 turns to take that out, but it did keep me from settling my 4th city.

    Screen Shot 2014-10-15 at 9.49.38 AM.jpg


    t167

    Spoiler :

    I've wiped out Monty and Lizzy. When I took out Tenochitlan, everyone besides Incas and Portugal DoW'd me, which basically meant every CS DoW'd as well.

    I split my Keshiks into 2 forces. The mountain range which keeps everyone from coming at me is also slowing me down as I turn South, and I had to take out a few CS to advance. Poland has the largest army, looks like mostly musket men, so I'll try to take out their 2 Northern expos while waiting for Artilleries.

    I'll start building Oxford when Tenochitlan finishes its' University, and hopefully time that for Artillery. Will probably build a few muskets now, but I suspect that the Keshiks' dominance is soon to come to an end. I made peace with Attila, who promptly DoW'd Poland, which was so helpful I may spare him for last. Biggest decision is whether to go after my only "friend" the Incas, as they are in the way but my only trading partner. Trades are now down to 3GPT/luxury, so I wouldn't be losing much and he's got some yummy wonders.

    Screen Shot 2014-10-16 at 10.22.18 AM.jpg
    Screen Shot 2014-10-16 at 10.22.58 AM.jpg



    t205

    Spoiler :
    Well I timed Oxford perfectly for Artillery and started building them. Only problem is that Poland just took out 2 Musketmen with GWB's. I'm going to have to make peace with them, hopefully, and take out some Incan cities instead……hoping they don't beat me to flight too, as I'm a ways off. This is going to be a long, drawn-out fight
     
  5. consentient

    consentient Domination!

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    IMPORTANT NOTICE:

    Though this map is quite old, it can still be played, so if you play it and complete it, please send me a PM so I can update the finisher's spreadsheet.

    Thank you.
     
  6. Acken

    Acken Deity

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    Finished this one on turn 144
    Spoiler :


    All AI had cities with 35-40 strength from turn 100... that was quite surprising and slowed me down a lot.
     
  7. consentient

    consentient Domination!

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    I'm glad to see you're going back and filling the gaps in the back catalogue, Monsieur Acken! :)

    Congratulations on a great win!

    Which is better in your opinion? CKN or Keshik?
     
  8. Acken

    Acken Deity

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    Keshiks. Faster, can heal outside cities, can break the toughest cities without losing one, and the level faster getting logistics in no time anyway. If my opponent had been as weak as in the China LP I would have cut down 10 turns easily.
     
  9. consentient

    consentient Domination!

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    Is it just luck that determines how the opponents tech and build units, etc?

    By similar turn times in my play through I was facing harsher opposition in the China game :(
     
  10. Shark Diver

    Shark Diver King

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  11. Acken

    Acken Deity

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    There's some randomness to it yes. Although they are more likely to make defense buildings if they are at war for example.
     
  12. stormtrooper412

    stormtrooper412 Peacemongering Turtlesaur

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    Hehs, I joined in the fun.

    Spoiler :

    I saw all of you going war on everybody. Instead, I went Tradition, picked up HG and starting to roll my science game..

    Nah, I mass built Chariots and picked everyone apart. However, I hit a brick wall as the Incas are absolutely surrounded by woods making my Keshiks useless. So I'll just have to restart this map to make it a bit better.

    I absolutely suck at war games, in fact I only picked up one token domination win on Settler when I first started playing this game, and I have had 0 domination wins since. This is gonna be the first if I don't give up :)
     
  13. Acken

    Acken Deity

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    Kill greece first and come from the east, easier terrain
     
  14. Shark Diver

    Shark Diver King

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    Well I need to get back and finish my version of this game, but I ran into similar terrain difficulties. I couldn't get through the
    Spoiler :
    Polish
    blockade and the Central route is, as described, a bit difficult terrain-wise.

    It's too late for me to do what Acken is suggesting…..but the suggestion did give me a thought…….very scary thought…..
     
  15. Acken

    Acken Deity

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    Sometimes GG bombing can help
     
  16. stormtrooper412

    stormtrooper412 Peacemongering Turtlesaur

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    Spoiler :

    Finally had a half decent game going but I think I'll have to optimize it.

    First 100 turns were absolutely flawless, I killed England and Aztecs and I think I'll have to further trim them both down just to be safe from any retaliation. The trick here is to immediately sell captured cities to the Huns, because he'll get the hate for razing everything, and his UA means cities burn down faster :) My strike team of super Keshiks on steroids made short work out of Portugal and I also razed one Polish city before hitting into massive forests forcing me to halt there for the time being. On the other side, Alex became super desperate and offered every city he had for a peace deal, which I accepted (and then sold to the Huns :D ) because Athens falls next and Alex is out of the hunt.

    I realized also that getting enough Keshiks with Logistics (Range is perfectly optional at this point) shows the true power of Mongolian Horde, and it means even if the city's defenses are in the 60s, you can just tear it up in 2-3 turns. I have no doubts that once I kill the Incas and the Huns, Poland will fall in a pincer attack. But it's unlikely that I'll play it out now, because I've been learning how to warmonger for 3 days, I had no sleep and I almost broke up with my girlfriend twice. Damn it Genghis, you're not worth it :D

     
  17. consentient

    consentient Domination!

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    We've all fallen foul of these problems over the years, I'm sure, but be careful dude! :)

    I'm impressed with your tenacity but yeah, good idea to take a cooler. :)
     
  18. stormtrooper412

    stormtrooper412 Peacemongering Turtlesaur

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    Spoiler :

    I have to get this done... I MUST get this done.

    Anyway, the Horde is rolling, Huns, Poland and Portugal left. They are all fighting each other, as were the Huns and Incas when I took them down. Hopefully this won't take longer than 20 more turns. I've been trying to pass the Cultural Heritage thing forever but I can never get enough votes, since most of the wonders are technically mine now :D

    Oh yeah, and whoever picked the opponents for this, absolutely nailed it, the war themes for all of these are absolutely amazing!

     
  19. consentient

    consentient Domination!

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    Q for everyone: How MANY Keshiks did you have when you won? In my play through, many moons ago, I built about 12. Is it enough?
     
  20. Acken

    Acken Deity

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    Total I probably had 20 or something. 2 armies of around 8 each and some here and there to chase off barbs or fight city states units.

    12 is what ? 2 armies of 6 ?. That's enough but sounds like bare minimum.
     

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