The Huns for BtS

[cool3a2]

Alright, this will be updated soon! In the attachments, you can find the two buildings from Geos mod that might work as the UBs new art. But The Capos building might still look more unique.
I successfully requested a citylist containing naes of tribes that were part of the hunnish confederation. I believe that might be the best solution, but we can discuss once the list is available here. 'Successful' means, that the user I asked said he'll set the list up. That was one week ago. Since then, I didn't get any message. Well, weekend only begins, I'll wait till tomorow and send him another message if necessary.

 

[cool3a2]

The user sent me the list:

The Hunnic confederacy included at one time or another Alans, Ostrogoths, Gepids, Sciri, Saurometai, Rugii, Thuringians, "Bastarnae", "Suebi", Taifali, Alamanni, Saxons, and Langobardi. Tribes that may have been associated with the Huns include the Bulgars [Onogur, Kutrigur], the Antes, and the 'Sklaveniai'.

As capital city I'd use Tápiószentmárton because of the palace. Do you guys think that would give a better citylist?

BTW: What's actually correct, hunnic or hunnish?

 

[AbsintheRed]

I would use Hunnic.
And I don't really like to use well-known tribes as Ostrogoths, Gepids, Saxons, Langobards or Saurometai as cities :S
Some of the smaller ones sounds good (Bastarnae, Suebi, Taifali, Onogur, Kutrigur, Antes, Sklaveniai), but this is very few, so this is not the best solution either...

 

[cool3a2]

Who were the Saurometai?

 

[AbsintheRed]

I guess they are not that well-known, the name was very familiar to me though.
Maybe from RTW or something similar...

 

[cool3a2]

Well, I may search for more names like that as I thing that the concept is good. But I'm a busy person ATM, so it could take me while. If you want to, your help would be welcome, Absinthe.

 

[The Capo]

Who were the Saurometai?

They were an Iranic-European tribe that was related to (and conquered by) the Scythians.

 

[cool3a2]

Interesting... Thanks for the info. What do you guys actually think about the UB? Which art should I use? If The Capos, then I'd need the nif...

 

[Nitram15]

The upper posted one is good, I think.

 

[AbsintheRed]

Well, I may search for more names like that as I thing that the concept is good. But I'm a busy person ATM, so it could take me while. If you want to, your help would be welcome, Absinthe.

Of course, I will try to help you with that
Maybe we can mix with some of the tribe names with the tribal leader names, and of course some of the most important cities they conquered...
Tápiószentmárton and Szeged is a must have for example

 

[cool3a2]

I don't know about Szeged, because it collides with the hungarian citylist. AFAIK the game takes care that there is always only one city with a certain name, thus Hungary would probably loose Szeged if the Huns are also in the game. So this is more a cosmetic problem.

We have still only one opinion about the UB (from nitram). I personally vote for The Capos building as the other two I've posted earlier don't really solve the initial problem: that the UB looks too similar like other buildings already in use. In this case it would be the granary. But I do what you want me to.

 

[AbsintheRed]

I like Capo's building, but have to check the bonuses.
Maybe it was a barrack with bonus xp to mounted?

Btw, we can always use Szeged's latin name for the huns.
Or another language if you don't like latin

 

[cool3a2]

The current UB adds a bonus for mounted units. Can't remember that I would have changed the stats and I don't want to actually. This is just about the art.

We might use Szeged as is, too. No prob. I've searched for its turkish name, but without success.

 

[AbsintheRed]

If the stats are the same as on the OP, then I think a little change would be good.
Currently +1 xp for mounted and +2 culture.
I suppose the culture represents the hunnic "riding culture", but probably its too much for that, and only 1 xp is a little few. I think it's point is to not necessarly build stables early, you already get that needed xp for the second promotion from barracks.
So it would be better to give +1 culture and +2 xp for mounted...

 

[AbsintheRed]

Here is the hungarian wiki article regarding Szeged's name:

Szeged (szlovákul Segedín, németül Szegedin, horvátul Segedin, szerbül Сегедин, latinul Partiscum, románul Seghedin) megyei jogú város, Magyarország negyedik legnagyobb városa, a hét regionális központ egyike, a Dél-Alföld legnagyobb városa, Csongrád megye székhelye.



EDIT: I just found it in english too with more languages:

The name Szeged might come from an old Hungarian word for corner (szeg) because of the turn of the river Tisza there. Others say it derives from the Hungarian word sziget which means "island". Others still contend that szeg means "dark blond" (sötétszőkés) - a reference to the colour of the water where the rivers Tisza and Maros merge.[1]

The city has its own name in a number of foreign languages: in Bulgarian, Сегед; Croatian, Segedin; German, Szegedin / Segedin; Italian, Seghedino; Latin, Partiscum; Polish, Segedyn; Romanian, Seghedin; Serbian, Сегедин (Segedin); Slovak, Segedín; Turkish, Segedin

 

[cool3a2]

Thanks, Absinthe. There's the turkish name I may use. Also, I guess I'll change the UBs stats as you suggested. Still, which graphic would you like to see? Keep the current one, use one of the twos I posted recently or use The Capos?

 

[AbsintheRed]

Either The Capo's or the second one you posted above. I like them both

 

[cool3a2]

Alright, now that my Saxony mod is finished, next thing to do is the hun mod. The Capo told me where I could find the building he suggested. Ithink I'll use that one from the next version. The above twos might give some unique art - I'll see.

The most important thing is the citylist. I've done a search and found some information...

(This will be rather long, I guess.)

1. Wikipedia (huns):
"Supplementing their wealth by plundering and raising tribute from Roman cities to the south, the Huns maintained the loyalties of a number of tributary tribes including elements of the Gepids, Scirii, Rugians, Sarmatians, and Ostrogoths."

2. http://wapedia.mobi/de/Chasaren:
"Priskos schrieb, dass eine der Nationen der hunnischen Konföderation „Akatziroi“ genannt werde." which means "Priskos writes, that one of the nations of the hunnish confederation was called 'Akatziroi'."

3. http://www.kuiperguertel.de/Hunnen.html:
"Die ursprüngliche Volksbezeichnung der hunnischen Stämme war wohl einst ''Turuken'' oder ''Türüken''." which means "The original name of the hunnish people propably was Turuks or Türüks."

4. http://www.khangaitours.com/tours.php?tour_code=mongolia&menu_id=History&lang=de:
All this source mentions is, that the confederation consisted of 22 tribes. It doesn't mention names and it could be, that the text refers to the Xiongnu.

5. "Barbarische Ethnogenese im Imperium" (a text I found on the internet)):
"Während Greutungen und Alanen zumeist in die neue hunnische Konföderation absorbiert wurden..." means "While Greutungs and Alans mostly got absorbed into the hunnish confederation..."

6. http://www.geschkult.fu-berlin.de/e...essoren/Textdateien/Chronologie_Schoenig.pdf:
- "359: nach Einigung mit Shabuhr II. (309-379) marschieren Chioniten unter ihrem Führer Grumbates und Kontingente der Gilanen (= Hunnen?) gegen das röm. Reich." means "359: after unification under Shabuhr II (309 - 379) the Chionites under their leader Grumbates and contingents of the Gilans (=Huns?) marched against the roman empire."
- "425 - 434 (?) Der Anführer Rua eint die Hunnen, german. Hilfsvölker (Rugier,
Skiren, Gepiden, Ostgoten) werden ebenfalls fest eingebunden;" means "425 - 434 (?) The leader Rua (=Ruga) unifies the Huns, germanic helping peoples (Rugiens, Skirs, Gepids, Eastern goths) are also integrated;"

7. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Hunnic_Empire:
"Bulgar tribes Utigurs (according to Wikipedia =Onogurs) and Kutrigurs were a part of the Hunnic tribal alliance."

8. http://s155239215.onlinehome.us/turkic/29Huns/HunsAndTurksEn.htm:
"The initial Late Antique Huns' domains included the tribes of Bulgars, Suvars (Savars), Ezgils, and Kangars. With time the now Western Hun confederation included Alans, Agathyrs, Scythians, Sarmatians, N.Pontic Türks, European Huns, Ases, a part of the Baltic tribes destined to become Slavic tribes, a part of the Germanic tribes, and Ugrian Magiars."
(a map from this page about hunnish tribes:

)

9. Wikipedia (Sabir):
"They appear to have been a Turkic people, possibly of Hunnic origin."

But the most informative source is this: http://osmagyar.kisbiro.hu/modules.php?name=topics&file=nyomtat&cikk=perelo-488df913babe2. It mentions the following placenames:

Aduni
Bastetiji
Basteoutouji (probably the same as the one before)
Berenü(tiji)
Csegi
Dorgathegi
Douroughetiji
Kevi
Khalatiji
Klünteidi
Kücsüteidi
Laiduni
Livi
Madüjaghildi
Madüteidi
Madüvaradi
Varad
Sadáni
Sopruni
Suchongadi
Szogidi
Telikhi
Tesongadi
Vepüszidi
Volgjaghadi
Wourduszi

and these 4:

Hu-jen, (or Ho-jen), Su-pok, K'u-lim, Lan (tribe names); Tien-fan (people name)

Opinions?

 

[AbsintheRed]

Hm, not sure yet. Some of these sound good, but I plan to check some sources myself on this weekend.
I will get back to you on this...

 

[cool3a2]

Alright, I'm looking forward for your sources.