EnglishEdward
Deity
I can not see why the Republicans would bother.
I reckon Donald Trump must be very grateful for being given a near perfect precedent of an early Christmas present for his own pardons.
The Hunter Biden Thread
- Thread starter Kaitzilla
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I can not see why the Republicans would bother.
I reckon Donald Trump must be very grateful for being given a near perfect precedent of an early Christmas present for his own pardons.
This is about a close relative, however. In fact it can't get closer than that, and it's the first time someone pardons their own son. No way to not see it as a very important precedent.
Ziggy Stardust
Absolutely Sane
Charles Kushner – Father of Trump's son-in-law Jared Kushner, convicted of tax evasion and witness tampering, and recently nominated by Trump as the U.S.'s ambassador to France.
"this was a closer relative than all the political pardons previously despite how much they helped the Republican Party or Trump specifically" feels like splitting a hair.
Very much "both bad, but let's not try and act like the cat isn't already out of the bag". See: the Guardian article I linked.
Well... in the context of this conversation, it means "tough guy", more specifically, a guy who has had serious encounters with being in law enforcement custody and lived to tell the tale... So have you even been arrested and gone to jail (local/overnight/weekend)? Been convicted and gone to prison (incarcerated/general population/ad-sec/solitary)?
If the answer to those is "No", then no... in the context of this inquiry... you are not a "capital M man".
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Didn't Clinton pardon his brother-in-law on his way out of office? Either way, when you vest absolute power to pardon or commute any sentence for any reason in one man, it will get used, for good or ill.
It was complete baloney when he said it and I declared as much at the time. He never thought that his son would be convicted, so he didn't think he was going to have to live up to his promise. Essentially it was a bluff.
Once his bluff got called and his son was convicted, the plan was to get re-elected and then wait for the sentencing. If Hunter was not sentenced to prison, he would get to keep his pardon pen in his pocket, and continue his bluff "See! I told you I wouldn't pardon!" On the other hand, if Hunter was sentenced to prison, then he could wait out the lengthy appeals process while serving his second term. If Hunter got either the conviction or the sentencing to prison overturned or otherwise negotiated away, once again, Biden wouldn't need to pardon him.
Only if all of that failed, or was unresolved by the end of his second term AND a Democrat (who would have pardoned Hunter for him) did not win the POTUS election to replace him, would Biden, in his lame duck period, be forced to pardon Hunter.
The problem of course... was the Democrats lost the election, so Biden's lame duck period is now, so he is forced to do the pardon much sooner than he would have liked, before its out of his hands. Either way, there was NO way, Biden was going to let his son go to prison and its utterly preposterous that anyone expected him to, just like it was preposterous for people to believe that he was going to step aside after his first term ended and let the Democrats run a primary without him as a candidate. I am still pretty shocked that he actually finally dropped out at the last minute, although at that point, it was a little like jumping (being pushed) out of a burning plane, mid-crash (or having the ring bitten off your finger at the precipice of the burning lake).
Now the Democrats/liberals etc., are whining incessantly about him pardoning Hunter all over the news and internet... but they did this to themselves, by placing unreasonable expectations on Biden. In fact, their non-stop complaining about it is as bad, if not worse than the Republicans whining about it. At least on FOX News (I checked) they are talking about other things, besides complaining about the pardon non-stop. On liberal media the pardon is literally all they have been talking about for 2 days straight. Especially humiliated, are all the Democratic politicians who foolishly, and self-righteously touted Biden's pledge not to pardon as a shining example of how much moral high ground the Democrats had over the Republicans.
Now they have egg all over their faces... Maybe that's why there is so much constant complaining about it... because it made folks look bad. But its their own fault. They should have smelled the BS from the beginning and kept their mouth shut... Or said "What do you think of Biden's pledge not to pardon Hunter?... "
The problem isn't Biden/Trump, but that when you flaunt that openly that the law doesn't apply to those with power, you have ensured that sooner rather than later the house of cards will collapse.
Hunter wouldn't be the first person to be convicted due to persecution or similar (if so), but those seas of other people didn't happen to have their dad be potus, so tough, but the plebs should know their place (until they rebel).
Hunter wouldn't be the first person to be convicted due to persecution or similar (if so), but those seas of other people didn't happen to have their dad be potus, so tough, but the plebs should know their place (until they rebel).
Actually Hunter had a plea deal rejected that most others would have gotten.
So those who had their own analogous plea turned down due to nefarious reasons, should feel better about Hunter?
That is probably a very small universe given that the gun violation is very rarely prosecuted - especially in regards to the addiction angle. I'm sure there will be a lot of unpardoned trespassers and vandalizers upset when Trump pardons the J6 riff raff.
Klaus Hergersheimer
Emperor
- I haven't followed the tax story too closely; can't comment
- I do remember thinking that maybe he should be pardoned for the gun offense. Se he lied on some form, big whoop.
In either case it seems as though any punishment would've been light anyway (i.e. no prison) and so maybe daddy should've allowed sonny boy to take a pinch like a man. But I imagine Joe Biden is just a bitter old fogey and he'll be taking his toys and heading back to Delaware soon anyway.
- I do remember thinking that maybe he should be pardoned for the gun offense. Se he lied on some form, big whoop.
In either case it seems as though any punishment would've been light anyway (i.e. no prison) and so maybe daddy should've allowed sonny boy to take a pinch like a man. But I imagine Joe Biden is just a bitter old fogey and he'll be taking his toys and heading back to Delaware soon anyway.
As @JollyRoger points out, Hunter was both the victim and beneficiary of his position of power. He got prosecuted for something the average person wouldn't, because of who he is, then he lost the plea deal the average person would have received because of who he is, but then received a pardon that no average person would have gotten because of who he is.
So on balance its kind of a wash, but that doesn't fix the problem of perception... because most people will focus on the latter and not even remember (or even know about) the former.
As an aside... a pretty irksome thing about this pardon is... where was all this shameless hypocrisy, exploitation of the rules, embracing double standards, breaking norms and bending integrity when we needed it? Like when it was time to fire the Parliamentarian and appoint a new one that would approve adding the Build-Back-Better bill to the spending Bill when it was being crammed through? Or when it was time to declare Trump ineligible to run for POTUS under Section 3 of the 14th Amendment? He waited until it was something to personally benefit him to find the fortitude to shamelessly wield his power
11 years is rather specific a time, as Jon Stewart obviously wouldn't fail to notice:As JR points out Hunter was both the victim and beneficiary of his position of power. He lost the plea deal the average person would have received because of who he is, but then received a pardon that no average person would have gotten because of who he is.
So on balance its kind of a wash, but that doesn't fix the problem of perception... because most people will focus on the latter and not even remember (or even know about) the former.
As an aside... a pretty irksome thing about this pardon is... where was all this shameless hypocrisy, exploitation of the rules, embracing double standards, breaking norms and bending integrity when we needed it? Like when it was time to fire the Parliamentarian and appoint a new one that would approve adding the Build-Back-Better bill to the spending Bill when it was being crammed through? Or when it was time to declare Trump ineligible to run for POTUS under Section 3 of the 14th Amendment? He waited until it was something to personally benefit him to find the fortitude to shamelessly wield his power
Hunter is a victim imo only in a shortsighted sense; you can't seriously think that pardoning him did good to the country, no matter how partisan you are.
sylvanllewelyn
Perma-newb
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At this point, Biden should personally pardon Trump and the January 6 perpetuators. On January 6th 2025. Even the ones Trump does not want to pardon. See? Not just his son.
Ziggy Stardust
Absolutely Sane
Biden should pardon the golfcourse hostage.
lol, lmao
I'd rather expose the hypocrisy this shows on his lack of progress on other issues for fear of "rocking the boat", rather than indulging in right-wing fantasies about dismantling what little is left of democracy.
No, he shouldn't. Please look up the false equivalence fallacy.
