The worst technology?

[rfcfanatic]

Useless techs are Archery, Horseback Riding (yes I do feel that way) and Divine Right.

I partially agree with what you said about Horseback Riding. Usually, I don't research it before I research Guilds. Horse Archers are much less powerful in their era as Knights are. Spearmen, especially when in cities, will eat HAs for breakfast. While spears start hanging around earlier than HAs, it's much easier to get Knights a long way before the enemy gets Pikemen. The only threat to Knights would then be War Elephants.

 

[jarhead_leif]

I partially agree with what you said about Horseback Riding. Usually, I don't research it before I research Guilds.

You don't want WarElephants then.
HBR become pretty useful when you have ivory and Construction.
They can even defeat an early spearman with proper promotions.

 

[SnipedSoul]

I've never wanted Divine Right in any of my games. The only reason I ever end up with it is because every AI in the entire world spams me with trade offers every turn until I get it.

 

[nfw]

1) You rarely research it yourself.
2) You trade for it just to broker it around.
3) Theology, Divine Right, etc. get treated the exact same way.

Conclusion:
... Alphabet is only slightly better than the so-called useless techs.

What if you play with tech brokering disabled?

Without alphabet, you can almost never induce 1 civ to attack another.

 

[RD-BH]

Without alphabet, you can almost never induce 1 civ to attack another.

1) The AI researches alphabet.
2) You trade non-alphabet techs to alphabetized AI for war.

I do not understand this blind loyalty to alphabet.

 

[nfw]

1) The AI researches alphabet.
2) You trade non-alphabet techs to alphabetized AI for war.

I do not understand this blind loyalty to alphabet.

2 neighbors, A has alpha but won't declare on B, B doesn't but will declare on A.

 

[RD-BH]

Your opinion seems to be based on how you play rather the big picture which is what should determine overall usefulness. Just because you don't use spies or tech trading doesn't make them useless, they are two very powerful aspects when used right (which isn't that difficult)...

Also re: Mathematics vs Alphabet: During the Bronze Age it's almost always happiness rather than health limiting city sizes so Aqueducts aren't that useful right away.

Seriously, NO tech is useless.
EVERY tech has a situation where it has value.

Alphabet is weak because there are better ways to play than to research it yourself.
Others have said as much.

Pyramids(representation)>>Library>>Great Library>>Code of Laws(Caste)>>Civil Service>>University>>Astronomy>>Banking(Merchantilism)>>etc etc
... is the fastest research route in most situations.

On some few maps in some few situations beelining alphabet and tech brokering to the AI can cost effectively advance your tech, but that is how ALL less valuable techs are made useful ... Alphabet IS such a tech.

Even then, all you get are the same techs the AI has. What you want is a valuable tech the AI does not have and exploit the advantage before the AI can catch up.

 

[RD-BH]

2 neighbors, A has alpha but won't declare on B, B doesn't but will declare on A.

1) That is a specific situation not a generality.
2) All maps create situations requiring player choice.
3) Playing the game involves exploiting the given situation.
4) In how many games do you want non-alphabet B to declare on alphabet A?
... is it every game?
... almost all games?
... 1/2 the games?
... or some games?

Actually, I'm tired of beating this dead horse. (though, not tired enough )
I've stated the alphabet argument.
Agree/disagree is your choice.

This thread needs to move on.

 

[crazyotto65]

I generally skip DR (and get to Nationalism thru Paper). If the game goes long, I usually end up with it via a trade anyway..

I LOVE Alpha and always tech it on the way to Currency..

 

[nerdfighter13]

I am going to say computers, because it obsoletes Angkor Wat and the Spiral Minaret, both of which I commonly use.

 

[AdamCrock]

In Civ 1 it was horeback riding In Civ 4 BTS for it's the advanced flight unless You really need those choppers (gunships) It's better to fight fire with fire tank vs tank with anti tanks covering the defenses besides I think it's the flaw of Civ 4 that flying units are far too easily contered by SAM, therefore I rarely rush towards fighters and usually have a decent fleet of Zeppelins just to spy on people

EDIT: I strongly disagree with people saying alphabet is useless. It is very important for science (tech exchange) for one, besides it leads to currency which is very important if You've expanded widely and need to cover up the maintenance costs.

 

[fantsu]

I hate wonder techs. Like Aesthetics. Seriously, who wants JUST wonders?

 

[pigswill]

Bronze working. Lose health through chopping trees? Lose population through whipping? Axes are vastly over-rated compared to chariots (followed by horse archers).

 

[nerdfighter13]

I predict many people to disagree with you, but I agree the losing health through cutting trees is bad, and has to be watched in jungle cities.

 

[AdamCrock]

Bronze working. Lose health through chopping trees? Lose population through whipping? Axes are vastly over-rated compared to chariots (followed by horse archers).

You must have been reading that article that I've been reading And know what You're right bronze working is as much useless as slavery, You'll be fine to stick with serfdom hahaha

 

[nerdfighter13]

Don't forget that the Incans are the worst civ.

 

[lindsay40k]

Now, I don't enjoy playing above Monarch so can't speak much for higher levels, but I've found Alphabet to be very helpful. Even if my early play is a convoluted GLH/Artemis combo, I find I can get it out the way, a food resource or two online, Bronze Working to chop and still arrive at Alphabet in time to trade it - or even just Writing - to most rivals to backfill everything.

As far as I'm concerned, being the first person to backfill everything is a benefit to Alphabet that's comparable to Liberalism's free tech, on account of the multiplier effect. My points lead over most rivals usually starts and stays from Alphabet. Even if someone else has already done it when I get there, I'd rather have their scraps and be able to sic Shaka on Liz than be one of five backwater civs waiting for someone else to come up with the idea of blueprints - whilst the brothers in faith on another continent are inventing the Compass.

My most useless tech? Guilds, Engineering and Military Science are the ones I most frequently leave for later and often only backfill to open up other techs. All got their places now and then - Guilds if I'm Justinian or running a Hammer Economy, Engineering if I'm running an Espionage Economy, MS if I'm on a heavily Naval map (I normally prefer to go for Rifling, but if Chemistry is a high priority we may as well go for the quicker option that lives next door to Steel).

 

[jarhead_leif]

Worst tech for me.
FutureTech

Aesthetics, too. How come they say it's better researching it than alphabet? The only good thing about it is when beelining Lit to get TGL.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Worst tech for me.
FutureTech

Aesthetics, too. How come they say it's better researching it than alphabet? The only good thing about it is when beelining Lit to get TGL.

AI avoids it, which means in tech trade games it is extremely valuable to research.

Otherwise, it's an average tech, nowhere near worst even with trades off...not when it has to compete with junk like future tech, robotics, and divine right.

In Civ 1 it was horeback riding In Civ 4 BTS for it's the advanced flight unless You really need those choppers (gunships) It's better to fight fire with fire tank vs tank with anti tanks covering the defenses besides I think it's the flaw of Civ 4 that flying units are far too easily contered by SAM, therefore I rarely rush towards fighters and usually have a decent fleet of Zeppelins just to spy on people

Unless you don't have uranium or something, all of the later-game techs except laser are a waste of time (usually laser too against the AI which really doesn't do well with first strike nuclear warfare tactics <3). None of that junk resists tactical nukes well.

However, if you're not just spamming "win" clouds all over the place, then jet fighters on carriers are actually really strong. They have tremendous range, unlike in cities can be stacked infinitely, and tear through enemy air power. They mesh well with gunships which can clean up after them (and they clear the sky of interceptions so that you can paradrop). None of that is practical though, because nukes and naval strike + raze exist.

Still, the fact that you can use it at all tends to push it ahead of future tech, divine right, and ESPECIALLY robotics which is arguably the consistently worst tech.

Robotics:

1. Is a trap for space (will almost always slow your time, 99% of cases or more)
2. Unlocks a military unit that is only marginally better against gunpowder than the unit that predates it and has no special ability in an era where virtually everything has a powerful specialized ability.
3. Carries the single most useless wonder in the game by far.
4. Is not required to accomplish any victory condition. In fact, it tends to be a hindrance even in very late domination because you have to forgo more useful techs.

 

[noto2]

Hmm, I have gone for robotics in some of my space win games just to be on the safe side. Often when I go for a spaceship victory I do a superconductors/genetics gambit. You can go up through electricity to refrigeration, and build supermarkets to deal with all the coal plants/factories you just spammed. You're in the industrial age and now what? You can get tanks, airports, or superconductors. Bee-lining straight to superconductors gives you a research edge but if you then go straight up towards fusion you don't get any more advanced military units. I often go superconductors and sometimes genetics if I don't want to switch to environmentalism. Robotics is only 1 tech out of the way. I suppose you are saying that you use nukes in most games to defend yourself. That can work but requires prioritizing fission, building the manhattan project, and having uranium. Anyway, mech infantry do have a special ability - they counter air just like anti air units (not as well) and are very strong mobile units with terrain defense. They are jack of all trades units and you can build them in massive numbers to stop anything. Sometimes they are better than modern armour, such as when playing an aggressive/protective leader.