They're All Barbarians.

Grab the indian cities in Se asia and peace out.

If we don't weaken the indian barbarians too much they may not capitulate to the persian tribe. While we despise barbarians we also fear them in their numbers and savagery.

We have been acquiring some nice real estate but most of our cities are too small. Maybe we need to grow and prosper before launching our glorious march to the west crushing all before us.
 
With "grabbing" you guys mean "razing", right? :p

In light of having advanced knowledge, I kinda feel we should still declare on the Indians, but you can be more prudent this time if you wish... Growing a bit and bolstering the army doesn't sound too bad, however.
 
1'm of the opinion that sinc3 u play3d with the attack, i would continue on with the current plan. but then i wonder if we should focus our attacks somewhere else? tho, it doesn't seem as if there's much better land than the subcontinent. its alarming to see those size 13 indian cities, tho. perhaps we take the first city or so, then send our armies to ravage the inidan countryside to slow them down??
 
Ok, I finally replayed ( BTW I'm having a irking issue with BtS in Windows 7 ... it shutsdown the comp in a average of 15 min of play... the issue is not the comp, since it was happy to run BtS on Vista, that is far more resource hogging than 7 ... :confused: ). I played up to the turn after the next AP vote ( that is 13 turns ) and I have changed my mind a little about the Indian war. But more on that below ...

Anyway, the set was given to me with a SoD still on assembly phase, teching set on engineering and a basically proxy war vs the Romans and the Chinese ( that I basically ignored until the end of the set ).

First things I did :

-Changed the teching to Drama. Besides the stiffling unhappinees in home, I'm eyeing the GT and the uberdraft :D

- Changed the HE to Nara :p That ended not so bad, since we got 271 g from the failed HE in our cap

- Continued to assemble our army. It would take more 3-4 turns to get it to the way I like it ...

In between and after we got Drama, someone had the nerve of asking us for a deal:
Spoiler :
IJG8h.jpg

( Off caracher: this is the kind of deal I would actually agree with if the rules did not disallowed it ... cleaning the adversary of cash just before dowing him )

We became so enraged with this that our awnser was without ambiguity :
Spoiler :
Qf5d4.jpg

We do not negotiate with terrorists after all :-D

Anyway, our suposed peacenik neighbour decided to bravely get some people to fight for him ...
Spoiler :
mThg5.jpg

Later he would also bribe the French. That would have a big influence on the end of the set.

Onwards, we marched to south, to clean up the SE Asia of those Indians guys:
Spoiler :
H7KSe.jpg


vlfqe.jpg

We lost 2 cats in this ... not bad given that the city was in a hill and had a decent garrison. We also got a GG, currenly in our HE city ( I expect that the team wants to settle him )

It is in this times that I miss civ III feature that allowed us to simply decline to talk with a AI banging on our door:
Spoiler :
4UIOc.jpg

[Angry Korea Man]SHUT UP I HATE YOU[/Angry Korea Man]

Anyway, our mighty army took the city that the Indians had in where is RL Singapore:
Spoiler :
PEUno.jpg

I also resettled it ... was a little divided on this, but after seeing the trade route output I was releived to see that it was a net gain to simply have the city there, even with 1 pop and no buildings.

Anyway, remember that I said something about the French ?
Spoiler :
l7RzY.jpg


sus4n.jpg

This is the reason I have not made a single peace deal during the set :p Ok, this is a little of gaming the ridiculously skeleton code of the sec general/Pope AI, but delivering a lot of AP resolution options make it harder to get by chance the ones we want to avoid ( give cities back and in this case also to stop the war with India ).

BTW we should lose the villain unhappiness in the next turn ;)

Back on military issues, we passed the end turns of the set regrouping our army to march on India proper. You can see part of the regrouping here:
Spoiler :
JRqqa.jpg

But the real reason I took that screenshot was to show that China is done with their roman overlords ( atleast for this turn :D ). The romans basically didn't bothered us this turnset ( besides suiciding a preat vs a samurai across a river with the samurai on a hill ), but IMHO there is no reason to end the war :p

Some end of turnset pics ( the last two were also from last turn ):
Spoiler :
aT0sr.jpg


RfSTU.jpg


qBWH2.jpg

The first pic is about our web of non-relations with the world ... just a reminder of how many people we are in war with. The other 2 are the tech trade screen, just to have a idea of how the world is faring technologically. We are not that bad, but some civs are starting to skyrocket , including our Indian friends that are researching Lib at the moment ...

Ok, on discussion for the next set:

- I'm against peaceing out with anyone at this point. This includes the Indians and the Romans/Chinese. The first one is a definite change of mind, but I feel that our current SoD is adequate to deal with mainland India if we deliver reinforcements as needed. The second because we want to end with the Chinese and we can do that after erasing mainland India ( and because we do not win anything by peacing the Romans ). And the ongoing wars can act as a partial buffer against undesirable AP resolutions ...

- We can build 3 new units since the begining of my set: war phants, pikes and trebs. I already made some war phants to go with our SoD to India, but no trebs or pikes. Well, I don't see us needing pikes now that we have phants, but we should do trebs.

- We are completely outclassed in the sea. India has caravels that are far faster and stronger than anything we have. That disallows us of taking the war to Indonesia ( be careful with our trirremes there )

- Tech wise, i got Drama and Engineering. I already explained the reasoning behind drama, so please make some more theaters to unlock the GT ... but what about our next techs? Remember that we can't trade techs, so we will have eventually to get to the southern side of the tech tree ... but I'm not sure that is for the better now. I queued Paper, but I'm not so sure on that ...

- In terms of the grand plan. I'm for erasing mainland India and peace out ... and take the Chinese out after that to remove partly the restitute city avaliable votes. The Indian islands are still filled with jungle and those guys can clean out it a little more before we take them :p

- EDIT: How did I forgot to talk about the FP ? Where do we want it ?

- Just as a late reminder, make settlers. we will need a good handful of them and we have none at the moment.

 
I decided to add some military related pics to show a little more the situation:

First, our current SoD and the garrison of the nearest Indian city:
Spoiler :
cswNZ.jpg

Remember that the city has 100% defense and that annoying wall and castle. BTW there are still troops coming from the south.

Same for the other visible mainland Indian city:
Spoiler :
JfBDf.jpg


A overview of the known Indian cities in Indonesia:
Spoiler :
P9y6S.jpg

The garrisons are light ( one mace in Agra and 1-2 LBs in the others ), but i would not risk a invasion there at the moment. Notice also the border in the south ... that means that Asoka has a city in the Darwin spot.
 
nice. i have to agree on continuing the war, esp if India's on their way to Lib. I think we should hang off on the FP maybe for a bit, or put it in our westernmost city as we'll be settling the subcontinent soonish as well....maybe Sapporo?

Or do we move the palace there and save the FP for later??
 
I'm for making it now, given the time needed to be able to do a FP in India proper ( raze city , put new city, get FP done ... ). Sapporo would be a nice candidate if not the war-related delays in it's development ( besides the necessary retreat of the workers, it had the granary build sabotaged and a mine spy destroyed , courtesy of the Indians ... ). But it is probably the best place for the FP ...
 
We've been investing our EPs into India so I wouldn't want to annihilate them on the mainland, maybe raze Bombay (without replacing it with one of ours) on the way to chinese Illinois then up north to finish off China then make a start on GK.

Techwise I'd like to get compass for harbours. Maybe guilds>gunpowder>chem?

At some point we should think about a golden age.

Move palace to Nara for extra bureaucratic production?

edit: I'm up? Got it.
 
Lurker comment: Great set, but one quibble: That is Johor, not Singapore. Johor is on the mainland, Singapore is the island off it :D
 
Lurker comment: Great set, but one quibble: That is Johor, not Singapore. Johor is on the mainland, Singapore is the island off it :D
The map resolution is too small to discern between those two :D It is like discussing if a tile in N.America is NY or Newark :p

And it isn't Johore ? Atleast in Portuguese it is ( we have a century-wide history chapter of messing around that area :p

On game issues:

I'm for taking India out of India :D We will not be able to use the land easily without it. About the EP, well, revolt some cities ( we will need spies for that though ... ).

Not sure on going compass ...to be honest, i would prefer even feudalism .... we might not like it, but we have to start climbing that ladder...
 
The map resolution is too small to discern between those two :D It is like discussing if a tile in N.America is NY or Newark :p

And it isn't Johore ? Atleast in Portuguese it is ( we have a century-wide history chapter of messing around that area :p

The original Malay spelling is Johor. The Europeans call it Johore.

And yes, I know all about the Portuguese. 1511 was a bad year for the Malay Peninsula. Damned Porties. Why couldn't Alfonso stay in Portaloo where he belonged? :lol:
 
I'd also try to kick the Indians off from the mainland. If we have so much EP invested in them, that could possibly help with some city revolts when attacking, assuming we can get some spies out reasonably fast. That will save us some units.
If we have that much EP that we can steal a worthwhile tech, maybe try to steal it from the last of his 3 (?) mainland cities just before razing it. In any case, I'd not consolidate until India is expelled to Indonesia and south of it.
 
And it isn't Johore ? Atleast in Portuguese it is ( we have a century-wide history chapter of messing around that area :p

Before getting kicked out by your Oranje friends ;) (gonna check the save soon :goodjob:)
 
Yup, I messed that one :p I was going to peace out with the French anyway (they had a exploring warrior in our northern border and it was interfering with our worker actions up there ) ...
 
Nice set Rolo! Situation is nicely improved! I agree we should raze and resettle the indian subcontinent.

I think we should veto that monument in vietnam though (lighthouse instead), and bulldoze that cottage in the Philippines (a city which can host just a few cottages - here it's one!!! - deserves none... sorry I know I am an extremist with this, but this cottage serves no purpose, it doesn't help the city). Sapporo looks like a nice place to do a second military factory (settling our curent idle GG there could be usefull to have another two promotion city)

tech path: paper -> edu looks fine by me (for unis mostly), but feudalism -> guild for knights and better workshops is another possibility (followed by gunpowder -> chemestry -> cannons -> military science), a more warlike path.

Cheers,
Ras
 
That monument was inherited from the previous player and I haven't bothered with that ( especially because the city had 1 H of prod before the war start. The cottage in the Philipines is also not mine , but I agree that it serves little propose in there ...

In tech path ... well, my gut feeling is also paper->Edu, but i also feel that we will need to go to the Feudalism route sooner than later, even if to get LBs...
 
That monument was inherited from the previous player and I haven't bothered with that ( especially because the city had 1 H of prod before the war start. The cottage in the Philipines is also not mine , but I agree that it serves little propose in there ...

Just to be sure: that part wasn't a criticism Rolo (I wouldn't dare :D)... I just think we should switch the build :)
 
I still have to understand why some people treat me as if I'm Zeus reincarnate, Vulcan lightning bolts included :p Feel free to criticize ... and in that case I feel free to justify myself for passing now that situation to the next player ( in this case, basically lack of time and of attention to detail :P ) Nothing wrong with that, right ? :trouble: :D
 
I still have to understand why some people treat me as if I'm Zeus reincarnate, Vulcan lightning bolts included :p Feel free to criticize ...
everyone remembers that Fox was the last one to criticize you :mischief:

right before he disappeared...
 
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