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Tips for remembering to slow down, strategize?

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by isa1, Jan 25, 2021.

  1. lymond

    lymond Rise Up! (Phoenix Style!) Moderator Hall of Fame Staff

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    I can't fathom why you would be nervous posting your games here. We are a friendly forum :). We've all been where you are now. Keep in mind that discussing your games with others is a great way to slow down and start analyzing the game.
     
    Snowygerry likes this.
  2. sampsa

    sampsa Ghost

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    I very much sympathize with this. I lurked the forums for several years before making my first post and I'm sure not posting my games slowed down my progress immensely. Remember that improvement starts where comfort zone ends, so I guess the real question is "do you really want to improve?". It's also ok to keep repeating the same mistakes ad infinitum, as long as you enjoy it. For some people, improving feels like hard work and sure, in a way it is. Getting out of the comfort zone is stressing by definition.

    So if someone still is interested in improving their game ;) I'd suggest the following recipe:
    • watch Lain's deity games on his YouTube channel. Focus on early game
    • play. play. play. As soon as you beat a level (once, maybe twice), up the difficulty
    • watch more Lain
    • bash your head against the wall more
    • post your game to the forum, people will rip it apart and ridicule each decision you make
    • repeat
    The speed in which some people have managed to improve their game is mind-blowing, so maybe they can present it better than me. @Fish Man what was it for you, 6 months noble->deity?
     
    Berks, Fish Man, SittinDown and 2 others like this.
  3. PPQ_Purple

    PPQ_Purple Techpriest Engineer

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    My tip is to do what I do and disable all automation. All of it. And than go through each and every city in your empire manually each turn checking by hand for new citizens to assign.
    This gives you a lot of time to think and think carefully.
     
    Pangaea likes this.
  4. elmurcis

    elmurcis Emperor

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    Add sticky note next to capital with words "What next?" - not big change but definitely helps with "big picture" :D
     
  5. Fish Man

    Fish Man Emperor

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    That may be an exaggeration, haha...it took me 14 months to go from starting on noble to beating deity the first time. I got the game late February of 2017, and only won deity June 2018, albeit with a ridiculously overpowered leader and start.

    I've almost 3000 hours in this game...it certainly means a lot to me, and it's seen me through some very tough times. Perhaps that's why I find bashing my head against the wall, as you say, more therapeutic than troublesome :).

    On that note - can you add me and @WastinTime to your signature? For me, say something like "chicken was already launched into space 400 years ago", and for WastinTime, maybe say "chicken arrived at Alpha Centauri before my neighbors learned math".
     
    gavenkoa, Pangaea and sampsa like this.
  6. gavenkoa

    gavenkoa Prince

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    Thx for sharing the date. I got a copy in summer 2019.

    The most frustrating part were absence of the definite strategy guide & enormous volume of game rules with non linear formulae (maintenance cost) and hidden rules (like trading resource grants +1 to diplomacy after 50T).

    About definitive strategy guide: there are a lot of outdated PDFs and guides over the Internet and novice won't recognize the problem with the guides (like they are targeting Noble).

    Even this forum is useless when info before say 2012 (mostly because people role play instead of doing math).

    I also read https://sullla.com/civ4.html early in the gaming career.

    I wish there was single up-to-date guide with all game mechanic and example how they are exploited.

    It is unfortunate that BUG stopped developing. I'd add many leader info from XML to the built-in tips. Why should you leave the game to check leaders' attitude? Also city planner with updated cost of owning new city would be helpful, why spend 1000h to develop intuition about maintenance cost?

    It is crazy to learn about WHEOOHRN or that purchasing tech increases hidden threshold preventing future trades.
     
    Fish Man and sampsa like this.
  7. gavenkoa

    gavenkoa Prince

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    Recently I searched if mounted units get defence bonuses from fortification. I remember they don't get from terrain but hesitated to move Chariot to better position as might lose stacked +25% stationary def bonus.

    Only hiding on the other side of the river helps with mounted.
     
    Fish Man, sampsa and krikav like this.
  8. krikav

    krikav Theorycrafter

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    A notable exception is the spanish unique unit, which does get defensive bonuses.
     
    Fish Man and gavenkoa like this.
  9. AcaMetis

    AcaMetis Emperor

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    Persian Immortals likewise. Aside from that Mounted units indeed do not get defensive bonuses from any source, be it terrain, cities/forts or remaining on one square. Attackers do get penalties when attacking a mounted units across a river or from the coast without Amphibious, though aside from that Mounted units survive based on not getting hit or withdraw chances.
     
    krikav, Fish Man and gavenkoa like this.
  10. Berks

    Berks Warlord

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    I also lurked for a long time before posting games (my first account was from 2008) but once you start posting saves, you find you spend more time thinking.

    Sampsa's post is excellent advice.

    If you are going to post saves or games:

    Smaller turnsets are better;
    Try to articulate your plan for the next set;
    Include pictures if you can;
    Ask questions about things you don't understand;
    STOP IF A CRITICAL DECISION POINT HAPPENS

    Think of it as advertising your game, you want to attract the better players to come and pick apart your mistakes so you can learn from them. :mischief:
     
    krikav, Fish Man, gavenkoa and 2 others like this.
  11. Fippy

    Fippy Mycro Junkie Queen

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    I learned the game (or what i can do now) by following city screens.
    Each turn i would look what changed (looking at you silly gorvernors :lol:), how long until i can work another tile..or cheer workers on to finally improve this and that.

    I never lost this habit, now it's done fast but concerning your original question i still usually end up in cities if i stop or pause.
    Imo there are 2 worlds in Civ..the map + AIs, and your own stuff.
    Maps are not giving me turn by turn feelings, but cities do.
     
    gavenkoa likes this.
  12. shakabrade

    shakabrade Praise Vivec!

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    Hi, isa1, welcome to the forums!

    Regarding the strategy, it takes a bit of experience, but try to figure out the time component of the game. How much time do I need to have this kind of army, how many units not to lose the momentum, where would the opponent be at that point. Do I need a lot of siege to crack open the PRO AI with many hill cities, what is my next war going to be, how do I get there quickly, do I need a vassal to help me with tech. What will the AIs look like when I am ready to execute the plan? Is my window of opportunity narrow? Do I have the economy to go all out mid-game? Do I need to bulb something on the way? Is there a city which could generate Great Persons? What are the wonder dates (are AIs teching fast or slow), what is my chance to get some wonder? For me, there are many things happening in the future, even if they are not visible now, and I am very insecure about my vision and reiterate frequently. Also, I scout a lot to have an info to form the strategy and often need to adjust with the new info. For me that is enough to make me pause a bit, zoom out and think about the multiple paths the game could go. Also, I hate seing that the city is not working the better tile and I go through screens quickly, almost each turn, except when in war, beacuse I still get carried away.

    Lol, I totally relate to that. I played Civ 1 and Civ 3, since I was 12 (I was 3 when Civ 1 released), but always at a low difficulty with a lot of sandboxing. Civ 4 I played around 2007, a bit in 2009 and I was a Monarch player playing Roosevelt of Egypt at epic speed with huts. Always a Flood plains start, with some gold. And then I saw some TMIT and AZ videos and learned about the existence of civfanatics, I was really comfortable at Monarch although I saved forests for lumbermills and did not use slavery for personal beliefs. Then saw some crazy good games, saw how my games are doing nothing but wonderwhoring in up to 8 cities, made an account here and told myself that the first post will be when I beat deity as I feared that my questions would be stupid (I have learned in my life to get rid of that in the last 10 or so years). And I did do that purely by looking at @kossin Daily Rounds plus playing a game after reading through couple of his games. I basically skipped Emperor and Immortal and lost pretty much all games for the next 2 months. And then I won. And after 2 more defeats won again. And then started winning more than losing. But those 2 moths of defeats were fueled by obsession, and I felt really stupid most of the times. If I posted the games, I would have had so much more fun earlier. You see, there was one more civfanatic at that time trying to get to Deity, @Tachywaxon (later changed to @Manco Capac). We had a friendly rivalry through shadowing some games, making some masochistic Deity threads to push the limits and we exchanged some private messages about the game as well. I have met actually quite a lot of friends and friendly rivals here. And it kept the whole process of learning incredibly fun. The game is supposed to be fun and things are always more fun when shared (compare watching a comedy alone to watching it with the others). So, start posting shadow games, start your own threads, see someone in your position, see someone who plays like you would like to be able to play, connect the dots, profit. And have fun!
     
  13. crashmon

    crashmon Warlord

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    I'm exactly the same, got the game in 2006 when it came out, signed up to this forum (aslo apolyton does that one still exist), but back then I was more into civ 2 than civ 4, so did not progress much beyond Prince.

    Came back to the game in 2019 (got bored of World of warcraft), found my old log in to the forum, been lurking ever since, my wife thinks I spend more time watching Lain than I do with her (her quote is you must watch the most boring e-sports there is, watching MOBA's is one thing, but some random german guy on a 16 year old game spend 20 mins deciding whether to workshop a FP or cottage the FP, how is this possibly entertaining, and what the F*** does FP stand for anyway), I then started to play some NC games on Prince (not posted them however) as I am making stupid mistakes on Monarch, before getting up the courage to post my own shadow game (not a plug honest).

    So post a shadow game, mine is still in early game, but already I seen a couple of stupid mistakes I was making with scouting, and disregarding a city spot as it was mainly plains but had fish, only to be told "Thats a great city spot, what are you thinking". So I'm already learning and my game is only on turn 15
     
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  14. sampsa

    sampsa Ghost

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    :lmao:
     
  15. Anysense

    Anysense Emperor

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    We all make mistakes. I've once forgot to launch my spaceship upon completting it and only noticed that something was amiss on the next turn. I was not particularly upset about it, it still was ~1050 AD Space. Besides, this is about the most friendly community there is and there is nothing to be afraid of by exposing your mistakes or lack of knowledge or judgement.
     
  16. Major Tom

    Major Tom Immortal

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    I don’t spend much time micro city tiles. I just whip. Job done.
     

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