Discussion in 'Civ3 - Succession Games' started by Elephantium, Sep 1, 2013.
Hey, I had it for two weeks while LK150 ate my life I'm not going to cast any stones!
it looks like we need to get a lot smarter first, but that means we must research to Arty as fast as possible. it will be hard to beat up spain with cav alone, because by then they will have Inf as defenders in there core. I would make peace with spain, and buy them into the Byzantine war immediately and get us a science farm over there in Byzanz. Then we should go to arty asap and then rail and bomb them to oblivion.
Several options of things to do.
1. Eliminate Spanish homeland and leave her final city alone on the other continent.
2. Make peace asap and then go after Bayz.
While it is possible to attack both at once, it is not wise. We need to commit to attacking one and focus on the other later. With that said we *can* attack Bayz's chokepoint and focus on just holding it until Spain is dealt with. It would be difficult to pull off however.
Perhaps the best option is to eliminate Spain on her home continent - or at least reduce her control over it. She will probably give us a tech or gold for peace when we are winning the war. Then we can focus on eliminating Bayz.
One of my wilder schemes is to make peace with Theodora, abandon our cities over there and then let her boot our armies off her soil onto ours.
Almost seems like an exploit....but given how often the AI abuses us humans with their trespassing settler pairs, I can live with it.
I'm in favor of signing peace ASAP and focusing on the Byzantines (and Alex, if Theodora leaves anything left. She's quite the man-eater: that's why we love her! :lol).
Spain isn't going to be a runaway AI. Once the Byzantines are gone, we can easily deal with her.
So, we buy off The Wife, while we keep plenty of 'lawyers' in Heliopolis, Pi-Ramsesses, London and other places, and continue our thrashing of The Fling.
We can do that.
Its still Bobs turn, isn't it? Or did I miss something?
Elephantium - just played
CommandoBob - Playing?
Kulko - on deck
Sorry for the delay. Playing now.
Make kissy-kissy with Isabella and thrash Theodora.
2 Part Two 1260 AD
We make peace with Spain for 200 of 225 gold and 36 of 198 gpt.
Crank science to 40%, Physics in 4, +46 gpt, 25 gold.
Move 2 vPikes into Pi-Ramesses.
Move Archer out of Pi-Ramesses onto mountain 2E of Pi-Ramesses. This lets us spy on Spain a bit and later it could allow us a way to slip units overland to London. Not easily, mind you, but from this tile we could move units into a Spanish mounatin tile and the next turn move them northwards into neutral land once again.
Six rocks thrown and two hit. Two Muskets defend.
eSamurai dodges a trebuchet, whallops the wounded vMusket and promotes to *SamuraiOfNicaea 1260AD* and we discover Tojo (4 of 4, 1 of 1e, 1 MGL).
Great. First attack we get an MGL while we are stuck deep in enemy territory.
Followup eSamurai stumbles into a trebuchet, and barely does a hit point on the 3/4 Mukset before it dies in shame (4 of 5).
Next eSamurai faces no rocks and chops down the 2/4 Musket (5 of 6, 1 of 2e, 1 MGL).
We gain a slave and then raze the city, gaining 5 more slaves. And two trebuchets.
We are still inside Bzyantiums cultural borders.
We move all our goodies under our Army, now at 8/13 and let the Army heal some more.
It is not much, but I feel better.
And now I remember I had mentioned keeping the city and selling everything in it and then abandoning it. Well, too late now.
Move Third Army towards Pi-Ramesses.
Start mountain road 1E of Giza.
Mine the mountain 1S of Kyoto.
Seven slaves outside Hastings move 1NW, mountain to mounatin.
Start a mounatin mine 2SW of Giza (12 slaves, 3 turns).
Replace mined grasses with wet grasses around Giza. Needs more food.
Hire a geek in Nara.
Spain gets up in our face because we left a little toy boat in the bathtub. Man! What did we ever see in her that we liked? Nag, nag, nag.
Spanish troops march vigorously around, spending our hard earned cash among the backwaters of England.
3 1265 AD
Throw rocks at passing Longbow overseas and let vSamaurai have a few swings and try to go elite. Longbow wilts but no promotion (6 of 7).
Wake settler and 3 vSamurai, move onto coastal forest.
Army (11/13) continues to heal.
Back home, Third Army arrives at the chokepoint 1N-1NE of Heliopolis and fortifies.
We reinforce around Heliopolis and Pi-Ramesses.
Ship chain is shaping up.
Slaves escape Spain.
Mine the Incense hill 2NE of Memphis.
Hire a geek in Sado.
Hire two geeks in Kyoto.
Edo: vMusket -> vMusket in 4.
Yokohama: vSamurai -> vSamurai in 7.
Shakespeare's Theater is built in Madrid, Spain.
4 1270 AD
Overseas, we build Firelfy. Start a harbor.
Tojo becomes Fourth Army 1270 AD.
It is filled.
Stack of Doom with Trebs and Cats moves towards Naissus.
Place slaves to road between Firefly and New Satsuma.
Road the mountain 1S of Kyoto.
A second source of Saltpeter is connected outside Chartres and outside our borders.
Byzantine Knights appear.
Memphis: barracks -> courthouse in 10.
Zaragoza: Worker (Spanish) -> Worker (Spanish) in 10.
5 1275 AD
Greece is down to 8 cities. They had 10 at the start of this turnset.
Bzyantine Knight 1W of New Satsuma (hill).
Name all unnamed Caravels, 100 to 108.
Fourth Army draws its first blood on the Byzantine Knight (7 of 8).
Ship across 5 Samurai and 1 settler into New Satsuma.
Snipe another Knight near New Satsuma (8 of 9).
Are kept busy.
Drop science to 10%, Physics in 1, +139 gpt, 160 gold.
vSamurai promotes by defeating Bzyantine Knight without breaking a sweat (9 of 10).
Physics -> Theory of Gravity in 22 at 10%.
Smith's Trading Company is built in I Hated Her.
I Hated Her: Smith's Trading Company -> vSamurai in 4.
Nagoya: vSamurai -> vSamurai in 4.
Nara: vSamurai -> vSamurai in 6.
Sapporo: vCaravel -> vCaravel in 8.
Spain is building Newton's University.
6 1280 AD
Raise science to 60%, Theory of Gravity in 7, +3 gpt, 299 gold.
One Byzantine Knight 1N of New Satsuma (hill).
Build a colony on the Saltpeter by Chartres with a French slave.
We sell Saltpeter to Greece for his World Map and 11 of 11 gold. This is just to keep him around as a punching bag for Theodora for a little while longer.
Newly promoted eSamurai blindsides the Byzantine Knight at New Satsuma and promotes again; *SamuraiOfNewSatsuma 1280 AD* and Hirohito (10 of 11, 2 of 3e, 2 MGL).
Hirohito becomes Fifth Army 1280 AD.
Fourth Army (8/13) heals inside our borders.
We park 1NW of Naissus and negate their river defense bonus.
Road mountains around Alexandria.
Mine the mountain 1E of Giza.
Lost a Caravel to a Privateer that belongs to 'Nobody'. Isabella knows nothing about them, of course.
Tokyo: vSamurai -> vSamurai in 5.
7 1285 AD
None, but some that want to.
Eight rocks thrown; three rocks hit.
Lead off with an eSamurai eyeing a 2/3 Musket. Longbow appears and hides and lets the Musket do the dieing (11 of 12, 2 of 4e).
Second eSamurai sees, seeks and destroys 2/4 Musket and goes bonkers and becomes *SamuraiOfNaissus 1285 AD* creating Fujiwara (12 of 13, 3 of 5e, 3 MGLs).
vSamurai drools at the thought of battling the Longbow and drowns them with their excessive slobber (13 of 14).
We keep Naissus for the moment.
We sell the Marketplace for 25 gold.
Fujiwara becomes Sixth Army 1285 AD in Firefly. This gives us 4 Samurai Armies overseas.
Fifth Army is loaded up in New Satsuma.
Fourth Army smashes vKnight (14 of 15) and then heads towards Chalcedon, to pillage the only source of Iron on this continent.
Fifth Army stomps a Longbow (15 of 16).
Ship across 1 Samurai and 2 Pikes. Swap out Pike for Samurai for Ani's defense. Ship 2 Samurai and 1 Pike into New Satsuma.
Load Sixth Army in Firefly.
The road from Firefly to New Satsuma is complete.
Start a tree farm at New Nara to keep those slaves busy.
Improve a mined grass to a watered grass at Sapporo for better growth.
Osaka: vSamurai -> vSamurai in 6.
Edo: vMusket -> vMusket in 4.
Quiet 3 resisters in Naissus and the people riot. Too much happiness? All non-resisters become clowns.
Shut up a cranky in Zaragoza.
8 1290 AD
With four armies to play with I don't feel the need to be restrained by catapults and trebuchets.
Fourth Army arrives on the single Byzantine Iron resource.
Fifth Army (8/13) heals inside enemy borders.
Ship chain can handle 6 units per turn. We send across 3 (Samurai, catapult and cannon).
Disband catapult in New Satsuma towards harbor, 18 to 13 turns.
Two armies and 10 Samurai are headed towards Adrianople.
Sell the barracks in Naissus for 5 gold.
Samauri -> Byzantium.
Musket -> Spain.
Start a mountain mine 1E-1SE of Giza.
Move slaves onto forest near Firefly.
Rush harbor in New Satsuma for 52 of 334 gold.
Firefly: harbor in 26 -> barracks in 16.
satsuma: vSamurai -> vSamurai in 7.
New Satsuma: harbor -> settler in 30.
Giza: courthouse -> vMusket in 10.
Nagasaki: vSamurai -> vSamurai in 8.
Another complainer in Zaragoza shuts up.
9 1295 AD
Fourth Army pillages the Iron and then pillages around Chalcedon.
Jaynestown is built 1NE of the ruins on Naissus, on the same river.
eSamurai removes Bzyantine Knight on the way to Adrianople (16 of 17, 4 of 6e, 3 MGLs)
Move next to Adrianople.
Ship across settler and 2 Samurai.
Fifth Army moves towards Sardica.
Disband catapult in Zaragoza; worker in 6 -> 1. Might even get rid of last resister.
Road the ruins of New Kagoshima.
Plant more Christmas trees outside New Nara.
Start two mountain roads around Izumo.
Start forest chop and road in the forest 1NE of Firefly.
Longbow gets lucky and offs a vSamurai (16 of 18).
I Hated Her: vSamurai -> vSamurai in 4.
Kagoshima: vSamurai -> vSamurai in 9.
Nagoya: vSamurai -> vSamurai in 4.
Resistance in Zaragoza ends.
Zaragoza: worker (Spain) -> worker (Spain) in 10.
10 1300 AD
TWO unit Army loses 7HP squashing vMusket (17 of 19).
eSamurai is repulsed by rMusket (17 of 20).
Sixth Army is barely bruised in stepping on rMusket (18 of 21).
eSamurai skewers 2/3 Musket (19 of 22, 5 of 7e, 3 MGLs).
We keep the city for now. We gain 3 slaves.
Sell the markets and barracks.
eSamurai slams 1/4 Longbow that got lucky on the IBT (20 of 23, 6 of 8e, 3 MGL).
Serenity is built on a hill 3NW of Firefly.
Fourth Army pillages 2 cows around Chalcedon.
Fifth Army mangles rMusket (21 of 24).
And then snuffs out a Spear (22 of 25).
We keep the town for now. We gain 2 slaves.
It has nothing to sell.
Fifth Army is out of movement, so it stays in the city.
Send the slaves towards New Satsuma.
Send Sixth Army (12/13) and 6 vSamurai towards Constantinople.
No ship chain this turn.
Start a mountain mine 2NW of Izumi.
Three slaves in Adrianople move to the sugar hill 1E of Serenity.
And the save is attached.
Byzantium 1300 AD
We have had very good luck with our leaders, generating three this round in less than 10 Elite wins. These MGLs became the Fourth, Fifth and Sixth Armies. They have been a great help to the war effort overseas. Along with TWO unit Army, we have 4 armies marching around in Bushido glory, ready and eager to trample Theo and Alex into the ground.
Our next MGL should become the Pentagon.
We have captured four Byzantine cities and abandoned two of them. Adrianople should be abandoned after this turn. We kept it strickly for easier movement. Sardica we can keep; its flip risk is minimual at size 1.
We have pillaged the only known source of Iron on the Byzantine continent. Most of the Byzantine forces are out beating up on Greece, who have dropped from 10 to 6 cities this turnset. With no Iron, the best Greek unit is the Longbow. We are sending them Saltpeter but they haven't built their first Musket yet. Longbows and Spears, defending against Knights. No wonder they are crumbling.
We have a smallish stack, 1 Army and 6 Samurai, headed towards Constantinople. It will take them two more turns to arrive due to the hills around the city.
Fourth Army has pillaged around Chalcedon. I was thinking that it could team up with Fifth Army, now in sardica, to take down Chalcedon.
TWO unit Army is headed to Serentity to heal.
We have a forest chop that completes this IBT to help build our first barracks over here in Firefly.
Adrainoples flip risk ranges from 15% to 30%. We can handle a flip/retake scenario if we want to.
We have Horses near Adrianople. We don't need Horses until we get Military Tradition. We can handle Byzantium with Samurai with no problem.
If we could assemble two stacks of doom, each having 2 Armies and 6 or so Samurai, we can grind up Byzantium and Greece with no trouble. Not very quickly, but fast enough, especailly if we raze or sell/abandon anything we capture.
When Spain unleashed her Cavalry upon us, we quickly made peace. That is good for another 12 turns.
We learned Physics and started on Theory of Gravity, due in 3. We bypassed, for now, Military Tradition, since we did not have a source of Horses at the time.
Overseas, we built Firefly, Jaynestown and Serenity.
Jaynestown has a storied history.
Link to video.
Link to video.
Ship chain is in place from French Fries to Ani and Ani to New Satsuma.
We will be able to ship chain 3 Samurai next turn.
We built a Saltpeter colony near Chartres and then sold it to Greece.
We have a decent line of defense up north around Pi-Ramesses.
Worker Tasks/Actions (From SW to NE)
1E of Serenity: 3 slaves to road sugar hill; no defenders and not a problem due to surronding terrain.
1NE of Firefly: 4 slaves chopping (completes this IBT) and 3 slaves roading (which may complete this IBT if the chop finishes first); vSamuria defends.
1N of Satsuma: 2 slaves from Sardica; vSamuria defends.
2N of New Osaka: 1 worker, spacebarred.
1N-1NE of New Osaka: 3 slaves, spacebarred.
1E of New Edo: 1 slave, roading a tundra forest.
1W-1NW of Grenoble: 1 slave, chopping.
1N-1NW of Grenoble: 1 slave, roading a tundra forest (Silks).
1S of Sapporo: 1 slave, walking.
1NW of Sapporo: 1 slave, turning mines into irrigation.
2SE of I Hated Her: 18 slaves, fortified.
1E of I Hated Her: 3 workers, fortified.
1N of Izumo: 6 slaves, mountain road.
1NE of Izumo: 6 slaves, mountain road.
2NW of Izumi: 18 slaves, mountain mine.
1S of New Nara: 9 slaves, planting trees (Silk).
1S-1SE of New Nara: 1 slave, roading the ruins of New Kagoshima.
01 Catapult (captured)
06 Army (Samurai)
02 Trebuchet (captured)
Current Units: 145
Allowed Units: 134
Support Costs: 011 gpt
Theory of Gravity in 3 at 60% science, +13 gpt, 331 gold.
We had 22 wins in 25 attacks, won 6 of 8 Elite attacks and generated 3 MGLs out of those 6 wins.
CommandoBob - just played
Kulko - UP!
LKendter - on deck
Kulko, do you need a skip?
Yes, Sorry for the late notice, I wanted to post several times, but always something came up.
In the queue, and amazed I finally got a timely email notification from Civ Fanatics.
1300 AD (0)
Looking at industrial cities while we still have two techs to go adds to the "fun".
WOW - our people are impressed with Greek culture and they only have 6 cities. That is pitiful for our empire size.
I don't see war possible with Spain before rails. Our empire has too many potential spots for her to land.
1305 AD (1)
We clear the stack that built up by Adrianople without any losses.
1310 AD (2)
Adrianople has no buildings, and 8 resistors. I abandon it and replace it with Davrosville.
(IT) We lose a Samurai to a Byzantine cavalry .
1315 AD (3)
(IT) The Byzantine razed Davrosville costing us three samurai.
1315 AD (4)
Davoros Revenge Samurai is formed giving us the pentagon.
I am putting this hold to get feedback. IMO this situation is a total cluster. I can't fight knights, yet alone cavalry, when have virtually zero muskets in the field.
I want to make peace immediately with the Byzantine and hold off any more wars until we get a long stronger (rifles + rails).
I am also struggle with our landing point, as there are to many ways to come at it.
This game was played under a bad assumption that we could wipe the world with just Samurai. We were really cheap on infrastructure, are falling behind in tech, and are to spread out. My feeling is we are to the punt point, stop war for a while, get rails (the big human advantage), along with rifles, and start back up.
Blast. I thought we could make some progress on Byzantium with our Armies and supporting Samurai. Didn't occur to me that we might face Cavalry from two sides.
Your plan sounds good. Pay off the fling, get our house in order and then start throwing lawyers and lawsuits at the wifey and her new best friend.
Your plan sounds good to me.
If we're spreading ourselves thin then there's nothing wrong with pausing the wars, building up our forces, getting new tech, and attacking again. We have plenty of time before the mandatory retirement period.
I'll get back to this late Friday or Saturday to wrap up my set.
Peace with the crazy woman will be signed.
Separate names with a comma.