silverbullet
King
If I don't here otherwise from pigswill, I will play it tonight or tomorrow morning.
UNGY-04 Who do they think they are?
- Thread starter ungy
- Start date
pigswill
fly (one day)
I'm back in Blighty but working the weekend so I'll happily slot in after silverbullet.
Nice going Rusten.
Shaka went to friendly in 880 so I can't imagine he is going to attack us.
I'd be inclined to go paper-edu and see if we have a shot at lib. Nothing wrong with those techs anyway--by then we ought to be able to trade our way to guilds+eng.
I agree with getting a galleon over to the island and scouting it out with an eye to settling/conquest there. I'd be up for farming a HE unit which might very well be possible--we should get a couple of units over there asap.
We can probably delay a strategic plan another set but pretty soon we should be looking at one.
Shaka went to friendly in 880 so I can't imagine he is going to attack us.
I'd be inclined to go paper-edu and see if we have a shot at lib. Nothing wrong with those techs anyway--by then we ought to be able to trade our way to guilds+eng.
I agree with getting a galleon over to the island and scouting it out with an eye to settling/conquest there. I'd be up for farming a HE unit which might very well be possible--we should get a couple of units over there asap.
We can probably delay a strategic plan another set but pretty soon we should be looking at one.
silverbullet
King
Some micomanagement questions before I begin:
1) Do we really need a ball court in Calakmul? We have chopped 30 hammers, I was thinking it would be better to use them for market (it has good commerce) or forge (better whipping of infrastructure). We already have 3 hapiness surplus there
2) Do you think it's better to whip a marketplace now or later in chichen itza?
3) I think Uxtmal would be a good place to build a Galleon on the next turn. If we are pretty sure that Shaka is not going to war, I could immediately take 1 catapult and 2 macemen there, to start creating HE unit.
Cities on the island will help us, since we still have
4) I assume that we don't want to give astronomy away as long as we have a monopoly. This gurantees that all of Shaka's trade routes go to us.
1) Do we really need a ball court in Calakmul? We have chopped 30 hammers, I was thinking it would be better to use them for market (it has good commerce) or forge (better whipping of infrastructure). We already have 3 hapiness surplus there
2) Do you think it's better to whip a marketplace now or later in chichen itza?
3) I think Uxtmal would be a good place to build a Galleon on the next turn. If we are pretty sure that Shaka is not going to war, I could immediately take 1 catapult and 2 macemen there, to start creating HE unit.
Cities on the island will help us, since we still have
4) I assume that we don't want to give astronomy away as long as we have a monopoly. This gurantees that all of Shaka's trade routes go to us.
1) Switch to an observatory--astronomy just came in. Science buildings are better than gold buildings. Either that or forge -> observatory.
2) Don't need the market that much as we'll get gold for selling maps soon, but it speeds up the observatory so feel free. That city has a lot of food to grow back too.
3) Yes, get a galleon and settle that island. (Currently) there's no barbarian city stopping us from peacefully settling clam+gold.
4) Definitely.
2) Don't need the market that much as we'll get gold for selling maps soon, but it speeds up the observatory so feel free. That city has a lot of food to grow back too.
3) Yes, get a galleon and settle that island. (Currently) there's no barbarian city stopping us from peacefully settling clam+gold.
4) Definitely.
silverbullet
King
Played 7 turns and there is something we need to discuss:
1100 AD - Joao demands optics. I refuse
Joao made peace with Toku
1120AD trading world map around. Also selling fur to WK for 10 gold.
Optics+world map+ 41 gold to Napoleon for Feudalism.
request a gift of 40 gold back from him
I choose to research philosphy next so I can trade guilds and engineering with Shaka and Napoleon.
1130 AD Toky demands world map, I refuse.
1140 AD engineering from Charlie for paper+philosophy.
1150 Charlie asks us to declare on Joao. I refuse (to avoid -1 with WK).
1170AD We need to stop and discuss this:
I think Shaka is going to attack us after all.
I didn't play this turn yet, but I started changing our production in the attached save - switched most cities to build maces now, and slider to 100% gold to upgrade our axes.
Shaka just unloaded his 3 galleys in our borders and is going to fetch some more troops.
I think that if we cancel open borders now, his troops will be kicked back to his island, but if he goes further inland, they will end up on the south of our island, so I suggest we cancel open borders now.
I hope this won't cost us the liberalism race - as you can see WK is busy with constitution for the next 7 turns so we can do education-liberalism.
1100 AD - Joao demands optics. I refuse
Joao made peace with Toku
1120AD trading world map around. Also selling fur to WK for 10 gold.
Optics+world map+ 41 gold to Napoleon for Feudalism.
request a gift of 40 gold back from him
I choose to research philosphy next so I can trade guilds and engineering with Shaka and Napoleon.
1130 AD Toky demands world map, I refuse.
1140 AD engineering from Charlie for paper+philosophy.
1150 Charlie asks us to declare on Joao. I refuse (to avoid -1 with WK).
1170AD We need to stop and discuss this:
I think Shaka is going to attack us after all.
I didn't play this turn yet, but I started changing our production in the attached save - switched most cities to build maces now, and slider to 100% gold to upgrade our axes.
Shaka just unloaded his 3 galleys in our borders and is going to fetch some more troops.
I think that if we cancel open borders now, his troops will be kicked back to his island, but if he goes further inland, they will end up on the south of our island, so I suggest we cancel open borders now.
I hope this won't cost us the liberalism race - as you can see WK is busy with constitution for the next 7 turns so we can do education-liberalism.
I'm not sure shaka is coming after us tough I can't be sure. I guess getting some money for emergency upgrades (or deficit research in case of no dow) is fine. Shaka still hasn't met any other civ? By the looks of it we have a peace treaty with him. How long will it last? Since we have feudalism we should be able to defend ourselves properly. Also some knights (we don't have guilds tough, right?) might be useful as shaka mostly has (CR) maces.
BTW how's the situation on that nearly uninhabited island?
I'm sorry I don't have more accurate comments but I'm having pc issues and can't play civ at all. Please put me on autoskip until further notice. Sorry guys...
BTW how's the situation on that nearly uninhabited island?
I'm sorry I don't have more accurate comments but I'm having pc issues and can't play civ at all. Please put me on autoskip until further notice. Sorry guys...
silverbullet
King
Shaka has not met anyone else yet.
Nap and Charlie have guilds but they won't trade it.
Our peace treaty with Shaka is because we gave him optics at the end of Rusten's set. It will expire in 3 turns.
Nap and Charlie have guilds but they won't trade it.
Our peace treaty with Shaka is because we gave him optics at the end of Rusten's set. It will expire in 3 turns.
pigswill
fly (one day)
We're still in slavery so we can whip a few units as required. Maybe crossbows and pikes rather than maces; we can get maces by upgrading our existing axes.
Our power rating is pathetic so that's not so good. There's a hill on our island that's still outside our borders so shaka's units could get moved there, or down south, or homeland. I'm not sure where they'd go. I suspect they won't get booted back to Zulu territory from their current positions.
We could try another trade deal for another peace treaty.
Our power rating is pathetic so that's not so good. There's a hill on our island that's still outside our borders so shaka's units could get moved there, or down south, or homeland. I'm not sure where they'd go. I suspect they won't get booted back to Zulu territory from their current positions.
We could try another trade deal for another peace treaty.
I agree Shaka's behavior is very puzzling but it would be contrary to my understanding of the AI if he were planning an attack and I'd almost want to see it happen.
We clicked friendly in 880--6 turns before the end of my set. Then most of Rusten't set with no movement--seems like unless I'm out to lunch on how this all works if we were going to be attacked due to the AI in war mode prior to friendly it would have happened on Rusten's set.
It's more likely that Shaka's stack was set to move to the former barb city--which Shaka learned 2 turns ago was ours and that order did not get countermanded.
We could build a few units just in case--anyone know where they would bounce if he declared or we closed borders?
If we build a castle and put a few LB in Uxmal I don't think we have anything to worry about there--it's just going to be impossible to defend against a bounce to the S. We could build an iceball city there (not a total loss with trade routes and fur) to stop the S bounce but he could still bounce to the E.
How does the water affect the culture bounce?
We clicked friendly in 880--6 turns before the end of my set. Then most of Rusten't set with no movement--seems like unless I'm out to lunch on how this all works if we were going to be attacked due to the AI in war mode prior to friendly it would have happened on Rusten's set.
It's more likely that Shaka's stack was set to move to the former barb city--which Shaka learned 2 turns ago was ours and that order did not get countermanded.
We could build a few units just in case--anyone know where they would bounce if he declared or we closed borders?
If we build a castle and put a few LB in Uxmal I don't think we have anything to worry about there--it's just going to be impossible to defend against a bounce to the S. We could build an iceball city there (not a total loss with trade routes and fur) to stop the S bounce but he could still bounce to the E.
How does the water affect the culture bounce?
Dresden
Emperor
- Joined
- Jul 10, 2008
- Messages
- 1,081
If the unit has to bounce to another continent, the distance is multiplied by 3, which means you're pretty much screwed. Any of Shaka's units which are on the two tiles West of Uxmal will be bounced back to his island. But anything in Uxmal or further East will be bounced down to the southern ice (or over to the desert if they're really far East.)
If you manage to get culture on the three ice tiles before the bounce, then the borderline moves a whopping two squares. Units one tile East of Uxmal will get bounced to Shakaville but anything further East will wind up in the Eastern desert.
The following picure approximates the situation:
One other option is that if he bounces because he declared, then your units will block him as well as your culture. So if you get units (even workers) on the 3 ice tiles and the 3 desert tiles and then he declares on you, he'll get completely ejected back home. That won't work if you simply cancel open borders because both your units will be allowed in the same tile.
Thanks Dresden.
We should occupy those six tiles.
I think we're about to pop culture on 2 of them if I remember correctly.
Another thing we can do is to beg once the peace we have runs out.
As long as Shaka is attacking us from his island we're fine. He'll crash on Uxmai.
Again, I find it hard to believe that he could have been in war mode all this time but best to cover our flank.
pigswill
fly (one day)
So keep open borders with Shaka but occupy all tiles on our island outside our cultural boundaries. May be worth looking at our cities to see if we can speed up culture to seal our island faster.
don't forget to beg. If that is successful, that's 10 more turns and it's easy to fill the 5 remaining tiles (one will go to culture pop).
Again, I'd bet it's a stale map barb city venture but not worth the risk.
silverbullet
King
Oh sorry for the misunderstanding, I only paused for advice, I didn't mean to pass the game yet.
I have already played 3 more turns.
I will post my summary shortly.
If you can't wait and want to know what happened:
I have already played 3 more turns.
I will post my summary shortly.
If you can't wait and want to know what happened:
Spoiler :
silverbullet
King
Played until 1210.
I switched most cities that have barracks to build an army, and made sure to cover all non-culture tiles with our culture. It was REALLY close, because it took me 3 turns to get units there, and Shaka declared exactly in 3 turns (After peace treaty). Didn't have a chance for additional begging.
With all our tiles covered Shaka's units bounced back to his island.
I counted 6 galleys for Shaka, so it means he can land 12 units at one time.
I decided to build a few more catapults so we can weaken his SOD if needed, although with a castle in Uxmal it might not be as important.
BTW, I noticed that I made a stupid mistake with the galleon going to our new island. I forgot to send a worker with the expedition. I sent a caravel with a missionary and a galleon with a settler and a maceman.
On the tech side thinks seem good we have education and I think we should start liberalism (leave 1 turn until WK gets there).
WK is teching faster than us, but he is going to constitution and will probably go to democracy next, so that gives us time to try to get steel from liberalism. We could also try to go printing press->scientific method and grab communism from lib, so we can build the kremlin. This route will also let us settle the new island without worries about colonial expenses.
If we want to kill Shaka now, we should go for steel, if we want to have peace with him we should probably aim for communism.
I think this is a good time to discuss our winning strategy.
I switched most cities that have barracks to build an army, and made sure to cover all non-culture tiles with our culture. It was REALLY close, because it took me 3 turns to get units there, and Shaka declared exactly in 3 turns (After peace treaty). Didn't have a chance for additional begging.
With all our tiles covered Shaka's units bounced back to his island.
I counted 6 galleys for Shaka, so it means he can land 12 units at one time.
I decided to build a few more catapults so we can weaken his SOD if needed, although with a castle in Uxmal it might not be as important.
BTW, I noticed that I made a stupid mistake with the galleon going to our new island. I forgot to send a worker with the expedition. I sent a caravel with a missionary and a galleon with a settler and a maceman.
On the tech side thinks seem good we have education and I think we should start liberalism (leave 1 turn until WK gets there).
WK is teching faster than us, but he is going to constitution and will probably go to democracy next, so that gives us time to try to get steel from liberalism. We could also try to go printing press->scientific method and grab communism from lib, so we can build the kremlin. This route will also let us settle the new island without worries about colonial expenses.
If we want to kill Shaka now, we should go for steel, if we want to have peace with him we should probably aim for communism.
I think this is a good time to discuss our winning strategy.
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