Up for an expansive game?

[Folket]

Well, the resource part of the code was quite messy so perhaps I miscalculated the value of copper. Perhaps I missed something else.

Also if Hyana does not have copper it is five times as valuable.

But unless I have made a mistake the city will give us +2 from fair trade with Hyana. Let us build a settler and find out.

 

[Folket]

Hum adding a bit on this still: to get AI cities without catapults (variant), one needs tech leverage (like cuirassiers against longbows)... and it's not going to happen without unis or big cities running scientists under pacifism.

So while I could live without unis right away, imo we need to start growing cities and improve the land to run scientists. (so peace is really a priority, I hope we can buy it )

So you are voting for my plan to get univs and start oxford?

If we get a fist on Hyana we should bribe Izzy to end the war and start a new one.

 

[Doshin]

It won't be difficult to Lib MT without Universities. We can currently research Paper in 3 turns; one GS can bulb Education, a second Liberalism. Music and Nationalism will take a while, but our BPT is doing ok.

Tech trading is limited on our continent due to the religious blocs, and Taoism was founded here (so the other continent, with fewer AIs, will not have access). So we have a very good head start on Lib.

Universities require 5-pop to whip (i.e. at size 10) with a Forge, or 4-pop (i.e. at size 8) in OR. Forest chops can help with this, but they should really be saved for Forges and Cuirassiers. Without Stone, Oxford will also take forever to build (400H ). We can, OFC, begin to whip Universities in a few locations. But the focus should be upon keeping HC happy (or keeping us safe, if he begins to plot) and preparing for a Cuirassier rush.

I would not mind gambling on Music, btw. We could enter a GA, switch into Caste, generate some quick GSs in the capital, and then switch into OR to build infrastructure before the war. At worst, we have one more tech on the road to MT.

 

[Doshin]

Also, if we do miss out on the GA, Music will still let us build the Sistine Chapel for fail gold with our Marble (although the Marble should still be sold right now).

 

[Folket]

ok,

I ready to play tomorrow. No comments on trying to trade for machinery from Ragnar? Is Feudalism just preferred?

Gamble on Music, get few universities. Build forges. If I launch a GA with GA if cities are in a nice position to starve out GS.

 

[pigswill]

Machinery does mess up lib bulb and LBs are pretty decent defensive units.

 

[Folket]

Machinery does mess up lib bulb and LBs are pretty decent defensive units.

Thanks, a very good argument, just what I needed.

 

[RRRaskolnikov]

@Folket: I was mainly voicing the fact our cities remain quite small for our objectives. Stating the obvious is my thing

I am in line with Doshin: forges are more needed than unis as we should be able to bulb our way toward lib and MT. They will also help with the military build up.

And what pigswill said: bypass machinery

I am in a general agreement with the rest of what have been discussed (I just hope it's not a left over effect from wine ).

Good luck for the set

 

[Folket]

Sorry, somehow I just managed to forget about this game. but I can play now.

 

[pomthom]

lol

Good luck!
(going to bed, should be able to comment tomorrow)

 

[Folket]

As I started looking at the feudalism trade. It does not seems possible to get feudalism and metal casting.

I'm leaning towards CS and literature for MC and 100 gold. But the team really wanted feudalism so I would like to hear what they say.

 

[RRRaskolnikov]

Since I can't see the game, I say your call. Not taking feud is a gamble but I am not sure we can build enough troops in case HC attacks anyway

edit: I'll be home the first in the evening, then I'll have a civ comp again.

 

[Folket]

I went for MC.

175 AD
We get GS, someone build the notre dame. Isabella gets a great prophet and starts a golden age.

200 AD
We get great artist from music.
Hyana declared war on Isabella as Ragnar becomes his Vassal.
Hyana has settled copper so we are unable to gift him the city.

I think this is a good time for a short stop. Our settler could either settle a filler city at our wine or liberate a city in the SE to Isabella. I prefer to lliberate a city to Isabella turning her friendly. We can then trade for sailing from Ragnar and calendar from Isabella. After education we can choose to tech/trade compass to allow us to bulb liberalism.

I suggest we just build a second settler now as well.

 

[pomthom]

Ragnar vassaling to HC is annoying but not surprising and a relief with respect to an unwanted DoW to us.


I agree Settler would be best used to liberate a city to Isabella and get her Friendly now. Agree also on building another Settler.

Before discussing bulbing Lib what is our Lib target? We have Horses so MT is kinda cool but is it realistic?

 

[Folket]

It think we are good on libing MT but we loose at most two turns by libing nationalism and it is very secure.

I'm quite defensive so I prefer nationalism.

 

[Doshin]

I don't think we need to gift a city to Isabella. We are not yet at +8 relations from the religion, and she won't declare war in the near future. A generous tech trade will be enough to bring her to Friendly.

A few suggestions: Code of Laws should be traded to Ragnar (for Organized Religion + whatever), before HC gives it to him. Ragnar almost won Music, btw (it's not often that you can win the GArtist after beelining Civil Service on Deity ). The Silver city should work the Silver to speed up the Work Boat; Awesome Venn should borrow the Wheat and whip a Forge in a turn. Assign a Scientist in The Evidence to the Grass farm and grow.

I would also err on the side of caution and Lib Nationalism, because a head start on the Taj Mahal is a good compensation for the loss of . If an AI on the other continent has already built Notre Dame without a GE then they are clearly teching quite well. There is likely a Confucian love-fest on their side of the globe.

What do you guys think about starting a GA in a turn or so? After whipping away some unimproved tiles, we could switch into Caste System for 5 turns and try to generate a GScientist and a GMerchant in The Evidence. We would then switch back into Slavery and Organized Religion while gearing up for a Cuirassier war.

We have one GS for Education, so we only need one more for Lib.

 

[fyermind]

Just found this. This has been a fantastic reading as my civ computer charger just died. (no more civ during lunch breaks at work!)

Anyway new year's resolution to read more of these.

 

[Folket]

Just found this. This has been a fantastic reading as my civ computer charger just died. (no more civ during lunch breaks at work!)

Anyway new year's resolution to read more of these.

Welcome. I hope we can continue to entertain.

 

[Folket]

Played four more turns.

250 AD
Isabella builds the Hagia Sophia.

300 AD
Hyana captures Mycenian from Isabella.

325 AD
Isabella got a great prophet.
Gave Poisoned Fruit to Isabella and she is now friendly.

I made a mistake and did not make a trade with Ragnar before I liberated a city to Isabella. He now refuses to trade with us.

Looking at our situation I think we can have MT in 10 turns. By getting two more great scientists. We could selftech compass and nationalism. Then use two GS to bulb education and one to bulb liberalism.

The other continent has engineering but the AI is usually quite slow about education. Being only 3 AIs unless they are friendly they will be stuck monopolizing their techs.

I suggest we sell music to Isabella for calendar, gold and world map. Then we sell our world map to the other two. Selling our world map to Isabella once she has some gold again.

 

[Thrar]

lurker's comment:
Didn't you get Machinery earlier? I don't think you can bulb Lib if you have it, since the GS will give you PP first. Or did you already get that too?