v 26, and above ALL Bugs/Crashes reporting thread

Hydromancerx said:
@C2C Team

Can someone please fix the problem in the Clockpunk and Dieselpunk folders so we can turn those mods back on?
Click to expand...

Where's the thread with the problem for them?
 
Has anyone else noticed the washed out marsh looking tile display when wheat, barley, horse, etc are displayed before being worked. The regular wheat and barley display is gone now and even after you farm it it's still pretty ugly. You can't even really tell there is a farm there.

1st screenie is Barley with a farm
2nd screenie is a hill with potatoes yet to be farmed. Mounted Infantry sitting on the hill guarding it.

JosEPh
 
I am still finding examples of whatever bug is allowing more promotions than should be allowed. I have attached a save game that was using SVN 3714. In this save game, there are two different promotion weirdnesses:

  • There is a Caravel near the Philippines that is eligible for a promotion. I was able to promote it to Navigation II + Seamanship I + Seamanship II + Seamanship III.
  • There is a stack of Crossbowmen and Longbowmen in northwest Canada, 1 square NW of Porto Alegre. If you upgrade all the Longbowmen to Arquebusier, six of them will be eligible for promotion, even though they shouldn't be (most have 16 XP, and need 17 for their next level). Despite not having Combat I, four of them will show eligible for Combat II and can be promoted all the way to Combat VI. The other two can promote all the way to City Raider IV plus another promotion.
 
Vokarya said:
I am still finding examples of whatever bug is allowing more promotions than should be allowed. I have attached a save game that was using SVN 3714. In this save game, there are two different promotion weirdnesses:

  • There is a Caravel near the Philippines that is eligible for a promotion. I was able to promote it to Navigation II + Seamanship I + Seamanship II + Seamanship III.
  • There is a stack of Crossbowmen and Longbowmen in northwest Canada, 1 square NW of Porto Alegre. If you upgrade all the Longbowmen to Arquebusier, six of them will be eligible for promotion, even though they shouldn't be (most have 16 XP, and need 17 for their next level). Despite not having Combat I, four of them will show eligible for Combat II and can be promoted all the way to Combat VI. The other two can promote all the way to City Raider IV plus another promotion.
Click to expand...

If this is a game that was played under versions of the combat mod prior to a couple of days ago, the turns played then would have provided 'hidden experience' to certain units, which manifests this way when they are NEXT eligible for a real promotion.

Can you reproduce it in a game that has never been saved under the suspect versions? This cold be either a pre-combat mod game save, or a game started under the past couple of days. If not then it's probably a residual effect of running with the broken interim versions.

@TB - the issue here is retrain points that have been mis-applied to units in older versions of the game. Should we just zero out any retrain points in saves that predate a recent rev on load?

On a related point - I find retrain points rather confusing, because from a user's perspective they are entirely hidden in the UI, and just appear to result in promotions that inexplicably consume no experience. Rather than have retrain points added when promotions are taken away (that are intended to be replaceable), why not just reduce the unit's recorded spent experience points. That would have the same functional effect as the retrain points with three advantages:
  1. No need to store the extra state that is required (ie the retrain pints themselves)
  2. Visibility in the UI - when you lose a promotion you're displayed spent xp drops, so it is clear why you are able to promote
  3. Because the xp spent drops, you are immediately over the trigger level to choose a new promotion, so instead of having to wait for the next time you'd get a 'natural' promotion, you get to retrain at once when you lose the one that has obsoleted
 
Koshling said:
If this is a game that was played under versions of the combat mod prior to a couple of days ago, the turns played then would have provided 'hidden experience' to certain units, which manifests this way when they are NEXT eligible for a real promotion.

Can you reproduce it in a game that has never been saved under the suspect versions? This cold be either a pre-combat mod game save, or a game started under the past couple of days. If not then it's probably a residual effect of running with the broken interim versions.

@TB - the issue here is retrain points that have been mis-applied to units in older versions of the game. Should we just zero out any retrain points in saves that predate a recent rev on load?

On a related point - I find retrain points rather confusing, because from a user's perspective they are entirely hidden in the UI, and just appear to result in promotions that inexplicably consume no experience. Rather than have retrain points added when promotions are taken away (that are intended to be replaceable), why not just reduce the unit's recorded spent experience points. That would have the same functional effect as the retrain points with three advantages:
  1. No need to store the extra state that is required (ie the retrain pints themselves)
  2. Visibility in the UI - when you lose a promotion you're displayed spent xp drops, so it is clear why you are able to promote
  3. Because the xp spent drops, you are immediately over the trigger level to choose a new promotion, so instead of having to wait for the next time you'd get a 'natural' promotion, you get to retrain at once when you lose the one that has obsoleted
Click to expand...

Okay, clearly I have no idea what is going on. What are "retrain points"? I actually started this game at the end of July, so it's been through many SVN upgrades. From what you're saying, I guess it is the saving under different changes that is causing this issue.
 
Koshling said:
If this is a game that was played under versions of the combat mod prior to a couple of days ago, the turns played then would have provided 'hidden experience' to certain units, which manifests this way when they are NEXT eligible for a real promotion.

Can you reproduce it in a game that has never been saved under the suspect versions? This cold be either a pre-combat mod game save, or a game started under the past couple of days. If not then it's probably a residual effect of running with the broken interim versions.

@TB - the issue here is retrain points that have been mis-applied to units in older versions of the game. Should we just zero out any retrain points in saves that predate a recent rev on load?

On a related point - I find retrain points rather confusing, because from a user's perspective they are entirely hidden in the UI, and just appear to result in promotions that inexplicably consume no experience. Rather than have retrain points added when promotions are taken away (that are intended to be replaceable), why not just reduce the unit's recorded spent experience points. That would have the same functional effect as the retrain points with three advantages:
  1. No need to store the extra state that is required (ie the retrain pints themselves)
  2. Visibility in the UI - when you lose a promotion you're displayed spent xp drops, so it is clear why you are able to promote
  3. Because the xp spent drops, you are immediately over the trigger level to choose a new promotion, so instead of having to wait for the next time you'd get a 'natural' promotion, you get to retrain at once when you lose the one that has obsoleted
Click to expand...

Its odd that the retrain points have been retained like this but I think tonight's adjustment will fix the whole structure in that regard. I can take another look at the xp spent drop method but I found it a bit confusing as to how it could be applied correctly as the math varies by the level the unit is at. After my adjustment tonight, let me know if you still feel its necessary to tweak it to work along those lines.

I'm not sure that it will be necessary to zero out retrains from previous versions. The step from gaining a retrain point on having a promo obsoleted to being told you have a promotion to select (via glow) is immediate. So I don't think we can really undo the majority of flaws that may have been caused unless the player wishes to revert to a save prior to the combat mod inclusion entirely. Such is the penalty of playing on the SVN I suppose. Once the promotion is reselected, there is an immediate elimination of the retrain point. However, I'm thinking the order in which promotion selections are made in the code between retrain selections and normal selections may be causing trouble when a retrain AND a normal promo selection is available at the same time. I'll take a look at that right away.

I do wonder if quite a bit of recursion took place with assignments of free promos that shouldn't have been assigned in the first place and for some games it could be useful to just zero out like you said, but I'm not quite sure myself where to safely do that... perhaps on recalc? Certainly not in doTurn! And if I'm not mistaken, the init segment in CvUnit is only called when the unit is created, right? I'm not sure where it initiates the units at the beginning of a session.

@Vokarya, You really shouldn't have ever encountered reason to need to know yet but Retrain points are a feature of the combat mod that allows you to reselect a promotion that has been lost due to obsoletion. However, on review, and observation of these bugs, it has become clear that free promos need to be omitted from inclusion in being able to be retrained if lost. I didn't realize how frequently such freebies would be obsoleted as a matter of course through the code and how many problems it would create to allow them to be retrained when lost.
 
Thunderbrd said:
Its odd that the retrain points have been retained like this but I think tonight's adjustment will fix the whole structure in that regard. I can take another look at the xp spent drop method but I found it a bit confusing as to how it could be applied correctly as the math varies by the level the unit is at. After my adjustment tonight, let me know if you still feel its necessary to tweak it to work along those lines.

I'm not sure that it will be necessary to zero out retrains from previous versions. The step from gaining a retrain point on having a promo obsoleted to being told you have a promotion to select (via glow) is immediate. So I don't think we can really undo the majority of flaws that may have been caused unless the player wishes to revert to a save prior to the combat mod inclusion entirely. Such is the penalty of playing on the SVN I suppose. Once the promotion is reselected, there is an immediate elimination of the retrain point. However, I'm thinking the order in which promotion selections are made in the code between retrain selections and normal selections may be causing trouble when a retrain AND a normal promo selection is available at the same time. I'll take a look at that right away.

I do wonder if quite a bit of recursion took place with assignments of free promos that shouldn't have been assigned in the first place and for some games it could be useful to just zero out like you said, but I'm not quite sure myself where to safely do that... perhaps on recalc? Certainly not in doTurn! And if I'm not mistaken, the init segment in CvUnit is only called when the unit is created, right? I'm not sure where it initiates the units at the beginning of a session.

@Vokarya, You really shouldn't have ever encountered reason to need to know yet but Retrain points are a feature of the combat mod that allows you to reselect a promotion that has been lost due to obsoletion. However, on review, and observation of these bugs, it has become clear that free promos need to be omitted from inclusion in being able to be retrained if lost. I didn't realize how frequently such freebies would be obsoleted as a matter of course through the code and how many problems it would create to allow them to be retrained when lost.
Click to expand...

Well, I hope what I provided helps. if it's a problem that is limited to SVN updates, then I can let it go. This is my first game that I let the difficulty go all the way up to Deity, so I'll chalk this up as a slight counterbalance. I don't think of it as a perfect game anyway - I didn't realize how important crime control is now, and I didn't realize the Tengri-Circus Maximus connection (I am an EXTREME Wonder-holic when I play). It might actually make it worthwhile to keep and upgrade some offensive military units instead of replacing them from the West Point + Heroic Epic + multiple Heroes/Great Colonels city.
 
Vokarya said:
Well, I hope what I provided helps. if it's a problem that is limited to SVN updates, then I can let it go. This is my first game that I let the difficulty go all the way up to Deity, so I'll chalk this up as a slight counterbalance. I don't think of it as a perfect game anyway - I didn't realize how important crime control is now, and I didn't realize the Tengri-Circus Maximus connection (I am an EXTREME Wonder-holic when I play). It might actually make it worthwhile to keep and upgrade some offensive military units instead of replacing them from the West Point + Heroic Epic + multiple Heroes/Great Colonels city.
Click to expand...
That's a big part of 'the point'. It may, however, after some open debate to come on the next Introduction to the Combat Mod segment, become a Combat Mod Bug Option or be made to only function on Infinite XP. Just depends on what the public here thinks of the feature.

Zerli said:
I started a thread in main C2C forum about not being able to found religions in v26p1 (no SVN).

Please have a look at the original thread here (save attached there):

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=475883

Having no religions in game of any kind is a bit of a showstopper.

Zerli
Click to expand...
Not a problem. I should find this rather easy to debug this weekend if I can find time around some visitors coming to town.

Sgtslick said:
Game crashes when I end turn.
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, I'm out of time tonight to address that...
 
About 30 errors on the PromotionLine??? Attached are just a FEW:sad:


EDIT: I think i found the solution:

I deleted all the files that were in the Cache Folder, next to the Assets folder, and now it didn't pop-up with any errors


EDIT EDIT: See bottom of last attachment??
 
Hello,

The poultry resource is to big, and looks like some rocks or something like this, i sugest the poultry resource have half of this width. Its looks better and realistic.
 
shenryyr said:
v26p1

the game is non-MAF crashing every few turns now, around 150bc. they don't appear to be repeatable, it just happens after maybe 30 minutes of playtime. how do you read these minidump files anyway? I'd love to know what is happening to cause me to not really be able to play in this stage of the game.
Click to expand...

Was this with viewports enabled?

Also how advanced are you?? It **looks** like a bug in air unit automation!! Is that even possible?
 
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