Venice can easily get cities with MoVs. On top of that, they are fully developed cities and you get a lot of units as a bonus. So if you never anger the AI, you can just keep sending your trade routes to civs with highest culture output and eventually win the game with tourism. Taking out a single civ with a high culture output at the end may help, but for the majority of the game it's best to just stay in good relations with everyone.
MoVs aren't free, city-states are terrible at developing their cities, and city-states are usually spread out making them impossible to defend.
On the other hand you just let your neighbor expand straight into you, you can pick off his cities, puppet them and have a somewhat more compact empire.
You're of course welcome to play the game however you want, but a lot of people would disagree with the fact that Venice is meant to be played in permanent peace.
In my opinion, taking anything but tradition as the first social policy tree for Venice is sub-optimal. Growing a powerful capital is a necessity for Venice and tradition gives you by far the best tools for that. It even gives you a precious merchant specialist, and +15% great person rate, so you'll get MoVs faster. I can understand authority being attractive because of the free MoV, but the other policies just pale in comparison with tradition. And when you can just peacefully buy new cities, there is very little reason to ever go to war.
I think you're underestimating Authority. It's not only for the free GM, the combat bonus and science from kills are both pretty relevant. Reduced maintenance cost and buying Landshenks/Mercs are both great for a Civ who's going to be warring the whole game. Kind of a shame that the bonus for puppeted cities got moved to Imperialism, but overall I think Authority is a very strong Policy for them
MoVs aren't free, city-states are terrible at developing their cities, and city-states are usually spread out making them impossible to defend.
On the other hand you just let your neighbor expand straight into you, you can pick off his cities, puppet them and have a somewhat more compact empire.
You're of course welcome to play the game however you want, but a lot of people would disagree with the fact that Venice is meant to be played in permanent peace.
I'm not saying they are meant for permanent peace, but it's a really viable playstyle. City states actually seem to be generally better developed than regular AI-cities. And the fact that your empire is spread out does not matter if you never go to war. AI does not care about you buying city states, and because you don't settle, you are never going to anger anyone. Just keep a big enough army so that warmonger civs don't have the guts to target you. MoVs are not free for sure, but they are not actually rare either. You can actually just buy every single city-state if you want to. Just keep working max merchant specialists in your capital and it works out fine.
I think you're underestimating Authority. It's not only for the free GM, the combat bonus and science from kills are both pretty relevant. Reduced maintenance cost and buying Landshenks/Mercs are both great for a Civ who's going to be warring the whole game. Kind of a shame that the bonus for puppeted cities got moved to Imperialism, but overall I think Authority is a very strong Policy for them
I am not underestimating authority, I am questioning Venice's need for conquest. If you are warring the whole game, then definitely authority is a good choice. I just don't see the point of doing so as Venice. Peace just seems superior to me. Each to their own I guess
MoVs are not free for sure, but they are not actually rare either. You can actually just buy every single city-state if you want to. Just keep working max merchant specialists in your capital and it works out fine.
Buying a city-state with a MoV is really expensive. First of all, you lose out on a MoV, a GP that can be popped for a metric ton of gold + a bunch of influence with the city-state of your choice along with 20 turns of WLTKD in all your cities, that's a lot of lost resources.
Second, removing city-states from the map hurts you (and everyone else) by leaving less city-states to play with. You're also way more likely to ally city-states close to you (as they might actually be defendable) which once again hurts your diplogame.
I quite love the Doge Palace, boring or not, it helps establish quite well. I guess it could be too good, but absolutely not interested in a UB that increases Faith in the not-Ancient-Era or makes me target six specific cities.
Haven't tried Venice with all the new changes, but at least by the old rules they were my favorite civ, and I do nothing but war. Build units while everyone else build settlers, get some extra units from MoV annexing, and then start taking advantage of having the best puppets in the game. And if one actually wars, Authority is an awesome policy. Disagree with you there. Currently on pace to get my first ever Immortal win playing this way.
Buying a city-state with a MoV is really expensive. First of all, you lose out on a MoV, a GP that can be popped for a metric ton of gold + a bunch of influence with the city-state of your choice along with 20 turns of WLTKD in all your cities, that's a lot of lost resources.
Second, removing city-states from the map hurts you (and everyone else) by leaving less city-states to play with. You're also way more likely to ally city-states close to you (as they might actually be defendable) which once again hurts your diplogame.
Once you get to medieval era, you'll be making so much gold with your trade routes, that you don't need to conduct trade missions for money anymore. WLTKD is nice and allying the city state is nice, but at this point you'll get much larger benefits by buying the city state for yourself. And it really doesn't matter if there are less city states to play with, because as you said, it hurts everyone else just as it hurts you.
How about a Unique Harbor which increases yields on internal Trade Routes and increases city defense or maybe gives bonus XP to naval units made/purchased in the city.
Since Venice can choose what buildings the puppets build, they are no longer hampered by AI build-order choices and can have a legit UB.
How about a Unique Harbor which increases yields on internal Trade Routes and increases city defense or maybe gives bonus XP to naval units made/purchased in the city.
Since Venice can choose what buildings the puppets build, they are no longer hampered by AI build-order choices and can have a legit UB.
The value of internal trade routes goes down steeply later in the game and extra city defense feels kind of lackluster, but some interesting promotions and exp for naval units could work I feel it needs something else as well though.
To be honest, I'm happy with anything that replaces the palace and doesn't suck heavily
They could get a unique market, and the Arabian UA could be shifted to the Library. Not really sure what this market would do, but a Harbor sounds really late.
They could get a unique market, and the Arabian UA could be shifted to the Library. Not really sure what this market would do, but a Harbor sounds really late.
They could get a unique market, and the Arabian UA could be shifted to the Library. Not really sure what this market would do, but a Harbor sounds really late.
Crusader's Outpost
+1 Gold
+10% of this city's gold is added to science (this is what regular market is, right?)
+ Has Merchant slot (Woot MoV)
+ Cost of purchasing units in this city is reduced by 10%, if this city is a puppet gain an additional 10% off.
Fits Venice's theme of making money and funding the 5th Crusade.
Crusader's Outpost
+1 Gold
+10% of this city's gold is added to science (this is what regular market is, right?)
+ Has Merchant slot (Woot MoV)
+ Cost of purchasing units in this city is reduced by 10%, if this city is a puppet gain an additional 10% off.
Fits Venice's theme of making money and funding the 5th Crusade.
This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
