Hello everyone. I have been reading these posts and it is great to know that people in this world still actually think!! (I had written off most of humanity as unthinking and apathetic.)
I would like to state for the record that I am a (proud) American citizen. I do not let that pride blind me to the facts. I am conscious of the fact that Europe has a great deal to be proud of. Europe has given the world things like the ideals of the Enlightenment, the Scientific Revolution, the Industrial Revolution, and the like.
I would also like to state that I like the majority of Europeans I have met, some get on my nerves, but then so do some Americans. Overall, most of the Europeans I've met are decent, average, hardworking people (not any better or worse than your average American).
The reason for this entire post is to correct a few errors made in a previous post by Vanrozenheim. I am not "picking on you". I am just correcting a few errors.
vanrozenheim said:
- America got into WWII not in order to free France or help GB, but because Germans have torpedoed and sank some of biger ships near England and a lot of american passengers drawnd.
Point of Fact: The US had no intention of going to war in Europe. We, the US, entered the Second World War ONLY in the Pacific Theater in response to Pearl Harbor. It was not until several days later that we entered the North African and European Theaters of war. And then we only enter them due to the fact that Nazi Germany (followed shortly thereafter by Fascist Italy) declared war on us first! Had the declarations of war by Germany and Italy not taken place, it may have been several months or years until Roosevelt could have made a good enough case before Congress to drag us into "a European war". (Remember that before Pearl Harbor there was a very strong isolationist movement in America). If the real reason for entering the European Theater was the German interdiction of shipping, the US would have entered the war as early as 1940.
- Japan began the war against America (WWII) due to the fact, that american expansion in South-East Asia threaten its shipment routes and the supply with oil. Japan never threatened Americans at their homes and never prepared to land in San Francisco. Unnesessary to mention, that at the very first contact to an American ship Japanes politely refused any contact and were then bombarded as a sign of a good will. In 1945, despite of Japanese will to surrender on terms (since February-March), US Goverment refused any talks and insisted an a termless capitulation. The followed extinction of Hiroshima and Nagasaki by nuclear bombing were absolutely unnecessary from military point of view and are untill now the most awfull examples of war crimes.
Point of Fact: The Japanese started the war in the Pacific (against the US) because the felt they had to in order to preserve their industrial resources, in specific oil and steel. Up until 1941, the US had been selling the Japanese oil and steel. During 1941, we suspended the sale of oil and scrap steel to the Japanese as a protest against their aggression in China. The Japanese, who were short of resources, felt that the only way of securing the strategic resources they needed was to both attack the Dutch East Indies (for oil and other resources) and to attack the US fleet at Pearl Harbor to prevent its intervention in the East Indian attacks.
You state that the first ship sunk in the conflict between Japan and the US was Japanese. I would like to know where you got your information. I would also like to know how you account for the attack on the USS Panay in China on 12 December 1937?!!?
You further state that the Japanese were ready to surrender in February/ March 1945. If that is so, then how do you explain that in February and March of 1945 the Japanese were still putting up fierce resistance in the Phillipines and on Iwo Jima? This is not even to mention that the Invasion of Okinawa was still to take place (1 April 1945), and the Kamikazee attacks had not yet started. Furthermore, if the Japanese were so willing to surrender in Feb./ Mar. of 1945, why did they reject the "Potsdam Ultimatum" issued by the US, UK, and China on 25 July 1945 (Japanese rejection on 30 July 1945)??
The bombing of Hiroshoma and Nagasaki, in retrospect, may have been unnecessary. But then we have the luxury of hindsight. And, as they say, hindsight is always 20/20. In August 1945, Truman didn't have that luxury. He was told by the War Department that an invasion of Japan would result in around 1 million casulties for US forces. When faced by the prospect of a Japanese foe that, despite having its war making capacity devastated, was extremely reluctant to surrender, AND taking roughly 1 million casulties, Truman opted to drop the A-bomb. Was this a war crime? Perhaps in your eyes, but given the same set of circumstances, if I were the C-in-C, I'd have taken the nuclear option also.
- The war in Vietnam with millions of dead Vietnamese should be present to every American, but seems already forgotten. Any reparations were never paid.
That is simply because the Vietnamese never fulfilled their end of the Paris Peace Accords. The stipulation was made, and agree to by the Vietnamese, that the whereabouts of all American POWs and MIAs had to accounted for before any reparations would be paid. This accounting had to be done to the satifaction of the American government. It was never done and subsequently no reparations have been paid.
- The military putsch in Argentina (Pinochet) was supported by CIA as well as many similiar putsches in Africa, were beginning democracies were destroyed with american help due to financial and military interests of United States.
The putsch/coup you speak of actually took place in Chile, not Argentina. These coups were orchestrated by the CIA in accordance with the policy of containment. The policy of containment was very simple, to contain communism whenever and wherever it broke out. This policy is what (indirectly) led to US involvement in the Korean War, the Vietnam War, a myriad of "proxy wars", and the US support of the Mujaheddin(sp?) in Afghanistan in the 1980s. The policy of containment was also known as the "Truman Doctrine" after Harry Truman who first put it into practice.
Should I continue? The Taliban in Afghanistan with all their weapons and terroist training camps were supported by US-Goverment in the 80ties; Saddam Hussein and Oliver Noriega were best friends of US in former times. The sad truth is, that many of US goverments never cared a bit about democracy or freedom in the world. They were very often talking about this, but their ruled an the contrary.
As for the Taliban, see my previous comment. Yes, in the 1980s, Saddam Hussein was a "friend" of the US, but only because we had an active anti-Iranian policy at the time (due to the "Hostage Crisis" that had taken place in Tehran in 1979) As for Manuel Noriega (his name was Manuel, not Oliver), yes, at one point he was another "friend" of the US, but his drug importation business ran afoul of our anti-drug policies, and subsequently he was "arrested" (if you can call a full scale invasion an arrest!??!).
Now it might sound like I am picking on you, but I am not. I merely corrected a few inaccuracies that you had in you post, so don't getting all bent out of shape about it! As for this "ignorant" American, I have picked up a history book or two. As a matter of fact, I've picked up about four years worth (BA-History, U of Pittsburgh '97). And (if all goes well), in two or three years, I will probably be picking up at least two more years worth of history books (I'd really like to get my MA, no one takes you seriously with only a BA!).
To the moderator: I apologize for this OT post, but I just have a thing about historical inaccuracies. Sorry about that.
Napoleon is not dead !! I didn't know that Europe was french !! Very good news !!! ![[offtopic]](/images/smilies/offtopic.gif "Offtopic [offtopic]")
but I can't resist to answer you a last time ... USA were , if I good remember, different states which allied themselves together... Some states were french like ... Louisiane.. It's the same for France , I live in south of France and this area was not french 500 years ago ... Same for Germany... Italy ... United Kindom ..etc .. This is the walk of history that little states ally and become bigger ...Personnally I believe in the future global human Union .. It's the only way for us to survive and to turn ourself to a new target : the Space ...
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