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Warlords patch

Discussion in 'Civ4 - General Discussions' started by alexman, Oct 23, 2006.

  1. petey

    petey Prince

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    This makes the Vikings a bit weaker. Right now, you can give all their ships Nav II out of the gate with either Theocracy or Vassalage and have them run circles around everyone else on a water map, but now you'd have to run them both and have a GG in a coastal city in order to get that. I guess that evens out their power, but it was fun to have.

    I like the changes to the Gaellic Warrior, since it gives the Celts a UU that's actually different from what it's replacing, but it's still not really all that different and Woodsman I for the Jags makes them pretty powerful, since you now have a Swordsman that can get two movement in enemy borders and there's always a lot of Forests and Jungles around while they're active.

    I would have liked to have seen a change to the Vassalage that they couldn't capitulate to someone else while at war with you, or at least give that as an option during start-up. Without a ZOC, forts are still pretty useless, so I can't see myself building one anytime soon.
     
  2. JimMac99

    JimMac99 Warlord

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    Patch list looks good, :goodjob: except I dont see anything about fixing the 'Barbarians not building ships' change since Warlords... or have I just been un/lucky in the half a dozen Warlords games I've played? :confused:
     
  3. Memphus

    Memphus Deity

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    Although harder to perform it will still definetly be possible, can't wait to try to find the way to do it :)
     
  4. jray

    jray King

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    Yeah, it's a bug. I don't know whether it's a hard-core bug (strictly impossible to get barbarian ships) or just the result of a severe XML change of barbarian ship spawn rates... but I've seen it confirmed now from enough people to believe it's for real. FYI, there are a couple existing threads on the topic:

    did they remove barbarian ships in Warlords?

    WARLORDS:No Barb Ships bug?
     
  5. namliaM

    namliaM Deity

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    Dont know if this has been spotted... but ...

    :lol:
     
  6. jray

    jray King

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    My favorite fix!! This was having a devastating effect on AI civs... so watch out now, the AI will seem a lot stronger after this patch!

    Second favorite... no more Ramses running around all game with Vassalage/Theocracy and no religion :).

    Cool, now the Leadership promotion is worth considering.

    I'm not a big fan of this one, since it penalizes civs without Oil or Flight.

    Both excellent... I like changes that make the traits more distinctive.

    How do Gunpowder units and obsoletion apply here? I like the enhancement regardless though.

    This is nice, so that you can use barbs to get it again.

    Sweet! It's now worth consideration... previously a military specialist was clearly preferable.

    Good balance for the almighty Chariot barb-buster.

    I'd prefer to have +50% production AND food for workers (same with Imperialistic/Settlers). Even more so for workers though... in the early game, when worker production speed is most important, you're not going to have many good high-hammer tiles. Even if you have forested hills, those have no commerce. Maybe it's just me, but I pretty much always derive my crucial workers from unimproved flood plains and seafood tiles.
     
  7. Murky

    Murky Deity

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    Looks good. People are going to have to figure out something besides the CS slingshot now. I guess there's still the MC slingshot that isn't too bad.
     
  8. WTBCzero

    WTBCzero Warlord

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    Oct 14, 2006
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    My thoughts:

    (1) CS Slingshot (getting Civil Service with the oracle) is now out of the window.

    (2)Macemen will now come later in the game, so the 'early war' stage (fighting with Axemen etc) will last a bit longer.

    (3) Chariots will no longer be elite barbarian killing machines. Looks Axemen will be needed for barbarian busting, too.

    (4) You will no longer know you're general location in the world in the first turn.

    (5) Using the Great Wall and Pyramids to spit out Great Engineers will be much less effective.

    (6) Walls and Castles are now worth building.



    Pity they didn't fiddle with Chichen Itza, though. A free wall in every city would be better than it's current effect.
     
  9. Murky

    Murky Deity

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    I think the main effect of killing the CS slingshot and making walls/castles better is that it will increase the need for an early rush with axemen.
     
  10. Pudd'nhead

    Pudd'nhead Chieftain

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    Wow, this was a much more expansive list than I expected the patch to cover, to wonder it took a little while. I'm a more casual gamer, don't play as much & haven't micro-tuned my strategies like a lot of the ohter posters to this thread clearly have (haven't used a "slingshot" since elementary school!), but let me say yay for one thing no one else has mentioned:

    >Vassal cannot own plots within the city radius of his master's cities unless those plots are closer to his own cities.

    It's a small, obscure thing most probably never even thought about the consequences of, but you don't forget it if you've ver had to deal with it. Thanks for this little tweak as well as all the big ones, and the continued post-release support.
     
  11. marioflag

    marioflag History Addict

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    In the Patch it seems that Imperialistic has been strenghtened not weakened.
    In Marathon Games GG will be harder to get so having 100% GG points means that their importance has been increased.
    A.E. before to get general 100xp=50 xp with imperialistic so you get a discount of 50xp
    now 150xp=75xp so you get a discount of 75xp to get a general.

    There is a negative thing which is Generals are HARDER to get but considering also that Generals have been totally strenghtened with new leadership promotion and military academy more powerful, Imperialistic remains a powerful warmongering trait.

    One thing which i don't understand is if leadership promotion gives you doubling xp points based on XP points when the general was attached to unit or it just doubles XP point you have in the moment you choose the promotion.
    In the latter case it can be really unbalancing considering also that GG will give you 20 xp to a unit.So if you add 20xp from general + xp unit already had and double it you can easily have a unit with 60-70xp which is HUGE.I really hope they didn't do that mistake
     
  12. drkodos

    drkodos Emperor

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    Leadeship doubles the xp points you receive AFTER the promo. You cannot then add a 2nd GG to the unit for more xp, so its a non-issue. It just makes future promotions come quicker.
     
  13. Axil

    Axil Prince

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    Stables going obsolete on discovery of gunships - possibly one of the worse changes I've ever seen that I can remember plus it makes absolutely no sense what so ever. Cavalry still tend to be more useful (city capture for a start) than gunships until armoured vehicles start appearing so having that option is good if your still fighting riflemen etc - I find in that situation Cav seem to win more than gunships. I don't think gunship get extra xp from stables anyway so why obsolete them.

    Barbarians not able to build wonders sucks also - one of my favorite moments in warlords so far has been when I captured a barbarian city that seemed a little better developed than most to find they'd managed to build a wonder in it - it just made me smile.

    Finally the patch isn't addressing the ONE MAJOR PROBLEM to do with the game code it self - MEMORY ALLOCATION FAILURE - please please if there's only one thing done in the patch FIX THIS
     
  14. Thedrin

    Thedrin Deity

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    But you can add a great general to a unit sharing a tile with the leadership unit to give it 20 points. Scenarios aside, I can't think of a time when I would ever use two warlords. I rarely use one.
     
  15. Gyathaar

    Gyathaar Warlock Retired Moderator GOTM Staff

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    You missed the part about GG point caps being the same in all speeds now except marathon.. to be exact.. quick, normal and epic now needs as many points was was needed on normal before, and marathon is now the same as epic was before
     
  16. marioflag

    marioflag History Addict

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    I play only marathon games so i don't know how much points to get a GG were needed on other speeds.On marathon if i remember well to get 3 GG i needed 90/180/315 points.
    With the new patch how much points i will need to get a GG on marathon?
     
  17. drkodos

    drkodos Emperor

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    Yes, but even in this case it does not kick in all 20xp points to the previously Warlorded unit. I believe that when there are multiple units in a tile it allows you to choose what promotion a unit gets, but not what units get the promotions.
     
  18. Thedrin

    Thedrin Deity

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    The free XP are divided up evenly. Create a wralord on a tile with two units gives 10 XP to both. If one of those is already a warlord with the leadership promotion ...

    Except that on further examination leadership only gives bonuses to XP gained in combat.
     
  19. TAfirehawk

    TAfirehawk WoC Team Manager

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    That is what modders are for :goodjob:
     
  20. pholkhero

    pholkhero Deviant Mind

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    I think you'll find with the change to the GGs generation, Imperialistic leaders should focus on war ~ use those GGs for forging high-promotion armies!

    also, what does "Qin/Kublai Swap" mean?? switch traits??
     

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